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Former Republican here aka Rino. It’s easily explained; the GOP ceased to exist when they all fell in line with Trump first term. Trump threatened to to form hi

Former Republican here aka Rino. It’s easily explained; the GOP ceased to exist when they all fell in line with Trump first term. Trump threatened to to form his own party with his massive following and make the GOP the third choice on the ballot. Trumpism is not conservative in any sense; it’s jingoistic nationalism to benefit Trumps interest.

stetrain 2mo ago
The GOP was not fiscally conservative before Trump either.
- peaseagee 2mo ago
  Exactly. I remember hearing "tax and spend Democrats" as a slur back in the 90s/00s, but seeing the GOP spend without taxing during those years showed what it was really all about...
- michaelt 2mo ago
  Yes, in the 1970s-1980s the GOP came up with the idea of "starve the beast" [1] which allowed them describe unfunded tax cuts and deficit spending as "fiscally conservative", like a parent taking away a child's allowance. Complete nonsense in practice, obviously - but political gold! Voters get all the same public services, lower taxes, and to think they're being responsible with money. And if you're a 65-year-old legislator, you'll be dead and buried before the consequences start to bite. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Starve_the_beast https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Starve_the_beast
  - SmirkingRevenge 2mo ago
    Running up massive debt and deficits is also a way to kill appetite for D priorities that require new spending. The best way to make sense of the GOP is in it's opposition to wealth redistribution. Primarily downward wealth redistribution. That's their north star. Upward redistribution is mostly OK though, they consider it just giving rich people their own money back
- bluGill 2mo ago
  Before Trump the GOP was fiscally conservative - when the democrats were in power! That explains a large part of why democrats were able to lower the debt - the republicans in congress wouldn't go along with efforts to raise the debt.
  - stetrain 2mo ago
    And when Republicans were in power they cut taxes and spent $2T on a war in Iraq. Cutting taxes without cutting spending raises the deficit and seems to be the GOP's most common fiscal policy.
  - preg_match 2mo ago
    The GOP is basically universally bad at fiscal policy. They spend big, mostly on warmongering and industry. Not developing industry, no no, siphoning government funds to the private sector, where I assume they have many friends. They increase the deficit because they increase spending and then "cut" taxes. Often they don't effectively "cut" taxes for you and me: the tax burden for many Americans is raised, except for a select few who get tax cuts. This was happening well before Trump, into Reagan. The only reason this works at all is because they get to say "oh we cut taxes!". But tax burden is very complicated, and nobody is analyzing that for the common voter.
dataflow 2mo ago
Not to veer too far off-topic but are former-Republican and RINO mutually exclusive? How can one simultaneously be a Republican (in name or otherwise) while calling themself a former Republican? Either you've stopped voting Republican (in which case you're no longer RINO) or you still are (in which case you're a current Republican)...
- throwaway1492 2mo ago
  I’ve been voting against Trump and maga since 2016. Waiting for sanity to return; I hope it will return but at this point I’m doubtful.
  - dataflow 2mo ago
    From your reply it sounds like you're still voting Republican, just not for the candidates that you classify as "MAGA"? In which case I guess that's a (current) RINO... Assuming my assumption is correct, I hope you're just recognizing the fact that MAGA didn't get where it is today without massive help from non-MAGA Republicans (in Congress as well as outside), in numerous ways. So you're not going to see the outcome you're waiting for if that's the case.

stetrain 2mo ago

The GOP was not fiscally conservative before Trump either.

peaseagee 2mo ago
Exactly. I remember hearing "tax and spend Democrats" as a slur back in the 90s/00s, but seeing the GOP spend without taxing during those years showed what it was really all about...
michaelt 2mo ago
Yes, in the 1970s-1980s the GOP came up with the idea of "starve the beast" [1] which allowed them describe unfunded tax cuts and deficit spending as "fiscally conservative", like a parent taking away a child's allowance. Complete nonsense in practice, obviously - but political gold! Voters get all the same public services, lower taxes, and to think they're being responsible with money. And if you're a 65-year-old legislator, you'll be dead and buried before the consequences start to bite. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Starve_the_beast https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Starve_the_beast
- SmirkingRevenge 2mo ago
  Running up massive debt and deficits is also a way to kill appetite for D priorities that require new spending. The best way to make sense of the GOP is in it's opposition to wealth redistribution. Primarily downward wealth redistribution. That's their north star. Upward redistribution is mostly OK though, they consider it just giving rich people their own money back
bluGill 2mo ago
Before Trump the GOP was fiscally conservative - when the democrats were in power! That explains a large part of why democrats were able to lower the debt - the republicans in congress wouldn't go along with efforts to raise the debt.
- stetrain 2mo ago
  And when Republicans were in power they cut taxes and spent $2T on a war in Iraq. Cutting taxes without cutting spending raises the deficit and seems to be the GOP's most common fiscal policy.
- preg_match 2mo ago
  The GOP is basically universally bad at fiscal policy. They spend big, mostly on warmongering and industry. Not developing industry, no no, siphoning government funds to the private sector, where I assume they have many friends. They increase the deficit because they increase spending and then "cut" taxes. Often they don't effectively "cut" taxes for you and me: the tax burden for many Americans is raised, except for a select few who get tax cuts. This was happening well before Trump, into Reagan. The only reason this works at all is because they get to say "oh we cut taxes!". But tax burden is very complicated, and nobody is analyzing that for the common voter.

dataflow 2mo ago

Not to veer too far off-topic but are former-Republican and RINO mutually exclusive? How can one simultaneously be a Republican (in name or otherwise) while calling themself a former Republican? Either you've stopped voting Republican (in which case you're no longer RINO) or you still are (in which case you're a current Republican)...

throwaway1492 2mo ago
I’ve been voting against Trump and maga since 2016. Waiting for sanity to return; I hope it will return but at this point I’m doubtful.
- dataflow 2mo ago
  From your reply it sounds like you're still voting Republican, just not for the candidates that you classify as "MAGA"? In which case I guess that's a (current) RINO... Assuming my assumption is correct, I hope you're just recognizing the fact that MAGA didn't get where it is today without massive help from non-MAGA Republicans (in Congress as well as outside), in numerous ways. So you're not going to see the outcome you're waiting for if that's the case.