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>their subscription now goes way further than OpenAI or Anthropic. Until it doesn't... Honestly, this entire OpenAI reset credit fiasco this past week has con

>their subscription now goes way further than OpenAI or Anthropic. Until it doesn't... Honestly, this entire OpenAI reset credit fiasco this past week has convinced me to rip off the Codex and Claude Code bandaids and start building my own proper Pi Coding Agent running models that I select and pay for on openrouter. And I am feeling a lot better about it now that I've finally got it working.

unglaublich 2mo ago
But still for US frontier you're paying 10-20x more per token compared to their limited subscriptions. For China frontier you'll be good though, and that might be the future anyway.
- maxdo 2mo ago
  Grok is cheaper vs real Chinese frontier aka kimi. Sponsored or not.
  - indigodaddy 2mo ago
    What's the cheapest way to use grok models for coding?
    - satvikpendem 2mo ago
      Cursor subscription as I mentioned
- johnnyApplePRNG 2mo ago
  Relying on a single frontier model to just zero-shot all the work is so 2025. Deepseek V4 Flash 0731 is surprisingly capable and cheap. [0] Checkout pi coding agent. You can create as many different sub-agents as you wish, to specialize and understand and tackle or pass off any problem you like. It's refreshing, really. I feel like a coder in control again. [0] https://arcprize.org/results/deepseek-v4-flash-0731 https://arcprize.org/results/deepseek-v4-flash-0731
embedding-shape 2mo ago
> Honestly, this entire OpenAI reset credit fiasco this past week Huh, what's happened? I'm on the 20x plan and haven't noticed any fiasco, what went down exactly?
- ModernMech 2mo ago
  Nothing really, when model usage goes up they do a credit. They did two last week.
  - wetoastfood 2mo ago
    Your reason for the rate limit reset is speculative. Here's a history of them and tweets that correspond to when they happen. Others can be the judge if they believe the stated reasons or not: https://codex-resets.com/ https://codex-resets.com/
  - throwaway314155 2mo ago
    Isn't this a _good_ thing??
    - ModernMech 2mo ago
      Yeah, but it also makes budgeting hard. Normally you'd want to budget about 20% per day to use your whole week up in time. But since they reset usage sporadically, it becomes optimal to burn tokens as fast as possible to be as low as possible when they reset. But since you don't know when resets are coming, it becomes kind of frustrating trying to game it out. One week they're resetting like crazy so you're trying to burn tokens as fast as possible. The next week they're not resetting at all so you have to adjust your workflow to be more conservative.
      - embedding-shape 2mo ago
        > use your whole week up in time [...] optimal to burn [...] trying to game it out [...] you're trying to burn tokens as fast This whole thing sounds crazy to me, why are you so focused on making sure you hit 0% usage left when it's supposed to reset? Why can't you just use what you have and if it resets, it resets, and if it doesn't, it doesn't? I've calculated I can spend about ~12% of usage every day, more or less, this is my "budget". If it resets, then the "12% per day" gets reset for that day, but that's it. Sounds crazy to me that I'd "invent work out of nowhere" just to spend more usage, why on earth would I adopt such a workflow? Sounds like you're burning tokens just to burn tokens???
hgoel 2mo ago
>Until it doesn't... I don't get the point of this. We all seem to agree that these companies have almost no moat, if one stops being a good deal, you can switch to another. That doesn't invalidate the existence of a deal that is currently good.
- johnnyApplePRNG 2mo ago
  No, it doesn't. My point was that chasing deals like this is just kicking the can down the road. You're going to have to reckon with harsh price increases sooner or later. So I have resolved to avoid that future-dreading and fixed it, basically.
  - andybak 2mo ago
    My entire digital existence for the last 20 years or so has been a parasitical relationship with VC funding. They keep throwing money at business models that involve building market share and I keep benefiting. It hasn't stopped working yet.
  - rsanek 2mo ago
    Based on your own comments, it sounds like it wasn't really that hard to address the problem though right? Let's be real, it takes like 10 minutes to download OpenCode and point it to DeepSeek V4 Flash. That's an amazing 80-20. Seems weird to me to not take advantage of the great deal the frontier labs are currently giving for subscription pricing when there's such an easy fallback in the worst case.
- 8note 2mo ago
  switching cost is something you then have to pay everytime the deal changes. the rest of the comment is about moving from expensive switching costs of what harness you are using to having the difference be closer to changing some config in openrouter
satvikpendem 2mo ago
An economist walks past a hundred dollar bill on the ground because someone would've picked it up already if it were real.

unglaublich 2mo ago

But still for US frontier you're paying 10-20x more per token compared to their limited subscriptions. For China frontier you'll be good though, and that might be the future anyway.

maxdo 2mo ago
Grok is cheaper vs real Chinese frontier aka kimi. Sponsored or not.
- indigodaddy 2mo ago
  What's the cheapest way to use grok models for coding?
  - satvikpendem 2mo ago
    Cursor subscription as I mentioned
johnnyApplePRNG 2mo ago
Relying on a single frontier model to just zero-shot all the work is so 2025. Deepseek V4 Flash 0731 is surprisingly capable and cheap. [0] Checkout pi coding agent. You can create as many different sub-agents as you wish, to specialize and understand and tackle or pass off any problem you like. It's refreshing, really. I feel like a coder in control again. [0] https://arcprize.org/results/deepseek-v4-flash-0731 https://arcprize.org/results/deepseek-v4-flash-0731

embedding-shape 2mo ago

> Honestly, this entire OpenAI reset credit fiasco this past week Huh, what's happened? I'm on the 20x plan and haven't noticed any fiasco, what went down exactly?

ModernMech 2mo ago
Nothing really, when model usage goes up they do a credit. They did two last week.
- wetoastfood 2mo ago
  Your reason for the rate limit reset is speculative. Here's a history of them and tweets that correspond to when they happen. Others can be the judge if they believe the stated reasons or not: https://codex-resets.com/ https://codex-resets.com/
- throwaway314155 2mo ago
  Isn't this a _good_ thing??
  - ModernMech 2mo ago
    Yeah, but it also makes budgeting hard. Normally you'd want to budget about 20% per day to use your whole week up in time. But since they reset usage sporadically, it becomes optimal to burn tokens as fast as possible to be as low as possible when they reset. But since you don't know when resets are coming, it becomes kind of frustrating trying to game it out. One week they're resetting like crazy so you're trying to burn tokens as fast as possible. The next week they're not resetting at all so you have to adjust your workflow to be more conservative.
    - embedding-shape 2mo ago
      > use your whole week up in time [...] optimal to burn [...] trying to game it out [...] you're trying to burn tokens as fast This whole thing sounds crazy to me, why are you so focused on making sure you hit 0% usage left when it's supposed to reset? Why can't you just use what you have and if it resets, it resets, and if it doesn't, it doesn't? I've calculated I can spend about ~12% of usage every day, more or less, this is my "budget". If it resets, then the "12% per day" gets reset for that day, but that's it. Sounds crazy to me that I'd "invent work out of nowhere" just to spend more usage, why on earth would I adopt such a workflow? Sounds like you're burning tokens just to burn tokens???

hgoel 2mo ago

>Until it doesn't... I don't get the point of this. We all seem to agree that these companies have almost no moat, if one stops being a good deal, you can switch to another. That doesn't invalidate the existence of a deal that is currently good.

johnnyApplePRNG 2mo ago
No, it doesn't. My point was that chasing deals like this is just kicking the can down the road. You're going to have to reckon with harsh price increases sooner or later. So I have resolved to avoid that future-dreading and fixed it, basically.
- andybak 2mo ago
  My entire digital existence for the last 20 years or so has been a parasitical relationship with VC funding. They keep throwing money at business models that involve building market share and I keep benefiting. It hasn't stopped working yet.
- rsanek 2mo ago
  Based on your own comments, it sounds like it wasn't really that hard to address the problem though right? Let's be real, it takes like 10 minutes to download OpenCode and point it to DeepSeek V4 Flash. That's an amazing 80-20. Seems weird to me to not take advantage of the great deal the frontier labs are currently giving for subscription pricing when there's such an easy fallback in the worst case.
8note 2mo ago
switching cost is something you then have to pay everytime the deal changes. the rest of the comment is about moving from expensive switching costs of what harness you are using to having the difference be closer to changing some config in openrouter

satvikpendem 2mo ago

An economist walks past a hundred dollar bill on the ground because someone would've picked it up already if it were real.