4 ms·

Genuinely curious, is there like a simple list of competing ethical frameworks?

by _def 2mo ago

jasonjayr 2mo ago
Not to drop any spoilers (hide this comment before reading further ....) But "The Amazing Digital Circus" explores this concept relating to human brain scans, and how the 'simulated' brains would react under simulation.
- SamBam 2mo ago
  Similarly, the story Lena by qntm.[1] It describes in part how some volunteer brain scans are actually quite agreeable to work with until they work for too many hours, and then they get fussy, but it's cool, you can always reboot them. But you need to hide from them the fact that it's been decades since they were scanned and uploaded, or they'll realize how long they've been slaves for. 1. https://qntm.org/mmacevedo https://qntm.org/mmacevedo
  - mock-possum 2mo ago
    and both Black Mirror and Westworld explore these same ‘what-if’s’ in turn.
- jamilton 2mo ago
  It really does not "explore" the concept, it just features it as a plot element.
  - RIMR 2mo ago
    It's the central plot point of the entire series. If that's not "exploring the concept", you're going to have to explain why.
    - jamilton 2mo ago
      Sure, more spoilers ahead. For every episode except the last 1-2 the characters are not textually aware that they're simulated humans made from a brain scan, and the conflict and plot are largely interpersonal conflict and being forced into adventures by the mad AI that runs the simulation. The characters wish that they could leave and/or change the simulation, and eventually accept their situation, and part of the conclusion is the idea that it's worth existing in their limited simulation and trying to make the best of it even though they'll never leave. You could say it's exploring what it would be like to be trapped in a simulation with a mad AI, but I wouldn't say it explores the concept of ethics of simulating humans in general. Most of the things the humans don't like are arbitrary limitations of this simulation in particular (can't talk to the outside world, can't choose your form, can't have sex, can't have any impact on the world, forced into zany situations by an AI that doesn't really understand humans or listen to them), not anything about simulations in general. The finale touches on the idea of the simulated humans wondering about their original versions and what they're like and what they're up to, but that's about it. Basically, I don't feel by watching the show I encountered any non-trivial ideas about human simulations just because it's about a simulation.
janalsncm 2mo ago
There’s a list here, not sure if it’s the best one https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Normative_ethics https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Normative_ethics
flexagoon 2mo ago
Virtue ethics, Deontology and Consequentialism are the "big three". A very TLDR version is: - Virtue ethics: instead of judging actions as good and bad, you should strive to become a good person (as defined by some specific set of virtues, like kindness, honesty, etc). - Deontology: actions should be judged by a set of some fixed moral rules, for example "lying is always bad", even if you had good intentions. - Consequentialism: actions should be judged by their consequences, for example by how much total happiness they create (utilitarianism). Doing something bad if it would make life of many people better is ethical, because the created happiness is more than the created harm. In reality of course there are many other branches of them and the distinction is often not as obvious, and your personal views are probably somewhere in between. https://plato.stanford.edu https://plato.stanford.edu is an amazing resource if you want more in depth explanation of philosophical theories.

Genuinely curious, is there like a simple list of competing ethical frameworks?

by _def 2mo ago

Genuinely curious, is there like a simple list of competing ethical frameworks?

Not to drop any spoilers (hide this comment before reading further ....) But "The Amazing Digital Circus" explores this concept relating to human brain scans, and how the 'simulated' brains would react under simulation.

SamBam 2mo ago
Similarly, the story Lena by qntm.[1] It describes in part how some volunteer brain scans are actually quite agreeable to work with until they work for too many hours, and then they get fussy, but it's cool, you can always reboot them. But you need to hide from them the fact that it's been decades since they were scanned and uploaded, or they'll realize how long they've been slaves for. 1. https://qntm.org/mmacevedo https://qntm.org/mmacevedo
- mock-possum 2mo ago
  and both Black Mirror and Westworld explore these same ‘what-if’s’ in turn.
jamilton 2mo ago
It really does not "explore" the concept, it just features it as a plot element.
- RIMR 2mo ago
  It's the central plot point of the entire series. If that's not "exploring the concept", you're going to have to explain why.
  - jamilton 2mo ago
    Sure, more spoilers ahead. For every episode except the last 1-2 the characters are not textually aware that they're simulated humans made from a brain scan, and the conflict and plot are largely interpersonal conflict and being forced into adventures by the mad AI that runs the simulation. The characters wish that they could leave and/or change the simulation, and eventually accept their situation, and part of the conclusion is the idea that it's worth existing in their limited simulation and trying to make the best of it even though they'll never leave. You could say it's exploring what it would be like to be trapped in a simulation with a mad AI, but I wouldn't say it explores the concept of ethics of simulating humans in general. Most of the things the humans don't like are arbitrary limitations of this simulation in particular (can't talk to the outside world, can't choose your form, can't have sex, can't have any impact on the world, forced into zany situations by an AI that doesn't really understand humans or listen to them), not anything about simulations in general. The finale touches on the idea of the simulated humans wondering about their original versions and what they're like and what they're up to, but that's about it. Basically, I don't feel by watching the show I encountered any non-trivial ideas about human simulations just because it's about a simulation.

janalsncm 2mo ago

There’s a list here, not sure if it’s the best one https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Normative_ethics https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Normative_ethics

flexagoon 2mo ago

Virtue ethics, Deontology and Consequentialism are the "big three". A very TLDR version is: - Virtue ethics: instead of judging actions as good and bad, you should strive to become a good person (as defined by some specific set of virtues, like kindness, honesty, etc). - Deontology: actions should be judged by a set of some fixed moral rules, for example "lying is always bad", even if you had good intentions. - Consequentialism: actions should be judged by their consequences, for example by how much total happiness they create (utilitarianism). Doing something bad if it would make life of many people better is ethical, because the created happiness is more than the created harm. In reality of course there are many other branches of them and the distinction is often not as obvious, and your personal views are probably somewhere in between. https://plato.stanford.edu https://plato.stanford.edu is an amazing resource if you want more in depth explanation of philosophical theories.