3 ms·

DHH is definitely a polarizing figure, but this kind of hyperbole (Ethnic Cleansing) definitely harms progressive causes. I get that some people feel strongly

by N_Lens 1mo ago

DHH is definitely a polarizing figure, but this kind of hyperbole (Ethnic Cleansing) definitely harms progressive causes. I get that some people feel strongly about fairness and justice, but I would like them to care just as much about efficacy and being effective instead of just histrionics.

calcifer 1mo ago
> but this kind of hyperbole Looking at the linked DHH posts, which part(s) do you think make "ethnic cleansing" hyperbole? It seems like a pretty fair reading of his wishes to me.
roryirvine 1mo ago
He's written in favour of deporting non-white Londoners, including many of my friends and family - despite them having been born and brought up in the UK and being full UK citizens. Is "Ethnic Cleansing" really such a hyperbolic term for a policy of enforced expulsion based on skin colour? What would you call it instead?
- N_Lens 1mo ago
  DHHs take is definitely not 'sane' and quite extreme. However Ethnic Cleansing has a particular connotation that's more severe than forced deportations. That's what I mean by histrionics. I believe it's a virtue, both in engineering and in politics, to stick to the facts without drama or exaggeration.
  - roryirvine 1mo ago
    As I understand it, ethnic cleansing refers to the forcible removal of a population, where population means a broad group defined by shared race, ethnicity, nationality, or religion. Would you rather it was instead referred to as a wide-scale pogrom? Or some form of genocide? I'm happy to use whatever terminology you want - it doesn't really affect the extreme nature of what he's proposing.
  - aeturnum 1mo ago
    I think you should familiarize yourself with the wikipedia definition of the phrase[1]. It may be helpful to read some examples[2], many of which involve exclusively forced removal. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ethnic_cleansing https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ethnic_cleansing [2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_ethnic_cleansing_campaigns https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_ethnic_cleansing_campa...
- TrnsltLife 1mo ago
  [flagged]
  - defrost 1mo ago
    No ethnic cleansing. June 2025: Is there a genocide of white South Africans as Trump claims? - https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c9wg5pg1xp5o https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c9wg5pg1xp5o August 2026: How white farmers still dominate land ownership in South Africa in spite of land reform - https://theconversation.com/how-white-farmers-still-dominate-land-ownership-in-south-africa-in-spite-of-land-reform-new-research-285507 https://theconversation.com/how-white-farmers-still-dominate... > why the histrionics You'd have to ask Musk and / or Trump - they do like that kind of thing.
  - roryirvine 1mo ago
    Are you saying that 1Password support ethnic cleansing in southern Africa too? Or is this just a clumsy attempt at whataboutery?
  - toomanyrichies 1mo ago
    > why the histrionics when they were welcomed as refugees in the United States? Because white South Africans were the only refugees welcomed this year. [1]. 6500 refugees (down from 100k+ in 2024), and every single one was a white South African. Calling that out is not "histrionics". 1. https://www.rpc.state.gov/documents/Refugee%20Arrivals%20by%20State%20and%20Nationality%20as%20of%20April%2030,%202026.pdf https://www.rpc.state.gov/documents/Refugee%20Arrivals%20by%...
    - roryirvine 1mo ago
      Does anyone seriously disagree that 1Password should not support ethnic cleansing, no matter where in the world it might happen? I don't really understand what you're arguing against here.
      - toomanyrichies 1mo ago
        I'm arguing against TrnsltLife's (now flagged and disappeared) comment. They said it was conspicuous that people are opposing refugee status for white South Africans, but not opposing refugee status for other groups. The point I'm making is that the opposition is about only giving such status to white South Africans, to the exclusion of everyone else.
soraminazuki 1mo ago
He called Romani people slurs and compared them to wolves that should be shot for the survival of the human population, which of course, exclusively refers to white people. How much more explicit would he have to get for you to allow us to condemn his actions for what they are?
- N_Lens 1mo ago
  Fair enough, I didn't know his position was that extreme.
  - antihero 1mo ago
    Well perhaps consider this before speaking my dude. DHH has already written a bunch of pretty horrific stuff and this post was kind of the icing on the cake.
antihero 1mo ago
I mean he bitched publicly that an llm wouldn’t translate his shitty racist article.
antihero 1mo ago
>I get that some people feel strongly about fairness and justice, Yes, as is common for anyone with a shred of decency. > just as much about efficacy and being effective And spoken like a god damn sociopath.

by N_Lens 1mo ago

calcifer 1mo ago

> but this kind of hyperbole Looking at the linked DHH posts, which part(s) do you think make "ethnic cleansing" hyperbole? It seems like a pretty fair reading of his wishes to me.

roryirvine 1mo ago

He's written in favour of deporting non-white Londoners, including many of my friends and family - despite them having been born and brought up in the UK and being full UK citizens. Is "Ethnic Cleansing" really such a hyperbolic term for a policy of enforced expulsion based on skin colour? What would you call it instead?

N_Lens 1mo ago
DHHs take is definitely not 'sane' and quite extreme. However Ethnic Cleansing has a particular connotation that's more severe than forced deportations. That's what I mean by histrionics. I believe it's a virtue, both in engineering and in politics, to stick to the facts without drama or exaggeration.
- roryirvine 1mo ago
  As I understand it, ethnic cleansing refers to the forcible removal of a population, where population means a broad group defined by shared race, ethnicity, nationality, or religion. Would you rather it was instead referred to as a wide-scale pogrom? Or some form of genocide? I'm happy to use whatever terminology you want - it doesn't really affect the extreme nature of what he's proposing.
- aeturnum 1mo ago
  I think you should familiarize yourself with the wikipedia definition of the phrase[1]. It may be helpful to read some examples[2], many of which involve exclusively forced removal. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ethnic_cleansing https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ethnic_cleansing [2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_ethnic_cleansing_campaigns https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_ethnic_cleansing_campa...
TrnsltLife 1mo ago
[flagged]
- defrost 1mo ago
  No ethnic cleansing. June 2025: Is there a genocide of white South Africans as Trump claims? - https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c9wg5pg1xp5o https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c9wg5pg1xp5o August 2026: How white farmers still dominate land ownership in South Africa in spite of land reform - https://theconversation.com/how-white-farmers-still-dominate-land-ownership-in-south-africa-in-spite-of-land-reform-new-research-285507 https://theconversation.com/how-white-farmers-still-dominate... > why the histrionics You'd have to ask Musk and / or Trump - they do like that kind of thing.
- roryirvine 1mo ago
  Are you saying that 1Password support ethnic cleansing in southern Africa too? Or is this just a clumsy attempt at whataboutery?
- toomanyrichies 1mo ago
  > why the histrionics when they were welcomed as refugees in the United States? Because white South Africans were the only refugees welcomed this year. [1]. 6500 refugees (down from 100k+ in 2024), and every single one was a white South African. Calling that out is not "histrionics". 1. https://www.rpc.state.gov/documents/Refugee%20Arrivals%20by%20State%20and%20Nationality%20as%20of%20April%2030,%202026.pdf https://www.rpc.state.gov/documents/Refugee%20Arrivals%20by%...
  - roryirvine 1mo ago
    Does anyone seriously disagree that 1Password should not support ethnic cleansing, no matter where in the world it might happen? I don't really understand what you're arguing against here.
    - toomanyrichies 1mo ago
      I'm arguing against TrnsltLife's (now flagged and disappeared) comment. They said it was conspicuous that people are opposing refugee status for white South Africans, but not opposing refugee status for other groups. The point I'm making is that the opposition is about only giving such status to white South Africans, to the exclusion of everyone else.

soraminazuki 1mo ago

He called Romani people slurs and compared them to wolves that should be shot for the survival of the human population, which of course, exclusively refers to white people. How much more explicit would he have to get for you to allow us to condemn his actions for what they are?

N_Lens 1mo ago
Fair enough, I didn't know his position was that extreme.
- antihero 1mo ago
  Well perhaps consider this before speaking my dude. DHH has already written a bunch of pretty horrific stuff and this post was kind of the icing on the cake.

antihero 1mo ago

I mean he bitched publicly that an llm wouldn’t translate his shitty racist article.

antihero 1mo ago

>I get that some people feel strongly about fairness and justice, Yes, as is common for anyone with a shred of decency. > just as much about efficacy and being effective And spoken like a god damn sociopath.