4 ms·

Actually, I find it's helpful to privately admit that you do negative things because they DO have some positive side effects. Everything is a tradeoff. Maybe a

Actually, I find it's helpful to privately admit that you do negative things because they DO have some positive side effects. Everything is a tradeoff. Maybe anger helps draw attention to you. Maybe it garners some form of sympathy. Maybe people get out of your way when you're angry, giving you a certain kind of power. The reason why you want to stop being angry is because you want to accomplish things without all the negative side effects too. Being very honest about what you're getting out of something can give you the bigger picture on why you rely on it, so you can more effectively find solutions.

BeetleB 2mo ago
> Maybe anger helps draw attention to you. Maybe it garners some form of sympathy. Maybe people get out of your way when you're angry, giving you a certain kind of power. I know it's much maligned here on HN, but you've articulated one of the key principle of NVC (Nonviolent Communication): Being able to articulate your needs, and map your emotions with your needs. The steps it recommends (not necessarily in this order): 1. Understand the facts 2. Label the emotions you're feeling (anxious, concerned, jubilant, etc) 3. Figure out the needs that are related to those emotions (e.g. purpose in life, shelter (usually income), hunger (usually income). Even if you don't follow NVC, pretty much all communications books emphasize all 3 above. Another book had it this way: 1. Label your emotions. 2. Gather the facts. 3. Examine the narrative you're telling yourself based on the facts. 4. Explore that narrative (Is it the only possible narrative given the facts? What is missing in your life that is part of that narrative?)
- ChrisMarshallNY 2mo ago
  I was unaware that NVC (North Viet Cong? -Just kidding) was maligned, here. It’s not a structure that I was taught, but that list makes sense, to me.
  - BeetleB 2mo ago
    It used to come up often several years ago. See some examples: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=19493179 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=19493179 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=19493147 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=19493147 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22759368 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22759368 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=19090712 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=19090712 In my experience, people who are heavily critical of it have not read the book, and are arguing either against articles espousing it, or have encountered what I call "The cult of NVC" at work. The NVC book is incredibly simple. But there is a sort of cult around it. People greatly expand what's in the book to things the author never claimed. I've even attended an NVC chapter in my city and it was somewhat off putting. If you're at all interested, read the book and avoid the cult. It's not a perfect book/framework, but I've yet to read a better framework. The downside of the book is it's relatively prescriptive, and doesn't cite research, or do a good job of explaining why the method often works. Other books do that, though. Had I read NVC by itself, I too would be a bit of a skeptic. It's only by reading other books that go deeper did I understand why NVC (usually) works.
InexSquirrel 2mo ago
I think anger has a place - there are circumstances that I think it's needed, but they're basically fight or flight scenarios. The idea that all anger is bad is a naive position to take. But I think you're talking about anger creeping into daily life and everyday interactions - and in that regard I agree with what you've said. I suspect it also goes hand in hand with victim mentality, which in turn justifies the anger.

BeetleB 2mo ago

> Maybe anger helps draw attention to you. Maybe it garners some form of sympathy. Maybe people get out of your way when you're angry, giving you a certain kind of power. I know it's much maligned here on HN, but you've articulated one of the key principle of NVC (Nonviolent Communication): Being able to articulate your needs, and map your emotions with your needs. The steps it recommends (not necessarily in this order): 1. Understand the facts 2. Label the emotions you're feeling (anxious, concerned, jubilant, etc) 3. Figure out the needs that are related to those emotions (e.g. purpose in life, shelter (usually income), hunger (usually income). Even if you don't follow NVC, pretty much all communications books emphasize all 3 above. Another book had it this way: 1. Label your emotions. 2. Gather the facts. 3. Examine the narrative you're telling yourself based on the facts. 4. Explore that narrative (Is it the only possible narrative given the facts? What is missing in your life that is part of that narrative?)

ChrisMarshallNY 2mo ago
I was unaware that NVC (North Viet Cong? -Just kidding) was maligned, here. It’s not a structure that I was taught, but that list makes sense, to me.
- BeetleB 2mo ago
  It used to come up often several years ago. See some examples: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=19493179 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=19493179 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=19493147 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=19493147 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22759368 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22759368 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=19090712 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=19090712 In my experience, people who are heavily critical of it have not read the book, and are arguing either against articles espousing it, or have encountered what I call "The cult of NVC" at work. The NVC book is incredibly simple. But there is a sort of cult around it. People greatly expand what's in the book to things the author never claimed. I've even attended an NVC chapter in my city and it was somewhat off putting. If you're at all interested, read the book and avoid the cult. It's not a perfect book/framework, but I've yet to read a better framework. The downside of the book is it's relatively prescriptive, and doesn't cite research, or do a good job of explaining why the method often works. Other books do that, though. Had I read NVC by itself, I too would be a bit of a skeptic. It's only by reading other books that go deeper did I understand why NVC (usually) works.

InexSquirrel 2mo ago

I think anger has a place - there are circumstances that I think it's needed, but they're basically fight or flight scenarios. The idea that all anger is bad is a naive position to take. But I think you're talking about anger creeping into daily life and everyday interactions - and in that regard I agree with what you've said. I suspect it also goes hand in hand with victim mentality, which in turn justifies the anger.