5 ms·

I currently have an S3 and this isn't the first serious exploit I've come across for it. Does anyone have any suggestions for a serious secure phone? I don't

I currently have an S3 and this isn't the first serious exploit I've come across for it. Does anyone have any suggestions for a serious secure phone? I don't need all the bells and whistles and don't install many apps. Mostly just email, text, and web browsing.

alexmunroe 14y ago
As unpopular a suggestion as this may be, Blackberry's are very secure particularly if you enable some of the more advanced security features such as secure memory and full device encryption. A lot of research has been undertaken at my University into this recently and very little progress has been made. The obvious downside is that the App eco system is still very poor compared to both iOS and Android and the UI leaves a lot to be desired. It depends really on whether you favour security over usability.
driverdan 14y ago
This is only a serious exploit if you install an app that exploits it. If you only use email, SMS/text and web browsing and don't install any apps you should be fine. If you want a more secure Android phone get Google's (currently Nexus 4). It won't have all the BS that 3rd parties add, like this.
- fulafel 14y ago
  It's a break from the sandbox so any vulnerability in an app (eg outdated WebKit, the norm on non-google devices) now compromised your whole device.
- stusmall 14y ago
  This is just one on the list of a few I've seen. There was also the infamous remote execution of USSD codes and another major exploit via the document reader(If I remember correctly some people where hyping that as an NFC attck). I understand bugs and exploits happen, but this proc interface and the USSD attack were just silly. I'd just like something designed inside a culture of security.
ricardobeat 14y ago
A stock iPhone (non-jailbroken)? There hasn't been any widespread security hole since the early days of jailbreaking via PNG. iOS6 fixed a couple hundred security issues, almost all in webkit (those end up in Android & BB as well). Blackberry 7 has been considered the most secure, but it's a huge step backwards from Android. We don't know about BB10 yet.
- itry 14y ago
  If a non-jailbroken phone is secure, then how is it possible to jailbreak it?
  - ricardobeat 14y ago
    With physical access to the device. There still isn't an untethered jailbreak for iOS6. And even after a jailbreak, your data remains encrypted. Jailbreak software uses 0-day attacks found by a small group of very skilled researchers/developers, which end up fixed in the next release. The same way you can root android.
runjake 14y ago
An unjailbroken iOS device. I would specifically recommended against the BlackBerry option others have offered. It is a poorly-coded platform (complete with an old, expoitable WebKit browser and J2ME) that is a popular hacking target (despite being practically dead in the consumer space) it still sees lots of use by lucrative targets in the corporate/govt space. For all its power and awesomeness, I would also recommend against Android (vanilla or otherwise) if your focus is on security and data integrity. Edit: You can downvote me, but consider the contrast in difficulty between rooting/jailbreaking iOS (and the iOS BootROM) vs. rooting/unlocking any given Android device's system and bootloader as a class example.
- tarabukka 14y ago
  iOS has a jailbreak for every single version. Some have even used a variety of exploits to do this straight from the web. Apple have no magic up their sleeve that makes iOS 'more secure'; they are running on a normal CPU with a normal kernel. Apple users are more proactive in updating because they're nagged by the interface they're forced to use (iTunes) to update.
  - gmac 14y ago
    Apple users are more proactive in updating because they're nagged by the interface they're forced to use (iTunes) to update. The reason doesn't matter here, does it? It's also because updates are certain to be available for several years after a device's launch. Unlike some Android handsets, for which support is quickly abandoned.
  - Tloewald 14y ago
    Jailbreaking is generally voluntary on the user's part. Correct me if I'm wrong but insofar as you could jailbreak an ios device by visiting a url that would be an epic zero day exploit. Apple's secret is not allowing you to download and execute code from random websites. Oh, and memory protection.
    - tarabukka 14y ago
      The exploit used in comex's jailbreakme was just a PDF vulnerability. Sliding the "slide to jailbreak" simply loaded the correct PDF with some JavaScript; it wasn't actually needed. Memory protection? That's a basic feature of a kernel? Are we talking about each platform's ability for native code to mmap() executable memory or something?
drzaiusapelord 14y ago
Why not flash CM on there? Not sure what kernel they're using for your S3, but its probably not the stock Samsung one. Even then, patches will be first from CM and months later (if ever) from the OEM & Carrier's internal politics that controls your phone. Or if you want to spend money, a Nexus phone is your best bet. No carrier/OEM customizations and Google seems to give a shit about security and stability. This is what I have and I recommend it. Man, I'd love to buy a Samsung Note, but Touchwiz scares me. Its a security nightmare, gaudy as all hell, slow, battery drain, and only gets updated when Samsung and T-mobile think it should get updated. I'm also looking into Windows phone as android is becoming a nightmare of "too many cooks" and Google doesn't seem to have the ability or desire to stop this mess.
- MichaelGG 14y ago
  In the comments, someone mentions its a problem on CM too, because the problem is the Samsung driver itself - the camera works by doing direct memory access via this module, but it isn't restricted to the right memory regions. Someone did post a fix if you're building your own: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showpost.php?p=35541696&postcount=61 http://forum.xda-developers.com/showpost.php?p=35541696&...
  - thefreeman 14y ago
    CM has already been updated with the fix
bdcravens 14y ago
Get as close to the OS vendor as possible. Less deviation from original intent, presumably more focus on engineering (yes, I know Nexus phones aren't made by Google, but by various vendors who also make their "own" versions), and you get updates much faster in the event of a security concern. I have an S3 - I knew I was getting outside of the Android ecosystem to some degree when I first powered up the phone and saw the AT&T logo splash screen. Then you get into the phone and see all the cute little Samsung apps. Reminds me of buying a Windows PC :-) You can regain some of what I described above by rooting and locking your phone down. However, as you described your needs, an iPhone is ideal. An Android phone gives you a lot of power, but it doesn't sound like you need that much power, and for most people, security trumps customization.
sinnerswing 14y ago
what do you need a "serious secure phone" for? Android's "open".
- sinnerswing 14y ago
  Seriously. since Android is open anyone can just patch this up and distribute it to millions of affected Android phones worldwide. There's nothing to worry about!
rprasad 14y ago
Use the phones that all intelligence agencies use: Blackberry. Give a CIA tech an iPhone, Android, or WinPho, and he'll have access to all of your data (on the phone) before you've finished putting the phone down. Comparing the security on these devices to the security of a Blackberry is like comparing picket fences to the shield walls of Mordor. Blackberry's may not be hip, but they were designed from the beginning to be secure.
- tptacek 14y ago
  No, this isn't true.
- wglb 14y ago
  Perhaps you have forgotten Willem Pinckaers, a reverse engineer for Matasano Security in California, and Vincenzo Iozzo breaking the blackberry at Pwn2Own?

alexmunroe 14y ago

As unpopular a suggestion as this may be, Blackberry's are very secure particularly if you enable some of the more advanced security features such as secure memory and full device encryption. A lot of research has been undertaken at my University into this recently and very little progress has been made. The obvious downside is that the App eco system is still very poor compared to both iOS and Android and the UI leaves a lot to be desired. It depends really on whether you favour security over usability.

driverdan 14y ago

This is only a serious exploit if you install an app that exploits it. If you only use email, SMS/text and web browsing and don't install any apps you should be fine. If you want a more secure Android phone get Google's (currently Nexus 4). It won't have all the BS that 3rd parties add, like this.

fulafel 14y ago
It's a break from the sandbox so any vulnerability in an app (eg outdated WebKit, the norm on non-google devices) now compromised your whole device.
stusmall 14y ago
This is just one on the list of a few I've seen. There was also the infamous remote execution of USSD codes and another major exploit via the document reader(If I remember correctly some people where hyping that as an NFC attck). I understand bugs and exploits happen, but this proc interface and the USSD attack were just silly. I'd just like something designed inside a culture of security.

ricardobeat 14y ago

A stock iPhone (non-jailbroken)? There hasn't been any widespread security hole since the early days of jailbreaking via PNG. iOS6 fixed a couple hundred security issues, almost all in webkit (those end up in Android & BB as well). Blackberry 7 has been considered the most secure, but it's a huge step backwards from Android. We don't know about BB10 yet.

itry 14y ago
If a non-jailbroken phone is secure, then how is it possible to jailbreak it?
- ricardobeat 14y ago
  With physical access to the device. There still isn't an untethered jailbreak for iOS6. And even after a jailbreak, your data remains encrypted. Jailbreak software uses 0-day attacks found by a small group of very skilled researchers/developers, which end up fixed in the next release. The same way you can root android.

runjake 14y ago

An unjailbroken iOS device. I would specifically recommended against the BlackBerry option others have offered. It is a poorly-coded platform (complete with an old, expoitable WebKit browser and J2ME) that is a popular hacking target (despite being practically dead in the consumer space) it still sees lots of use by lucrative targets in the corporate/govt space. For all its power and awesomeness, I would also recommend against Android (vanilla or otherwise) if your focus is on security and data integrity. Edit: You can downvote me, but consider the contrast in difficulty between rooting/jailbreaking iOS (and the iOS BootROM) vs. rooting/unlocking any given Android device's system and bootloader as a class example.

tarabukka 14y ago
iOS has a jailbreak for every single version. Some have even used a variety of exploits to do this straight from the web. Apple have no magic up their sleeve that makes iOS 'more secure'; they are running on a normal CPU with a normal kernel. Apple users are more proactive in updating because they're nagged by the interface they're forced to use (iTunes) to update.
- gmac 14y ago
  Apple users are more proactive in updating because they're nagged by the interface they're forced to use (iTunes) to update. The reason doesn't matter here, does it? It's also because updates are certain to be available for several years after a device's launch. Unlike some Android handsets, for which support is quickly abandoned.
- Tloewald 14y ago
  Jailbreaking is generally voluntary on the user's part. Correct me if I'm wrong but insofar as you could jailbreak an ios device by visiting a url that would be an epic zero day exploit. Apple's secret is not allowing you to download and execute code from random websites. Oh, and memory protection.
  - tarabukka 14y ago
    The exploit used in comex's jailbreakme was just a PDF vulnerability. Sliding the "slide to jailbreak" simply loaded the correct PDF with some JavaScript; it wasn't actually needed. Memory protection? That's a basic feature of a kernel? Are we talking about each platform's ability for native code to mmap() executable memory or something?

drzaiusapelord 14y ago

Why not flash CM on there? Not sure what kernel they're using for your S3, but its probably not the stock Samsung one. Even then, patches will be first from CM and months later (if ever) from the OEM & Carrier's internal politics that controls your phone. Or if you want to spend money, a Nexus phone is your best bet. No carrier/OEM customizations and Google seems to give a shit about security and stability. This is what I have and I recommend it. Man, I'd love to buy a Samsung Note, but Touchwiz scares me. Its a security nightmare, gaudy as all hell, slow, battery drain, and only gets updated when Samsung and T-mobile think it should get updated. I'm also looking into Windows phone as android is becoming a nightmare of "too many cooks" and Google doesn't seem to have the ability or desire to stop this mess.

MichaelGG 14y ago
In the comments, someone mentions its a problem on CM too, because the problem is the Samsung driver itself - the camera works by doing direct memory access via this module, but it isn't restricted to the right memory regions. Someone did post a fix if you're building your own: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showpost.php?p=35541696&postcount=61 http://forum.xda-developers.com/showpost.php?p=35541696&...
- thefreeman 14y ago
  CM has already been updated with the fix

bdcravens 14y ago

Get as close to the OS vendor as possible. Less deviation from original intent, presumably more focus on engineering (yes, I know Nexus phones aren't made by Google, but by various vendors who also make their "own" versions), and you get updates much faster in the event of a security concern. I have an S3 - I knew I was getting outside of the Android ecosystem to some degree when I first powered up the phone and saw the AT&T logo splash screen. Then you get into the phone and see all the cute little Samsung apps. Reminds me of buying a Windows PC :-) You can regain some of what I described above by rooting and locking your phone down. However, as you described your needs, an iPhone is ideal. An Android phone gives you a lot of power, but it doesn't sound like you need that much power, and for most people, security trumps customization.

sinnerswing 14y ago

what do you need a "serious secure phone" for? Android's "open".

sinnerswing 14y ago
Seriously. since Android is open anyone can just patch this up and distribute it to millions of affected Android phones worldwide. There's nothing to worry about!

rprasad 14y ago

Use the phones that all intelligence agencies use: Blackberry. Give a CIA tech an iPhone, Android, or WinPho, and he'll have access to all of your data (on the phone) before you've finished putting the phone down. Comparing the security on these devices to the security of a Blackberry is like comparing picket fences to the shield walls of Mordor. Blackberry's may not be hip, but they were designed from the beginning to be secure.

tptacek 14y ago
No, this isn't true.
wglb 14y ago
Perhaps you have forgotten Willem Pinckaers, a reverse engineer for Matasano Security in California, and Vincenzo Iozzo breaking the blackberry at Pwn2Own?