4 ms·

Does OpenStreetMap comply with US executive order naming?

plasticsoprano 1mo ago
Well, when you visit it https://www.openstreetmap.org/#map=7/23.765/-87.100 https://www.openstreetmap.org/#map=7/23.765/-87.100 there's no naming of that area at all. At least when looked at from a US IP. And when you search "Gulf of America" it returns "Gulf of Mexico". So take from that what you will.
- wongarsu 1mo ago
  Also https://www.openstreetmap.org/#map=8/43.622/-78.852 https://www.openstreetmap.org/#map=8/43.622/-78.852 shows "Lake Ontario". But it does carry the tag "official_name:en-US": "Lake America", so search will find Lake America and a mapping app could decide to show the official name Though generally official names are the names nobody uses. For example the country labeled "France" also has the attribute "official_name:en": "French Republic"
hansvm 1mo ago
Fiat never works for linguistic shifts. That order is about as likely to work as telling a kid to stop saying "six seven."
- alex1138 1mo ago
  I'm in favor of legislation to stop the '67' craze
  - dspillett 1mo ago
    Just tell them they've lost the game. If they ask what the rules of the game are, they've just lost again. They didn't invent being deliberately obtuse.
    - phainopepla2 1mo ago
      Damn it, now I've lost the game
      - dspillett 1mo ago
        Heck, if we really want to kill them with confusion, ask them the way to Mornington Crescent!
  - recursive 1mo ago
    One of its purposes is to annoy serious adults. If legislation is created, I would estimate it would extend its life somewhere between 3 weeks and infinity.
mikeocool 1mo ago
The President of the United Stated doesn’t actually have the authority to tell anyone besides the executive branch what to name geographic places. So the order only forces official US government maps created by USGS and the like to be updated. Other maps can choose to update if they want to. Open Street Map tends to reserve the “name” tag for what things are commonly called by the local community. It appears that for the Lake Ontario and The Gulf of Mexico they’ve added an “official_name:US” tag to capture the names in the executive orders.
- gmiller123456 1mo ago
  Even though he can't tell others to follow them, they often choose to do so anyway. E.g. Google Maps displays the Gulf of America.
  - kenmacd 1mo ago
    It doesn't for me (although it does include it in parentheses after the real name), so I'm going to hope this is only an 'only in the US' change.
    - beardyw 1mo ago
      Here in the UK it still says Ontario. Interesting that he changed the name to that of the entire continent, so Mexicans and Venezuelans can feel part of it.
      - mc32 1mo ago
        Close. But it's not (re)named Lake Americas. Remember, there are two continents, North America and South America. It's not one continent; however, jointly they can be called The Americas.
        beardyw 1mo ago
        Refering to the whole as America is a thing. Perhaps not in America (whatever that means). https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Americas https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Americas
zikduruqe 1mo ago
It's community driven, so I highly doubt the public will change it. Now, I'd love for each geographical region to take their very worst area, and rename it after a certain politician for the lulz.
scrollop 1mo ago
Hopefully not. Whatever changes Mr Trump demands will likely be temporary, regardless.
- xp84 1mo ago
  good to know both parties apparently feel that “petty renaming of things” is a good use of time for the government. So we’ll just start every change in party control with a raft of renames to thumb our noses at “The Former Guy.” Productive.
  - Krasnol 1mo ago
    So the clever ones should just leave the damage the stupid one did and just wait for their term to run out so the stupid ones can cause more damage, the clever ones can ignore and repeat? Doesn't seem to be very clever to me.
    - xp84 1mo ago
      "Stupid" = got way more votes than Harris Your team is the one who chose to run Harris. Was that clever? Current front runners for 2028 include AOC. Sure to be another banner year for these clever 'Democratic Socialists.'
      - Krasnol 1mo ago
        It's not "my" team. I come from a civilised country. The fact you didn't even touch the topic but went full MAGA instead, shines a proper light at your original comment now. You just wanted to play the 'ol both sides derailment. What I didn't understand though was what point you tried to make with "more votes". Yes, a country may have more stupid people vote then non-stupid. It happens all the time. So what?
        xp84 1mo ago
        In the USA, the left is currently obsessed with touting their intellectual superiority over their political opponents. It doesn't occur to them that whether they're smarter or not, they don't deserve to rule because they do not have the support of the people -- that's the very mathematical basis of any democratic country. You know what I call "A minority of highly-educated self-righteous elites get to pass all the laws to govern those stupid rural dummies"? An aristocracy. Both parties let their crackpots take the wheel, with very different results. The cravelnly corrupt buffoonery of Trump is the right-wing result. On the left, their idiots has rendered the party incapable of being taken seriously by grownups -- to an even greater extent than Trump's Republicans. That's the point. > went full MAGA instead ? I don't support either of the two idiotic "tribes" in our present system, MAGA vs. Woke.
kylecazar 1mo ago
It's up to the renderer what to display. OSM tags data according to global consensus, they use Gulf of Mexico for 'name'. There is an attribute for 'official_name:en-US' that returns Gulf of America. Same approach for other disputed names/places. https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:official_name:en-US https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:official_name:en-US "Few if any renderers consume official_name=* or any of its subkeys; in practice, the purpose of this key is for geocoders to find the feature when a user searches for the official name."
xp84 1mo ago
It’s interesting how the “preserve traditional historical names - don’t change the names on things for political reasons” role flipped to the left when that particular person started renaming things. In this case especially - a body of water that is between two countries has no “correct” namesake. It merely has a “traditional” name justified by “that’s just always what we’ve called it.” Tradition suddenly became very important to the American left wing when that rename happened.

Well, when you visit it https://www.openstreetmap.org/#map=7/23.765/-87.100 https://www.openstreetmap.org/#map=7/23.765/-87.100 there's no naming of that area at all. At least when looked at from a US IP. And when you search "Gulf of America" it returns "Gulf of Mexico". So take from that what you will.

wongarsu 1mo ago
Also https://www.openstreetmap.org/#map=8/43.622/-78.852 https://www.openstreetmap.org/#map=8/43.622/-78.852 shows "Lake Ontario". But it does carry the tag "official_name:en-US": "Lake America", so search will find Lake America and a mapping app could decide to show the official name Though generally official names are the names nobody uses. For example the country labeled "France" also has the attribute "official_name:en": "French Republic"

hansvm 1mo ago

Fiat never works for linguistic shifts. That order is about as likely to work as telling a kid to stop saying "six seven."

alex1138 1mo ago
I'm in favor of legislation to stop the '67' craze
- dspillett 1mo ago
  Just tell them they've lost the game. If they ask what the rules of the game are, they've just lost again. They didn't invent being deliberately obtuse.
  - phainopepla2 1mo ago
    Damn it, now I've lost the game
    - dspillett 1mo ago
      Heck, if we really want to kill them with confusion, ask them the way to Mornington Crescent!
- recursive 1mo ago
  One of its purposes is to annoy serious adults. If legislation is created, I would estimate it would extend its life somewhere between 3 weeks and infinity.

mikeocool 1mo ago

The President of the United Stated doesn’t actually have the authority to tell anyone besides the executive branch what to name geographic places. So the order only forces official US government maps created by USGS and the like to be updated. Other maps can choose to update if they want to. Open Street Map tends to reserve the “name” tag for what things are commonly called by the local community. It appears that for the Lake Ontario and The Gulf of Mexico they’ve added an “official_name:US” tag to capture the names in the executive orders.

gmiller123456 1mo ago
Even though he can't tell others to follow them, they often choose to do so anyway. E.g. Google Maps displays the Gulf of America.
- kenmacd 1mo ago
  It doesn't for me (although it does include it in parentheses after the real name), so I'm going to hope this is only an 'only in the US' change.
  - beardyw 1mo ago
    Here in the UK it still says Ontario. Interesting that he changed the name to that of the entire continent, so Mexicans and Venezuelans can feel part of it.
    - mc32 1mo ago
      Close. But it's not (re)named Lake Americas. Remember, there are two continents, North America and South America. It's not one continent; however, jointly they can be called The Americas.
      - beardyw 1mo ago
        Refering to the whole as America is a thing. Perhaps not in America (whatever that means). https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Americas https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Americas

zikduruqe 1mo ago

It's community driven, so I highly doubt the public will change it. Now, I'd love for each geographical region to take their very worst area, and rename it after a certain politician for the lulz.

scrollop 1mo ago

Hopefully not. Whatever changes Mr Trump demands will likely be temporary, regardless.

xp84 1mo ago
good to know both parties apparently feel that “petty renaming of things” is a good use of time for the government. So we’ll just start every change in party control with a raft of renames to thumb our noses at “The Former Guy.” Productive.
- Krasnol 1mo ago
  So the clever ones should just leave the damage the stupid one did and just wait for their term to run out so the stupid ones can cause more damage, the clever ones can ignore and repeat? Doesn't seem to be very clever to me.
  - xp84 1mo ago
    "Stupid" = got way more votes than Harris Your team is the one who chose to run Harris. Was that clever? Current front runners for 2028 include AOC. Sure to be another banner year for these clever 'Democratic Socialists.'
    - Krasnol 1mo ago
      It's not "my" team. I come from a civilised country. The fact you didn't even touch the topic but went full MAGA instead, shines a proper light at your original comment now. You just wanted to play the 'ol both sides derailment. What I didn't understand though was what point you tried to make with "more votes". Yes, a country may have more stupid people vote then non-stupid. It happens all the time. So what?
      - xp84 1mo ago
        In the USA, the left is currently obsessed with touting their intellectual superiority over their political opponents. It doesn't occur to them that whether they're smarter or not, they don't deserve to rule because they do not have the support of the people -- that's the very mathematical basis of any democratic country. You know what I call "A minority of highly-educated self-righteous elites get to pass all the laws to govern those stupid rural dummies"? An aristocracy. Both parties let their crackpots take the wheel, with very different results. The cravelnly corrupt buffoonery of Trump is the right-wing result. On the left, their idiots has rendered the party incapable of being taken seriously by grownups -- to an even greater extent than Trump's Republicans. That's the point. > went full MAGA instead ? I don't support either of the two idiotic "tribes" in our present system, MAGA vs. Woke.

kylecazar 1mo ago

It's up to the renderer what to display. OSM tags data according to global consensus, they use Gulf of Mexico for 'name'. There is an attribute for 'official_name:en-US' that returns Gulf of America. Same approach for other disputed names/places. https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:official_name:en-US https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:official_name:en-US "Few if any renderers consume official_name=* or any of its subkeys; in practice, the purpose of this key is for geocoders to find the feature when a user searches for the official name."

xp84 1mo ago

It’s interesting how the “preserve traditional historical names - don’t change the names on things for political reasons” role flipped to the left when that particular person started renaming things. In this case especially - a body of water that is between two countries has no “correct” namesake. It merely has a “traditional” name justified by “that’s just always what we’ve called it.” Tradition suddenly became very important to the American left wing when that rename happened.