3 ms·

In my experience the issue is one of torque, not of power. Most cheaper electric bicycles (including most Decathlon models) have a hub-mounted motor which canno

In my experience the issue is one of torque, not of power. Most cheaper electric bicycles (including most Decathlon models) have a hub-mounted motor which cannot deliver power effectively at low speeds -> it stops assisting when you most need it. For hilly terrain you need a motor that's mounted on the crankshaft so that it can take advantage of the gears. To compare: a tour de france runner outputs 400-500W on mountain climbs while keeping up to 20-25km/h. So a 500W motor (plus 100W power output from yourself) should be enough for smaller climbs!

DonHopkins 2mo ago
My Koga has an Enviolo stepless bicycle automatic transmission, which frees me from thinking about shifting, so I can pay more attention to riding safely and effortlessly. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=48761621 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=48761621 DonHopkins 44 days ago | root | parent | prev | next [–] Enviolo stepless bicycle automatic transmission (never manually shift again, accelerate while continuously shifting under load), with a carbon fiber belt drive (maintainance free, silent, never get grease on your pants or hands again), and Bosch Performance Line mid-motor (strong zippy performance from the geniuses who paid a €90 million fine for Dieselgate), plus GPS tracker with "recovery service" (required for insurance). https://enviolo.com/ https://enviolo.com/ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TQrgKBQrkag https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TQrgKBQrkag https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6xY2S-9gjHI https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6xY2S-9gjHI https://www.koga.com/en/enviolo-gear-hub https://www.koga.com/en/enviolo-gear-hub https://www.koga.com/en/bikes/e-bikes/evia-pro-automatic?frame=D https://www.koga.com/en/bikes/e-bikes/evia-pro-automatic?fra... It's a dream bike, optimized for comfort and city riding, but Koga is not available in the US, though. Here's an American bike that has similar features (not as nice as the high-end Koga Evia Pro Automatic though), the Harley Davidson Rush/CTY (step through model is easiest to mount/unmount/ride): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4SjN8RN9g7Y https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4SjN8RN9g7Y https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KoX9S5UhETE https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KoX9S5UhETE https://serial1.nl/ https://serial1.nl/ The Enviolo Automatic also come in a heavy duty version paired with high performance motors for bakfiets (cargo bikes), for 3-4 children, big dogs, and groceries: https://batavus.com/en-nl/products/fier-3-bbfn3 https://batavus.com/en-nl/products/fier-3-bbfn3 https://www.dw.com/en/bosch-pays-90-million-euro-fine-over-d https://www.dw.com/en/bosch-pays-90-million-euro-fine-over-d... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Volkswagen_emissions_scandal https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Volkswagen_emissions_scandal Edit: Fair, they're ideal for city bikes, stop-and-go traffic, and the flat Dutch landscape where they're produced, where the biggest "mountains" you encounter are the bridges over canals. Their city model has 310%, trekking 380%, and the new utility hub has 400% gear range, which you can use on a normal bike, bakfiets, or speed pedelec. https://enviolo.com/news/enviolo-launches-the-utility-hub/ https://enviolo.com/news/enviolo-launches-the-utility-hub/
- skeeter2020 2mo ago
  >> so I can pay more attention to riding safely and effortlessly. If shifting gears takes to much of your attention, I'm concerned for all of us, and why do you need to pay more attention to riding "effortlessly"?
  - DonHopkins 2mo ago
    Simple. There is this thing in psychology called "Cognitive Load". Automatic transmissions and continuous transmissions reduce it. That's why most people don't drive a stick shifted manual transmission car any more. It works the same for bikes. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cognitive_load https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cognitive_load Have you ever ridden a bike with a geared derailleur, and forgotten to shift into low gear at an intersection, or had to suddenly stop before you had a chance to shift into low gear, so it's more difficult getting started again? Did you notice how it's impossible to shift while you're stopped, and how tricky it is to get it from high back into low while you're starting, especially up hill, and how you can't shift while you're applying force, so you have to push yourself forward instead of pedaling to get it rolling enough to downshift while gently pedaling without accelerating? A continuous hub fixes those problems, and an automatic transmission shifts you into low when you stop (even if you're not moving), and smoothly and continuously shifts back up while you're accelerating, and the continuous hub allows you to apply power while it's shifting (note I didn't say "changing gears" -- it's continuous, and doesn't have gears. It has planets and fluid instead. It can shift while it's stopped, and accelerate while it's shifting. You have a lot more important things to worry about when you're accelerating from a stop at a busy intersection than pushing off and shifting without applying acceleration and only pedaling forcefully once you've finished shifting into low gear. If you're riding a bakfiets (cargo bike) with your kids and a dog in the box, then you definitely have things you need to worry about more than shifting gears, and because of the mass and precious cargo, it's even more important to be able to accelerate from a stop without performing a derailleur dance in the middle of a busy intersection. It's a trick you have to learn just like using the parking break when starting a manual transmission car facing up hill. Manual transmissions have a much higher cognitive load in both cars and bikes. This kind of stuff should be intuitive if you've ever ridden a bike with more than one gear, or driven a stick shift car. Sure it gives you "more control", but more control = higher cognative load, and you're probably not a NASCAR race car driver who needs to optimize for control. It's all explained here: https://enviolo.com/products/ https://enviolo.com/products/ The Enviolo stepless CVP technology explained: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6xY2S-9gjHI https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6xY2S-9gjHI Is enviolo the best internally geared hub for eBikes? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vob5Rb4IKsw https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vob5Rb4IKsw He talks about shifting when you're stopped at 2:32.

DonHopkins 2mo ago

My Koga has an Enviolo stepless bicycle automatic transmission, which frees me from thinking about shifting, so I can pay more attention to riding safely and effortlessly. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=48761621 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=48761621 DonHopkins 44 days ago | root | parent | prev | next [–] Enviolo stepless bicycle automatic transmission (never manually shift again, accelerate while continuously shifting under load), with a carbon fiber belt drive (maintainance free, silent, never get grease on your pants or hands again), and Bosch Performance Line mid-motor (strong zippy performance from the geniuses who paid a €90 million fine for Dieselgate), plus GPS tracker with "recovery service" (required for insurance). https://enviolo.com/ https://enviolo.com/ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TQrgKBQrkag https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TQrgKBQrkag https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6xY2S-9gjHI https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6xY2S-9gjHI https://www.koga.com/en/enviolo-gear-hub https://www.koga.com/en/enviolo-gear-hub https://www.koga.com/en/bikes/e-bikes/evia-pro-automatic?frame=D https://www.koga.com/en/bikes/e-bikes/evia-pro-automatic?fra... It's a dream bike, optimized for comfort and city riding, but Koga is not available in the US, though. Here's an American bike that has similar features (not as nice as the high-end Koga Evia Pro Automatic though), the Harley Davidson Rush/CTY (step through model is easiest to mount/unmount/ride): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4SjN8RN9g7Y https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4SjN8RN9g7Y https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KoX9S5UhETE https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KoX9S5UhETE https://serial1.nl/ https://serial1.nl/ The Enviolo Automatic also come in a heavy duty version paired with high performance motors for bakfiets (cargo bikes), for 3-4 children, big dogs, and groceries: https://batavus.com/en-nl/products/fier-3-bbfn3 https://batavus.com/en-nl/products/fier-3-bbfn3 https://www.dw.com/en/bosch-pays-90-million-euro-fine-over-d https://www.dw.com/en/bosch-pays-90-million-euro-fine-over-d... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Volkswagen_emissions_scandal https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Volkswagen_emissions_scandal Edit: Fair, they're ideal for city bikes, stop-and-go traffic, and the flat Dutch landscape where they're produced, where the biggest "mountains" you encounter are the bridges over canals. Their city model has 310%, trekking 380%, and the new utility hub has 400% gear range, which you can use on a normal bike, bakfiets, or speed pedelec. https://enviolo.com/news/enviolo-launches-the-utility-hub/ https://enviolo.com/news/enviolo-launches-the-utility-hub/

skeeter2020 2mo ago
>> so I can pay more attention to riding safely and effortlessly. If shifting gears takes to much of your attention, I'm concerned for all of us, and why do you need to pay more attention to riding "effortlessly"?
- DonHopkins 2mo ago
  Simple. There is this thing in psychology called "Cognitive Load". Automatic transmissions and continuous transmissions reduce it. That's why most people don't drive a stick shifted manual transmission car any more. It works the same for bikes. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cognitive_load https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cognitive_load Have you ever ridden a bike with a geared derailleur, and forgotten to shift into low gear at an intersection, or had to suddenly stop before you had a chance to shift into low gear, so it's more difficult getting started again? Did you notice how it's impossible to shift while you're stopped, and how tricky it is to get it from high back into low while you're starting, especially up hill, and how you can't shift while you're applying force, so you have to push yourself forward instead of pedaling to get it rolling enough to downshift while gently pedaling without accelerating? A continuous hub fixes those problems, and an automatic transmission shifts you into low when you stop (even if you're not moving), and smoothly and continuously shifts back up while you're accelerating, and the continuous hub allows you to apply power while it's shifting (note I didn't say "changing gears" -- it's continuous, and doesn't have gears. It has planets and fluid instead. It can shift while it's stopped, and accelerate while it's shifting. You have a lot more important things to worry about when you're accelerating from a stop at a busy intersection than pushing off and shifting without applying acceleration and only pedaling forcefully once you've finished shifting into low gear. If you're riding a bakfiets (cargo bike) with your kids and a dog in the box, then you definitely have things you need to worry about more than shifting gears, and because of the mass and precious cargo, it's even more important to be able to accelerate from a stop without performing a derailleur dance in the middle of a busy intersection. It's a trick you have to learn just like using the parking break when starting a manual transmission car facing up hill. Manual transmissions have a much higher cognitive load in both cars and bikes. This kind of stuff should be intuitive if you've ever ridden a bike with more than one gear, or driven a stick shift car. Sure it gives you "more control", but more control = higher cognative load, and you're probably not a NASCAR race car driver who needs to optimize for control. It's all explained here: https://enviolo.com/products/ https://enviolo.com/products/ The Enviolo stepless CVP technology explained: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6xY2S-9gjHI https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6xY2S-9gjHI Is enviolo the best internally geared hub for eBikes? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vob5Rb4IKsw https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vob5Rb4IKsw He talks about shifting when you're stopped at 2:32.