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I'm with Robert here - I don't own an eBook reader and don't enjoy reading off computers nearly as much as paper. Is the best option to buy a PDF and get it pri

by mctx 14y ago

I'm with Robert here - I don't own an eBook reader and don't enjoy reading off computers nearly as much as paper. Is the best option to buy a PDF and get it printed and bound at a local print shop?

lutusp 14y ago
> Is the best option to buy a PDF and get it printed and bound at a local print shop? This might make sense at first glance, but in many cases it's a technical violation of copyright. When you buy a PDF, you're buying the right to read it, not reproduce it.
- DenisM 14y ago
  Fair use?
  - lutusp 14y ago
    Fair use only applies to relatively short quotations as part of a review, literary criticism or parody. It doesn't apply to a complete copy.
    - whyleyc 14y ago
      That interpretation of fair use is too narrow - there is precedent for for copying whole works, it is the context in which they are used which determines infringement. A fair use defence of printing a copy of a PDF for personal consumption would probably hold up fine, in the same way that the Audio Home Recording Act establishes that it is legal in some circumstances to make copies of audio recordings for non-commercial personal use.
      - lutusp 14y ago
        > there is precedent for for copying whole works ... Yes, true, but that is not what is called "fair use". http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fair_use http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fair_use "Fair use is a limitation and exception to the exclusive right granted by copyright law to the author of a creative work. In United States copyright law, fair use is a doctrine that permits limited use of copyrighted material without acquiring permission from the rights holders. Examples of fair use include commentary, search engines, criticism, news reporting, research, teaching, library archiving and scholarship. It provides for the legal, unlicensed citation or incorporation of copyrighted material in another author's work under a four-factor balancing test." > A fair use defence of printing a copy of a PDF for personal consumption would probably hold up fine, in the same way that the Audio Home Recording Act establishes that it is legal in some circumstances to make copies of audio recordings for non-commercial personal use. Again, yes, but you're describing another appropriate exception, not "fair use".
      - hereNT 14y ago
        You can't distribute it, but you certainly can print pages for yourself from an ebook. You can't distribute that, but if you bought it then you can back it up. The same with most software and music. You can't distribute, but you can create copies to prevent your own loss. A printed copy prevents against loss in the case of loss of any digital playback device.
- whyleyc 14y ago
  Where's your citation for this or is it just pure speculation ?
  - lutusp 14y ago
    Consider what happens to the copy unless the copier promptly burns it. Yes, that's right, it will be passed on to a new reader. No citation needed -- that's a violation.
    - whyleyc 14y ago
      Nonsense - that's like saying you aren't allowed to buy a kitchen knife because you might stab someone with it.
      - lutusp 14y ago
        Ah, so, in your world view, it's all right to make copies of, and pass on, copyrighted works. Welcome to reality.
        whyleyc 14y ago
        Actually you suggested that copied works would be redistributed - I was addressing the parent comment which covered the notion of printing a PDF to personally consume it in paper form. If that action is unlawful I'd wager that 99% of offices around the world would be in breach.
- rmc 14y ago
  You don't even need to get into complex "I haven't bought the right to print it" legal pseudo contracts. Copyright law says you cannot make a derived work without the copyright holders permission. It's not contract law or licencing law you'd be breaking, it's copyright law. I blame EULAs for making people think this is all about contract and not copyright law.
- lemma 14y ago
  I'm not sure this is correct. I believe courts have ruled that you can make copies for personal/backup reasons, but someone with more knowledge would have to back me up here.
  - lutusp 14y ago
    > I'm not sure this is correct. Unless you read, and then promptly burn, the copy, yes, it's correct. The point is that the printed copy might be passed on, at which point it's a clear violation of copyright. > I believe courts have ruled that you can make copies for personal/backup reasons ... These rulings apply to computer media, not printed works.

by mctx 14y ago

I'm with Robert here - I don't own an eBook reader and don't enjoy reading off computers nearly as much as paper. Is the best option to buy a PDF and get it printed and bound at a local print shop?

lutusp 14y ago

> Is the best option to buy a PDF and get it printed and bound at a local print shop? This might make sense at first glance, but in many cases it's a technical violation of copyright. When you buy a PDF, you're buying the right to read it, not reproduce it.

DenisM 14y ago
Fair use?
- lutusp 14y ago
  Fair use only applies to relatively short quotations as part of a review, literary criticism or parody. It doesn't apply to a complete copy.
  - whyleyc 14y ago
    That interpretation of fair use is too narrow - there is precedent for for copying whole works, it is the context in which they are used which determines infringement. A fair use defence of printing a copy of a PDF for personal consumption would probably hold up fine, in the same way that the Audio Home Recording Act establishes that it is legal in some circumstances to make copies of audio recordings for non-commercial personal use.
    - lutusp 14y ago
      > there is precedent for for copying whole works ... Yes, true, but that is not what is called "fair use". http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fair_use http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fair_use "Fair use is a limitation and exception to the exclusive right granted by copyright law to the author of a creative work. In United States copyright law, fair use is a doctrine that permits limited use of copyrighted material without acquiring permission from the rights holders. Examples of fair use include commentary, search engines, criticism, news reporting, research, teaching, library archiving and scholarship. It provides for the legal, unlicensed citation or incorporation of copyrighted material in another author's work under a four-factor balancing test." > A fair use defence of printing a copy of a PDF for personal consumption would probably hold up fine, in the same way that the Audio Home Recording Act establishes that it is legal in some circumstances to make copies of audio recordings for non-commercial personal use. Again, yes, but you're describing another appropriate exception, not "fair use".
    - hereNT 14y ago
      You can't distribute it, but you certainly can print pages for yourself from an ebook. You can't distribute that, but if you bought it then you can back it up. The same with most software and music. You can't distribute, but you can create copies to prevent your own loss. A printed copy prevents against loss in the case of loss of any digital playback device.
whyleyc 14y ago
Where's your citation for this or is it just pure speculation ?
- lutusp 14y ago
  Consider what happens to the copy unless the copier promptly burns it. Yes, that's right, it will be passed on to a new reader. No citation needed -- that's a violation.
  - whyleyc 14y ago
    Nonsense - that's like saying you aren't allowed to buy a kitchen knife because you might stab someone with it.
    - lutusp 14y ago
      Ah, so, in your world view, it's all right to make copies of, and pass on, copyrighted works. Welcome to reality.
      - whyleyc 14y ago
        Actually you suggested that copied works would be redistributed - I was addressing the parent comment which covered the notion of printing a PDF to personally consume it in paper form. If that action is unlawful I'd wager that 99% of offices around the world would be in breach.
rmc 14y ago
You don't even need to get into complex "I haven't bought the right to print it" legal pseudo contracts. Copyright law says you cannot make a derived work without the copyright holders permission. It's not contract law or licencing law you'd be breaking, it's copyright law. I blame EULAs for making people think this is all about contract and not copyright law.
lemma 14y ago
I'm not sure this is correct. I believe courts have ruled that you can make copies for personal/backup reasons, but someone with more knowledge would have to back me up here.
- lutusp 14y ago
  > I'm not sure this is correct. Unless you read, and then promptly burn, the copy, yes, it's correct. The point is that the printed copy might be passed on, at which point it's a clear violation of copyright. > I believe courts have ruled that you can make copies for personal/backup reasons ... These rulings apply to computer media, not printed works.