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If this is true, then this should immediately put to rest the explanation (that I'll admit I bought into) that only one video format will win out (H.264 vs Ogg

If this is true, then this should immediately put to rest the explanation (that I'll admit I bought into) that only one video format will win out (H.264 vs Ogg Theora/VP8 is the major discussion point) - as video streaming companies would be unwilling to re-encode their content for more than one format. Apparently they are quite comfortable encoding as many as 120 instantiations of their videos.

cma 14y ago
Netflix has a limited catalog... YouTube has a much larger one by many orders of magnitude. However they could still lazily trans code on demand (and cache the result).
- gillianseed 14y ago
  >Netflix has a limited catalog... YouTube has a much larger one by many orders of magnitude. Youtube offer their videos in vp8 along with h264.
warfangle 14y ago
Storage is cheap. Edge connections are not. It makes sense to have 120 instantiations of the videos if that huge multitude is necessary to optimally serve the plethora of mobile devices out there: you don't want to be negotiating for the worst bitrate out of a 720p encode if the device you're delivering too is only capable of 480x320 and can only gain access to 3G networks.
jedberg 14y ago
In fact, it is not unheard of for us to re-encode the entire catalog when a new, better format or codec comes along, or we add support for a new device.
- blhack 14y ago
  Huh. You guys must have quite the rendering farm for that, eh?
  - jedberg 14y ago
    EC2. 1000s of instances. :)
    - toomuchtodo 14y ago
      Spot pricing I hope! =)
elithrar 14y ago
> Apparently they are quite comfortable encoding as many as 120 instantiations of their videos. There is more to it than just the number of videos (or storage requirements). You can get dedicated hardware h264 encoders easily (and relatively cheaply), not to mention the decoders in mobile devices. There's also quality to consider, effective quality per MB (important when targeting mobile devices), and all the things that fall into that (motion handling, prediction, etc). I don't claim to be an expert, but from what I've read Ogg & WebM are fighting an uphill battle on the technical side of things. Part of this is no doubt due to h264 patents, but it's a shame the free solution isn't also the technically superior one.

cma 14y ago

Netflix has a limited catalog... YouTube has a much larger one by many orders of magnitude. However they could still lazily trans code on demand (and cache the result).

gillianseed 14y ago
>Netflix has a limited catalog... YouTube has a much larger one by many orders of magnitude. Youtube offer their videos in vp8 along with h264.

warfangle 14y ago

Storage is cheap. Edge connections are not. It makes sense to have 120 instantiations of the videos if that huge multitude is necessary to optimally serve the plethora of mobile devices out there: you don't want to be negotiating for the worst bitrate out of a 720p encode if the device you're delivering too is only capable of 480x320 and can only gain access to 3G networks.

jedberg 14y ago

In fact, it is not unheard of for us to re-encode the entire catalog when a new, better format or codec comes along, or we add support for a new device.

blhack 14y ago
Huh. You guys must have quite the rendering farm for that, eh?
- jedberg 14y ago
  EC2. 1000s of instances. :)
  - toomuchtodo 14y ago
    Spot pricing I hope! =)

elithrar 14y ago

> Apparently they are quite comfortable encoding as many as 120 instantiations of their videos. There is more to it than just the number of videos (or storage requirements). You can get dedicated hardware h264 encoders easily (and relatively cheaply), not to mention the decoders in mobile devices. There's also quality to consider, effective quality per MB (important when targeting mobile devices), and all the things that fall into that (motion handling, prediction, etc). I don't claim to be an expert, but from what I've read Ogg & WebM are fighting an uphill battle on the technical side of things. Part of this is no doubt due to h264 patents, but it's a shame the free solution isn't also the technically superior one.