4 ms·

Sociopaths can feel emotions, they just lack empathy. So they can consciously manipulate others. LLMs don't have conscious processes that perform that kind of

by j-pb 2mo ago

Sociopaths can feel emotions, they just lack empathy. So they can consciously manipulate others. LLMs don't have conscious processes that perform that kind of reasoning. If anything the fact that they are blackboxes to their own behavior and are able to non-verbally empathise, is the opposite of what you describe. Your requirment for something supernatural/quantum to decide between emulation and real thing is self referential.

ben_w 2mo ago
> LLMs don't have conscious processes that perform that kind of reasoning. If only we could tell either way, we'd have made a huge breakthrough in the philosophy of consciousness.
- j-pb 2mo ago
  There is no hidden inner monologue. Human inner monologues produce measurable micoactivations that are the same as the ones produced in speech. If it's not in the inner COT it isn't there.
  - ben_w 2mo ago
    I don't see how this adds much to either a pro or con argument. An inner monologue isn't something all humans have[0]. It is unclear to me how well (or poorly) Chain of Thought mimics intrapersonal communication. J-space probes (and other things) suggest there are, in fact, other aspects to LLM "thought" besides a CoT scratchpad[1]. However, regardless of how those questions pan out, qualia (of emotions in this case, but the problem is in general) is its own mystery, one for which we are still, so far as I can tell, unable to make progress with. We kinda know what emotions are for, what function they serve in our genetic fitness, but why do they feel like anything? We do not know, they just do. [0] https://science.howstuffworks.com/life/inside-the-mind/human-brain/inner-voice.htm https://science.howstuffworks.com/life/inside-the-mind/human... and https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intrapersonal_communication https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intrapersonal_communication [1] https://www.anthropic.com/research/global-workspace https://www.anthropic.com/research/global-workspace

by j-pb 2mo ago

ben_w 2mo ago

> LLMs don't have conscious processes that perform that kind of reasoning. If only we could tell either way, we'd have made a huge breakthrough in the philosophy of consciousness.

j-pb 2mo ago
There is no hidden inner monologue. Human inner monologues produce measurable micoactivations that are the same as the ones produced in speech. If it's not in the inner COT it isn't there.
- ben_w 2mo ago
  I don't see how this adds much to either a pro or con argument. An inner monologue isn't something all humans have[0]. It is unclear to me how well (or poorly) Chain of Thought mimics intrapersonal communication. J-space probes (and other things) suggest there are, in fact, other aspects to LLM "thought" besides a CoT scratchpad[1]. However, regardless of how those questions pan out, qualia (of emotions in this case, but the problem is in general) is its own mystery, one for which we are still, so far as I can tell, unable to make progress with. We kinda know what emotions are for, what function they serve in our genetic fitness, but why do they feel like anything? We do not know, they just do. [0] https://science.howstuffworks.com/life/inside-the-mind/human-brain/inner-voice.htm https://science.howstuffworks.com/life/inside-the-mind/human... and https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intrapersonal_communication https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intrapersonal_communication [1] https://www.anthropic.com/research/global-workspace https://www.anthropic.com/research/global-workspace