3 ms·

> And your gasoline pump works perfectly fine without power? Most decent emergency / contingency plans will have the fire department, police or whatever local

> And your gasoline pump works perfectly fine without power? Most decent emergency / contingency plans will have the fire department, police or whatever local group show up at one or two designated gas stations to provide power, or require these stations to have on-site emergency power.

vel0city 2mo ago
As someone who has actually lived through multiple major catastrophes where fuel couldn't get delivered for days and electricity was out for days, when the pumps stop working there is no gas. Don't assume the gasoline the police and fire department have will be there for you. It's there for the first responders. They don't have infinite supply. Their supply is extra expensive to handle compared to when things were working. You've now got many thousands of families all trying to get to the two or three operating fuel stations...trust me they're not open to the public! When you're out of gas, you're out of gas. Meanwhile, those with solar panels not reliant on grid-tie, they can continue to charge their vehicles.
thelastgallon 2mo ago
If your refinery is taken out, it might take years to rebuild it.
- ben_w 2mo ago
  If it was that easy, Ukraine would have already brought Russia to its knees. Because the Russian government is still telling themselves they can win and don't even bother trying to negotiate with Ukraine but instead the USA, this must not be the case.
- codedokode 2mo ago
  Not years.
  - M95D 2mo ago
    Years in US. Not years in China, Russia, elsewhere.
mirmor23 2mo ago
> Most decent emergency / contingency plans will have the fire department, police or whatever local group show up at one or two designated gas stations to provide power, or require these stations to have on-site emergency power. this is just nonsense. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2025_Iberian_Peninsula_blackout https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2025_Iberian_Peninsula_blackou... while traveling i got caught up in this. no restaurants, no credit cards working, no grocery stores, no cell connection, no navigation with phone, no gas station. the goddam list goes on. fortunately this was less than 16 hours.
- codedokode 2mo ago
  If you used cash as a reasonable person you would not even notice that cards aren't working.
  - soco 2mo ago
    How many shops will be open without power? No till, no light, no refrigerator... not sure how much will help you having cash, beyond a couple of very basic needs - I can't even tell which, nor can you, it's gonna be an adventure either way.
    - codedokode 2mo ago
      Bread doesn't need a refrigerator and you can sell it directly from a truck.
      - ben_w 2mo ago
        Bread needs power to get made, and with no electricity the gas pumps that no longer work are not filling up any delivery trucks either. Fortunately PV and wind and local batteries are getting deployed everywhere fast and electric trucks are starting to become a thing. Some places might even have enough for basic logistics in a war that cuts out their oil supply like wars tend to because they're obvious weak points.
  - hombre_fatal 2mo ago

vel0city 2mo ago

As someone who has actually lived through multiple major catastrophes where fuel couldn't get delivered for days and electricity was out for days, when the pumps stop working there is no gas. Don't assume the gasoline the police and fire department have will be there for you. It's there for the first responders. They don't have infinite supply. Their supply is extra expensive to handle compared to when things were working. You've now got many thousands of families all trying to get to the two or three operating fuel stations...trust me they're not open to the public! When you're out of gas, you're out of gas. Meanwhile, those with solar panels not reliant on grid-tie, they can continue to charge their vehicles.

thelastgallon 2mo ago

If your refinery is taken out, it might take years to rebuild it.

ben_w 2mo ago
If it was that easy, Ukraine would have already brought Russia to its knees. Because the Russian government is still telling themselves they can win and don't even bother trying to negotiate with Ukraine but instead the USA, this must not be the case.
codedokode 2mo ago
Not years.
- M95D 2mo ago
  Years in US. Not years in China, Russia, elsewhere.

mirmor23 2mo ago

> Most decent emergency / contingency plans will have the fire department, police or whatever local group show up at one or two designated gas stations to provide power, or require these stations to have on-site emergency power. this is just nonsense. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2025_Iberian_Peninsula_blackout https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2025_Iberian_Peninsula_blackou... while traveling i got caught up in this. no restaurants, no credit cards working, no grocery stores, no cell connection, no navigation with phone, no gas station. the goddam list goes on. fortunately this was less than 16 hours.

codedokode 2mo ago
If you used cash as a reasonable person you would not even notice that cards aren't working.
- soco 2mo ago
  How many shops will be open without power? No till, no light, no refrigerator... not sure how much will help you having cash, beyond a couple of very basic needs - I can't even tell which, nor can you, it's gonna be an adventure either way.
  - codedokode 2mo ago
    Bread doesn't need a refrigerator and you can sell it directly from a truck.
    - ben_w 2mo ago
      Bread needs power to get made, and with no electricity the gas pumps that no longer work are not filling up any delivery trucks either. Fortunately PV and wind and local batteries are getting deployed everywhere fast and electric trucks are starting to become a thing. Some places might even have enough for basic logistics in a war that cuts out their oil supply like wars tend to because they're obvious weak points.
- hombre_fatal 2mo ago