3 ms·

Product Development is being Rewritten

26 points by anamhira 1mo ago

deleted 1mo ago
[deleted]
pyrophane 1mo ago
I assume the name of this startup is meant to be pronounced like "revel" rather than "revile."
- anamhira 1mo ago
  Dealers choice :)
hypfer 1mo ago
There is no shortage of articles on the HN front page, stating that being "just a code monkey" is likely going to have much less employment options soon-ish. A likely correct but also at this point rather stale observation.
- anamhira 1mo ago
  Don't disagree, was trying to get at moreso the transition to more empirically inclined development. Ie - way more emphasis on how code behaves rather than the code itself
- lelanthran 1mo ago
  > There is no shortage of articles on the HN front page, stating that being "just a code monkey" is likely going to have much less employment options soon-ish. The people making that observation are somehow blind to the fact that what they are doing now is ever more likely to be taken over by AI too.
chrisjj 1mo ago
True title: Product Development is Dead
- xnx 1mo ago
  They probably changed it. URL is still https://revyl.com/blog/product-development-is-being-rewritten/ https://revyl.com/blog/product-development-is-being-rewritte...
stuartaxelowen 1mo ago
Agree on the changing work interface layer going higher to product capabilities, but not on “the code base is no longer important”. It’s easy to dismiss given how easy it is to ask an agent to generate a bunch of code. But the code base encodes the intersection of the orgs learnings and its arc of product growth as well. Good code bases encode the learnings as checks and abstractions that form the foundation for future growth. It would be a mistake to give up this formal language. Personally, I would bet on better abstractions in code bases, and being able to embed your product description in code, for high leverage and verifiability.
- adamddev1 1mo ago
  It is self-serving to say "the code base is no longer important" for companies that want to sell you LLM tokens for swarms of agents to have to constantly burn away at a pile of increasingly messy and broken code. If they can convince people to never look at the code, the people will have no choice but to keep throwing more and more piles of their product at mysterious blobs of codebases that become increasingly difficult and expensive to manage.
- anamhira 1mo ago
  Yeah, a bit of hyperbole there. I do think the codebase is still super important. Just less informative maybe, and becomes hard to reconcile with as the amount of changes in a codebase increases by an order of magnitude.
bcrosby95 1mo ago
This post seems very concerned about what a product does - and rightly so. However, it doesn't really talk about figuring out what a product doesn't do. This is a blind spot large enough to fly a 747 full of CVEs through.
adamddev1 1mo ago
The graph of the engine efficiency vs number of horses per person at the end doesn't fit IMO. I am tired of people trying to make these analogies between the following transitions: - Horses to Engines (non-deterministic to deterministic) - Assembly to Higher-Level Language (deterministic to deterministic) - Higher-Level Language to LLM Prompts (deterministic to non-deterministic) These things are not the same. They are all fundamentally different transitions.
- none2585 1mo ago
  I think the last point isn't quite the same as the others. A proper comparison would be a human programmer to an LLM prompt. Both of those things are non-deterministic (people get sick, get stuck on things, have bad days) that produce deterministic things (code). I'm not an AI fanboy and am trying to figure this all out for myself but I do think the framing of a shifting landscape is apt. The difference is that LLMs are (maybe? probably?) going to revolutionize just about every white collar sector.
well_ackshually 1mo ago
This just in: slop vomit company is telling you we should make more slop vomit and that the code matters less and less. If your goal is to post that slop on linkedin and make a shitty startup that gets bought within 5 years, sure. In the mean time, the adults in the room will continue to maintain well thought out, well working software.
quintu5 1mo ago
Early stage hands-on involvement in shaping the code base’s architecture is still important if you want to build a product that can scale cleanly as you add more features.

26 points by anamhira 1mo ago

deleted 1mo ago

[deleted]

pyrophane 1mo ago

I assume the name of this startup is meant to be pronounced like "revel" rather than "revile."

anamhira 1mo ago
Dealers choice :)

hypfer 1mo ago

There is no shortage of articles on the HN front page, stating that being "just a code monkey" is likely going to have much less employment options soon-ish. A likely correct but also at this point rather stale observation.

anamhira 1mo ago
Don't disagree, was trying to get at moreso the transition to more empirically inclined development. Ie - way more emphasis on how code behaves rather than the code itself
lelanthran 1mo ago
> There is no shortage of articles on the HN front page, stating that being "just a code monkey" is likely going to have much less employment options soon-ish. The people making that observation are somehow blind to the fact that what they are doing now is ever more likely to be taken over by AI too.

chrisjj 1mo ago

True title: Product Development is Dead

xnx 1mo ago
They probably changed it. URL is still https://revyl.com/blog/product-development-is-being-rewritten/ https://revyl.com/blog/product-development-is-being-rewritte...

stuartaxelowen 1mo ago

Agree on the changing work interface layer going higher to product capabilities, but not on “the code base is no longer important”. It’s easy to dismiss given how easy it is to ask an agent to generate a bunch of code. But the code base encodes the intersection of the orgs learnings and its arc of product growth as well. Good code bases encode the learnings as checks and abstractions that form the foundation for future growth. It would be a mistake to give up this formal language. Personally, I would bet on better abstractions in code bases, and being able to embed your product description in code, for high leverage and verifiability.

adamddev1 1mo ago
It is self-serving to say "the code base is no longer important" for companies that want to sell you LLM tokens for swarms of agents to have to constantly burn away at a pile of increasingly messy and broken code. If they can convince people to never look at the code, the people will have no choice but to keep throwing more and more piles of their product at mysterious blobs of codebases that become increasingly difficult and expensive to manage.
anamhira 1mo ago
Yeah, a bit of hyperbole there. I do think the codebase is still super important. Just less informative maybe, and becomes hard to reconcile with as the amount of changes in a codebase increases by an order of magnitude.

bcrosby95 1mo ago

This post seems very concerned about what a product does - and rightly so. However, it doesn't really talk about figuring out what a product doesn't do. This is a blind spot large enough to fly a 747 full of CVEs through.

adamddev1 1mo ago

The graph of the engine efficiency vs number of horses per person at the end doesn't fit IMO. I am tired of people trying to make these analogies between the following transitions: - Horses to Engines (non-deterministic to deterministic) - Assembly to Higher-Level Language (deterministic to deterministic) - Higher-Level Language to LLM Prompts (deterministic to non-deterministic) These things are not the same. They are all fundamentally different transitions.

none2585 1mo ago
I think the last point isn't quite the same as the others. A proper comparison would be a human programmer to an LLM prompt. Both of those things are non-deterministic (people get sick, get stuck on things, have bad days) that produce deterministic things (code). I'm not an AI fanboy and am trying to figure this all out for myself but I do think the framing of a shifting landscape is apt. The difference is that LLMs are (maybe? probably?) going to revolutionize just about every white collar sector.

well_ackshually 1mo ago

This just in: slop vomit company is telling you we should make more slop vomit and that the code matters less and less. If your goal is to post that slop on linkedin and make a shitty startup that gets bought within 5 years, sure. In the mean time, the adults in the room will continue to maintain well thought out, well working software.

quintu5 1mo ago

Early stage hands-on involvement in shaping the code base’s architecture is still important if you want to build a product that can scale cleanly as you add more features.