6 ms·

Just a heads-up for those trying it out, I've found a couple of regressions in Beta 6 that rendered my Haiku system unbootable, until I remembered about hammeri

Just a heads-up for those trying it out, I've found a couple of regressions in Beta 6 that rendered my Haiku system unbootable, until I remembered about hammering the space key during the boot sequence to get to the safe mode menu. In my case, my ThinkPad X1 (Yoga 3rd Gen) used to boot despite what appeared to be kernel panics, but typing "continue" at the kernel prompt would skip past them and everything would then work fine. In Beta 6, it now hangs at boot instead with no kernel panic warning. Disabling ACPI in the safe mode options gets me past that, and there's a way to disable ACPI permanently at boot via some configuration files - though obviously that isn't desirable. It also seems there's been some work on USB Audio (yay!), but it now causes a kernel panic on boot if a Focusrite Scarlett is connected. Turning the Scarlett off avoids the kernel panic. The Scarlett has never officially worked in Haiku, but it at least never used to crash the system. In my case, I've reverted back to the USB Audio Scarlett Haiku driver that Claude Sonnet vibe coded for me, and for me that's working. (I can't contribute that code because of Haiku rules against AI code, but hopefully the humans will eventually find time to hand code it and get it working.)

deleted 1mo ago
[deleted]
LeFantome 1mo ago
I think there should maybe be shadow repositories available for Open Source projects where things like your driver could be contributed. I get why Haiku does not want to deal with it do this is not a criticism. But I have also used AI to port software and create drivers. Others may not have the ability, even with AI. Perhaps I have docs you don’t. And some of it took a reasonable amount of money and time. I am not going to dedicate that to everything I might use if it was available. And in addition to wasting duplicated money and time, we are destroying the earth recreating things others have already done. I use Chimera Linux and I have thought about starting a repo just for the stuff that I have ported. I am not sure what the exact answer is but I hope this is something we figure out.
- tikhonj 1mo ago
  This is one of the things I like with NixOS: it's easy enough to add new packages and patch existing ones that stuff like this can either live in the core nixpkgs repo or be managed through some community-supported overlay. (Great example of this is [nixos-hardware](https://github.com/nixos/nixos-hardware https://github.com/nixos/nixos-hardware) which shares settings and fixes for specific laptop models and the like, or [emacs-overlay](https://github.com/nix-community/emacs-overlay https://github.com/nix-community/emacs-overlay) which has a bunch of extra Emacs-specific stuff that would not belong in the core repo.)
- 0x1d7 1mo ago
  Looks like a user that was porting to ARM64 disagrees with the Haiku AI stance: https://github.com/rcarmo/haiku-arm64-build#haiku-arm64-build-environment https://github.com/rcarmo/haiku-arm64-build#haiku-arm64-buil...
  - selectodude 1mo ago
    Makes sense. I had codex port haiku to arm64. Works decently, fun to play with on my Mac.
    - SpecialistK 1mo ago
      What I'd love to see (but likely lack the skill to, even with Claude Opus) is PowerPC. Haiku would look great on an iMac G4.
      - przemub 1mo ago
        There have been some contributions accepted recently for the PowerPC port, so maybe it will happen! There is a working AI-driven derivative distribution as well. https://github.com/ActionRetro/Tabby-PPC https://github.com/ActionRetro/Tabby-PPC
        SpecialistK 1mo ago
KerrAvon 1mo ago
Haiku should rethink that AI rule. Put very high code quality gates in place, sure, but Haiku in particular is a very low-velocity project and AI could help them so much. There is no reason you can't produce high-quality code with AI conformant to your style guidelines and structural preferences, it just takes a lot more effort than the slop.
- alex_john_m 1mo ago
  What is a high code quality gate? Besides telling the AI it's an expert and to build perfect code?
- LeFantome 1mo ago
  I imagine that their issue is reviewer bandwidth. If all submissions were high-quality, it would probably work. But that is probably unlikely. Maybe the project could host a searchable directory of AI contributions hosted at external GitHub repos or something.
  - hvb2 1mo ago
    > I imagine that their issue is reviewer bandwidth. This feels to me as the real bottleneck in general. Maybe along with thinking through what to code/prompt. I don't need more tokens or automated generation of PRs, I'm already at capacity for the care and understanding I want to have for code I own.
  - SyneRyder 1mo ago
    My understanding is that the AI policy is more to do with issues of copyright and code provenance. They want to make sure that all of their code is cleared with no risk of accidentally using 'stolen' code or GPL code repeated by an AI. I can at least understand the policy. I think there's other opinions around AI use there as well, but I'll back off from that. I didn't mean for my post to become top voted, when we should be celebrating Haiku reaching Beta 6. I'm just disappointed that for me, R1/b6 has been a very big regression, right at a time when I've been using AI to make all the software I write cross-compatible with Haiku via Go & SDL, and even use AI to write drivers so more of my hardware works on Haiku... and instead, now I can barely even boot the system.
jessikat 1mo ago
Feel free to reach out, I will be happy to try help with these issues :)
- SyneRyder 1mo ago
  Will do, I think I recognize your username from the forums :) Life is getting in the way and makes it difficult to write a bug report with the necessary level of detail & logs. But when I can find time, I intend to. I think the ACPI issue is long standing, but I can't find my bug report anywhere in Trac. I'm fairly sure I've made at least one report, I created my Trac account roughly 6 years ago. But I also remember running into issues with Trac, so maybe it never went through.
zX41ZdbW 1mo ago
Maybe share my old article with Haiku developers: https://clickhouse.com/blog/agentic-coding https://clickhouse.com/blog/agentic-coding Could be a small chance, but it has already made many engineers reconsider their AI stance.
- alex_john_m 1mo ago
  It certainly made me reconsider my AI stance. I no longer use subscription based services like your.
- ivolimmen 1mo ago
  I keep a personal list of links to defend my non-AI stance. It is weird I even need to. If I am a carpenter and I was ordered to use a robot and tell it what to do there would be lawsuits and what not but as a software developer I am the idiot that does not want to modernize.
creatonez 1mo ago
> Focusrite Scarlett If it's the one I'm thinking of, this device includes a read-only ~100KiB USB mass storage device filled with .lnk files to remind you to register the device to get your bundled digital goods (a bunch of DAW plugins). You might want to try connecting the interface with Windows and install the focusrite driver. This will set the device to a "pro audio" mode, unlock the higher sample rates, and permanently make it stop behaving as a mass storage device. Not sure if this fixes Haiku OS USB audio compatibility, but it's a good bet and helps avoid the annoying mass storage device volume. If you don't have a Windows machine to do this on, you can do it in a libvirt or qemu virtual machine on Linux using USB host device passthrough. Once you do it, it doesn't have to be done again, I'm guessing they implemented this with an eFuse.

deleted 1mo ago

[deleted]

LeFantome 1mo ago

I think there should maybe be shadow repositories available for Open Source projects where things like your driver could be contributed. I get why Haiku does not want to deal with it do this is not a criticism. But I have also used AI to port software and create drivers. Others may not have the ability, even with AI. Perhaps I have docs you don’t. And some of it took a reasonable amount of money and time. I am not going to dedicate that to everything I might use if it was available. And in addition to wasting duplicated money and time, we are destroying the earth recreating things others have already done. I use Chimera Linux and I have thought about starting a repo just for the stuff that I have ported. I am not sure what the exact answer is but I hope this is something we figure out.

tikhonj 1mo ago
This is one of the things I like with NixOS: it's easy enough to add new packages and patch existing ones that stuff like this can either live in the core nixpkgs repo or be managed through some community-supported overlay. (Great example of this is [nixos-hardware](https://github.com/nixos/nixos-hardware https://github.com/nixos/nixos-hardware) which shares settings and fixes for specific laptop models and the like, or [emacs-overlay](https://github.com/nix-community/emacs-overlay https://github.com/nix-community/emacs-overlay) which has a bunch of extra Emacs-specific stuff that would not belong in the core repo.)
0x1d7 1mo ago
Looks like a user that was porting to ARM64 disagrees with the Haiku AI stance: https://github.com/rcarmo/haiku-arm64-build#haiku-arm64-build-environment https://github.com/rcarmo/haiku-arm64-build#haiku-arm64-buil...
- selectodude 1mo ago
  Makes sense. I had codex port haiku to arm64. Works decently, fun to play with on my Mac.
  - SpecialistK 1mo ago
    What I'd love to see (but likely lack the skill to, even with Claude Opus) is PowerPC. Haiku would look great on an iMac G4.
    - przemub 1mo ago
      There have been some contributions accepted recently for the PowerPC port, so maybe it will happen! There is a working AI-driven derivative distribution as well. https://github.com/ActionRetro/Tabby-PPC https://github.com/ActionRetro/Tabby-PPC
      - SpecialistK 1mo ago

KerrAvon 1mo ago

Haiku should rethink that AI rule. Put very high code quality gates in place, sure, but Haiku in particular is a very low-velocity project and AI could help them so much. There is no reason you can't produce high-quality code with AI conformant to your style guidelines and structural preferences, it just takes a lot more effort than the slop.

alex_john_m 1mo ago
What is a high code quality gate? Besides telling the AI it's an expert and to build perfect code?
LeFantome 1mo ago
I imagine that their issue is reviewer bandwidth. If all submissions were high-quality, it would probably work. But that is probably unlikely. Maybe the project could host a searchable directory of AI contributions hosted at external GitHub repos or something.
- hvb2 1mo ago
  > I imagine that their issue is reviewer bandwidth. This feels to me as the real bottleneck in general. Maybe along with thinking through what to code/prompt. I don't need more tokens or automated generation of PRs, I'm already at capacity for the care and understanding I want to have for code I own.
- SyneRyder 1mo ago
  My understanding is that the AI policy is more to do with issues of copyright and code provenance. They want to make sure that all of their code is cleared with no risk of accidentally using 'stolen' code or GPL code repeated by an AI. I can at least understand the policy. I think there's other opinions around AI use there as well, but I'll back off from that. I didn't mean for my post to become top voted, when we should be celebrating Haiku reaching Beta 6. I'm just disappointed that for me, R1/b6 has been a very big regression, right at a time when I've been using AI to make all the software I write cross-compatible with Haiku via Go & SDL, and even use AI to write drivers so more of my hardware works on Haiku... and instead, now I can barely even boot the system.

jessikat 1mo ago

Feel free to reach out, I will be happy to try help with these issues :)

SyneRyder 1mo ago
Will do, I think I recognize your username from the forums :) Life is getting in the way and makes it difficult to write a bug report with the necessary level of detail & logs. But when I can find time, I intend to. I think the ACPI issue is long standing, but I can't find my bug report anywhere in Trac. I'm fairly sure I've made at least one report, I created my Trac account roughly 6 years ago. But I also remember running into issues with Trac, so maybe it never went through.

zX41ZdbW 1mo ago

Maybe share my old article with Haiku developers: https://clickhouse.com/blog/agentic-coding https://clickhouse.com/blog/agentic-coding Could be a small chance, but it has already made many engineers reconsider their AI stance.

alex_john_m 1mo ago
It certainly made me reconsider my AI stance. I no longer use subscription based services like your.
ivolimmen 1mo ago
I keep a personal list of links to defend my non-AI stance. It is weird I even need to. If I am a carpenter and I was ordered to use a robot and tell it what to do there would be lawsuits and what not but as a software developer I am the idiot that does not want to modernize.

creatonez 1mo ago

> Focusrite Scarlett If it's the one I'm thinking of, this device includes a read-only ~100KiB USB mass storage device filled with .lnk files to remind you to register the device to get your bundled digital goods (a bunch of DAW plugins). You might want to try connecting the interface with Windows and install the focusrite driver. This will set the device to a "pro audio" mode, unlock the higher sample rates, and permanently make it stop behaving as a mass storage device. Not sure if this fixes Haiku OS USB audio compatibility, but it's a good bet and helps avoid the annoying mass storage device volume. If you don't have a Windows machine to do this on, you can do it in a libvirt or qemu virtual machine on Linux using USB host device passthrough. Once you do it, it doesn't have to be done again, I'm guessing they implemented this with an eFuse.