3 ms·

Theft is solved by making society better, not worse. Make people not want or reliant upon crime to survive.

by AngryData 2mo ago

mik1998 2mo ago
No one relies on bike theft to "survive".
- a2800276 2mo ago
  That's right, people steal bikes because they are inherently evil and want to make baby Jesus cry. I think it's ok to define "survive" as an addict who needs (<-also loosely defined) a fix. You don't generally commit serious white collar crime, tax fraud or do crypto grifts to survive. For petty street crime, I don't really see any other motivation.
  - mik1998 2mo ago
    There are a lot of teenagers stealing bikes and other stuff for fun. It's common, and in many circles very "cool". Doesn't have to be inherent, really.
  - PunchyHamster 2mo ago
    People will steal bike, go where they need to go and just abandon it lmfao
- AngryData 2mo ago
  No one goes around stealing bikes just because they want to do bad things.
  - mik1998 2mo ago
    There is a large amount of people who go around stealing bikes for fun and some cash; and often "street cred" or something akin to that.
    - AngryData 2mo ago
      Then maybe society should be improved upon so that a few dollars or a few minutes of "fun" or "street cred" isn't seen as such a boon to their life that people risk jail time for it. The US tried "tough on crime" approaches, what has it resulted in? 25% of the entire world's prison population and it still has higher crime rates than its peer nations.
      - skeeter2020 2mo ago
        Good plan; instead of a decent bike lock, and asking for some (read: ANY) enforcement & punishment of bike theft I'll just "improve society".
      - SoftTalker 2mo ago
        Nobody goes to jail for stealing bikes. Here, the cops will take a report but that's it. It doesn't get investigated. There's a very good chance any homeless person with a bike is in posession of a stolen bike but they don't even fish in that barrel.
  - barrenko 2mo ago
    My brother in Christ.
  - inejge 2mo ago
    "Let's go get sushi and not pay." -- Repo Man, 1984. That's into the absurdist territory, but it reflects the real pattern of behavior. People do go around committing petty crimes for various reasons.
    - AngryData 2mo ago
      And you presume that type of criminality would remain about the same regardless of how society is organized or what type of culture is reinforced? I think there are many other and better things to try than the repeated failure of trying to catch and punish crimes even more harshly.
  - skeeter2020 2mo ago
    nobody steals bikes to buy milk for their baby either.
  - deleted 2mo ago
    [deleted]
- Toutouxc 2mo ago
  What are you basing that on?
adwn 2mo ago
> Theft is solved by making society better, not worse. Phew, good to hear. Here I thought it would be a hard and complex problem, with lots of unknown unknowns, difficult political compromises, a generation-spanning efforts and many potential solutions with uncertain outcomes, partially contradicting each other. Instead, we just have to make society better. So, what's step 1?
- AngryData 2mo ago
  Step 1 could be not turning the world into a an Orwellian nightmare and outlawing mass surveillance, from both government and private corporations. And if you are still worried about theft in the mean time, you could try looking at wage thefts which has a value greater than all other forms of theft combined.
  - adwn 2mo ago
    > Step 1 could be not turning the world into a an Orwellian nightmare and outlawing mass surveillance, from both government and private corporations. That would make society better, I agree, but I don't see how that would lead to a reduction in theft, or crime in general. > And if you are still worried about theft in the mean time, you could try looking at wage thefts […] I'm not worried about wage theft, no. I am worried about theft of my personal property, though. And I notice that you haven't proposed any credible path to reducing it, beyond an incredibly generic "make society better", whatever that means and however you want to achieve that.
mlrtime 2mo ago
"reliant upon crime to survive" Do we have any sources that people are stealing to survive? What definition of surviving are we using here?
raverbashing 2mo ago
Repeat after me "Criminals are not Alladin"

Theft is solved by making society better, not worse. Make people not want or reliant upon crime to survive.

mik1998 2mo ago

No one relies on bike theft to "survive".

a2800276 2mo ago
That's right, people steal bikes because they are inherently evil and want to make baby Jesus cry. I think it's ok to define "survive" as an addict who needs (<-also loosely defined) a fix. You don't generally commit serious white collar crime, tax fraud or do crypto grifts to survive. For petty street crime, I don't really see any other motivation.
- mik1998 2mo ago
  There are a lot of teenagers stealing bikes and other stuff for fun. It's common, and in many circles very "cool". Doesn't have to be inherent, really.
- PunchyHamster 2mo ago
  People will steal bike, go where they need to go and just abandon it lmfao
AngryData 2mo ago
No one goes around stealing bikes just because they want to do bad things.
- mik1998 2mo ago
  There is a large amount of people who go around stealing bikes for fun and some cash; and often "street cred" or something akin to that.
  - AngryData 2mo ago
    Then maybe society should be improved upon so that a few dollars or a few minutes of "fun" or "street cred" isn't seen as such a boon to their life that people risk jail time for it. The US tried "tough on crime" approaches, what has it resulted in? 25% of the entire world's prison population and it still has higher crime rates than its peer nations.
    - skeeter2020 2mo ago
      Good plan; instead of a decent bike lock, and asking for some (read: ANY) enforcement & punishment of bike theft I'll just "improve society".
    - SoftTalker 2mo ago
      Nobody goes to jail for stealing bikes. Here, the cops will take a report but that's it. It doesn't get investigated. There's a very good chance any homeless person with a bike is in posession of a stolen bike but they don't even fish in that barrel.
- barrenko 2mo ago
  My brother in Christ.
- inejge 2mo ago
  "Let's go get sushi and not pay." -- Repo Man, 1984. That's into the absurdist territory, but it reflects the real pattern of behavior. People do go around committing petty crimes for various reasons.
  - AngryData 2mo ago
    And you presume that type of criminality would remain about the same regardless of how society is organized or what type of culture is reinforced? I think there are many other and better things to try than the repeated failure of trying to catch and punish crimes even more harshly.
- skeeter2020 2mo ago
  nobody steals bikes to buy milk for their baby either.
- deleted 2mo ago
  [deleted]
Toutouxc 2mo ago
What are you basing that on?

adwn 2mo ago

> Theft is solved by making society better, not worse. Phew, good to hear. Here I thought it would be a hard and complex problem, with lots of unknown unknowns, difficult political compromises, a generation-spanning efforts and many potential solutions with uncertain outcomes, partially contradicting each other. Instead, we just have to make society better. So, what's step 1?

AngryData 2mo ago
Step 1 could be not turning the world into a an Orwellian nightmare and outlawing mass surveillance, from both government and private corporations. And if you are still worried about theft in the mean time, you could try looking at wage thefts which has a value greater than all other forms of theft combined.
- adwn 2mo ago
  > Step 1 could be not turning the world into a an Orwellian nightmare and outlawing mass surveillance, from both government and private corporations. That would make society better, I agree, but I don't see how that would lead to a reduction in theft, or crime in general. > And if you are still worried about theft in the mean time, you could try looking at wage thefts […] I'm not worried about wage theft, no. I am worried about theft of my personal property, though. And I notice that you haven't proposed any credible path to reducing it, beyond an incredibly generic "make society better", whatever that means and however you want to achieve that.

mlrtime 2mo ago

"reliant upon crime to survive" Do we have any sources that people are stealing to survive? What definition of surviving are we using here?

raverbashing 2mo ago

Repeat after me "Criminals are not Alladin"