4 ms·

If it's 100% open what are they doing to prevent fragmentation? Also what has been done to make sure they can update any handset running Firefox OS independent

If it's 100% open what are they doing to prevent fragmentation? Also what has been done to make sure they can update any handset running Firefox OS independent of the manufactures and service providers?

josefresco 14y ago
A truly open 'anything' means that fragmentation is neither good nor bad, and implementations of this open thing can exist on an island (unable to upgrade). Truly open might be messy and a little scary for some people but it means that diversity and open access can thrive. Android only goes part way towards this idea while still trying to maintain control and influence over several key (money making) parts (I don't blame them). This hybrid approach to being open however doesn't sit well with all users.
- greggman 14y ago
  Fragmentation has killed android for developers In china. Instead of one platform to target there are grater than 30 each with their own Apis, quirks, bugs and markets. Instead of spending time making apps you spend time porting. Each modified version also has its own proprietary market. My question is, how will Firefox OS prevent this same problem with a 100% open system
OlavHN 14y ago
If you refer to fragmentation as manufacturers slowing down upgrades because they are "differentiating" their Android devices then I believe the web ecosystem already has some experience there dealing with different browsers :) I believe an alternative mobile ecosystem not centrally controlled like iOS and Android, but rather with a standardised core and fragmentation / innovation on top is a very exciting model. It's working great for the web, why is mobile fundamentally any different? It beats having to program every application three times from scratch to reach a full market.
- stcredzero 14y ago
  > It beats having to program every application three times from scratch to reach a full market. How are you going to counteract the interests of Apple/Google and other established players, who are going to hold onto their turf with all the power the network effect will give them?
  - kibwen 14y ago
    Apple's and Google's (and Microsoft's) platforms already contain web browsers. The "web platform" already exists on every relevant device sold on the planet. The only variable is to what degree each browser implements web standards. The biggest missing piece of the puzzle is a webapp store that enables distribution, promotion, and monetization. And you don't even need a native app for this, as the "webapp store" could just as easily be a web page, thereby surpassing e.g. Apple's and Google's 30% cut (what are they going to do, block the web page?). It's a long shot, but if Mozilla can pull it off it would be a huge leap for openness and consumer choice.
    - tres_bien 14y ago
      > thereby surpassing e.g. Apple's and Google's 30% cut I think you meant 'bypassing'.
      - kibwen 14y ago
        I did! I heartily depreciate your diligence.
    - stcredzero 14y ago
      > what are they going to do, block the web page? I know for a fact that this can be attempted in iOS. I bought a Chinese iPad 2, and it has google.com blocked.
  - OlavHN 14y ago
    It's interesting (and somewhat surprising) that very few in this thread are criticising the "web stack" for being slow or lacking features or something along those lines. If web standards now are getting performant and expressive enough to compete with dedicated, close-to-the-metal, technology stacks on mobile then the altruistic incentives of the web ecosystem might be enough. The incumbents have their incentives less aligned with users. I'm not convinced Google will crush attempts at making the web a first class citizen on phones. After having pushed and developed the web for so long I think they already see it as their turf.

josefresco 14y ago

A truly open 'anything' means that fragmentation is neither good nor bad, and implementations of this open thing can exist on an island (unable to upgrade). Truly open might be messy and a little scary for some people but it means that diversity and open access can thrive. Android only goes part way towards this idea while still trying to maintain control and influence over several key (money making) parts (I don't blame them). This hybrid approach to being open however doesn't sit well with all users.

greggman 14y ago
Fragmentation has killed android for developers In china. Instead of one platform to target there are grater than 30 each with their own Apis, quirks, bugs and markets. Instead of spending time making apps you spend time porting. Each modified version also has its own proprietary market. My question is, how will Firefox OS prevent this same problem with a 100% open system

OlavHN 14y ago

If you refer to fragmentation as manufacturers slowing down upgrades because they are "differentiating" their Android devices then I believe the web ecosystem already has some experience there dealing with different browsers :) I believe an alternative mobile ecosystem not centrally controlled like iOS and Android, but rather with a standardised core and fragmentation / innovation on top is a very exciting model. It's working great for the web, why is mobile fundamentally any different? It beats having to program every application three times from scratch to reach a full market.

stcredzero 14y ago
> It beats having to program every application three times from scratch to reach a full market. How are you going to counteract the interests of Apple/Google and other established players, who are going to hold onto their turf with all the power the network effect will give them?
- kibwen 14y ago
  Apple's and Google's (and Microsoft's) platforms already contain web browsers. The "web platform" already exists on every relevant device sold on the planet. The only variable is to what degree each browser implements web standards. The biggest missing piece of the puzzle is a webapp store that enables distribution, promotion, and monetization. And you don't even need a native app for this, as the "webapp store" could just as easily be a web page, thereby surpassing e.g. Apple's and Google's 30% cut (what are they going to do, block the web page?). It's a long shot, but if Mozilla can pull it off it would be a huge leap for openness and consumer choice.
  - tres_bien 14y ago
    > thereby surpassing e.g. Apple's and Google's 30% cut I think you meant 'bypassing'.
    - kibwen 14y ago
      I did! I heartily depreciate your diligence.
  - stcredzero 14y ago
    > what are they going to do, block the web page? I know for a fact that this can be attempted in iOS. I bought a Chinese iPad 2, and it has google.com blocked.
- OlavHN 14y ago
  It's interesting (and somewhat surprising) that very few in this thread are criticising the "web stack" for being slow or lacking features or something along those lines. If web standards now are getting performant and expressive enough to compete with dedicated, close-to-the-metal, technology stacks on mobile then the altruistic incentives of the web ecosystem might be enough. The incumbents have their incentives less aligned with users. I'm not convinced Google will crush attempts at making the web a first class citizen on phones. After having pushed and developed the web for so long I think they already see it as their turf.