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You certainly accidentally start listening to gangster rap when it's played on TV, on the radio, or on the auto playlists from streaming services. Or you wouldn

You certainly accidentally start listening to gangster rap when it's played on TV, on the radio, or on the auto playlists from streaming services. Or you wouldn't turn on your radio by accident, but then you wouldn't open Facebook by accident either. Gangster rap has inspired a lot of murders and other violent crime world wide, I don't think anybody would deny that anymore. So if we treat it as harmless entertainment, then we should apply the same standard to content published on social media. Publishing genocidal content would be beyond that, nobody would disagree. Still, what music do you think that African child soldiers listen to when they go on a raid to burn a village and kill everybody they find? As for violent movies or torture horror movies which are so celebrated in mainstream culture, their impact on viewers minds and souls are probably worse than a lot of what people here don't like on Facebook.

wpietri 2mo ago
> Gangster rap has inspired a lot of murders and other violent crime world wide What's your evidence for this? You seem to be making the claim that without gangster rap there's a bunch of violent crime that wouldn't have happened. But it seems more plausible to me that the bulk of that crime is due to the drug trade and other social and economic factors, and that gangster rap is just the musical expression of what's already going on. And I'd expect the same to be true of, say, country music. Are you also going to claim that people who listened to a lot of Johnny Cash were more inclined to shoot people, possibly in Reno, just to watch them die? Did many Merle Haggard fans turn to crime because of him? Personally, I listened to plenty of Ice T, NWA, and Snoop. Sometimes I still do. I have yet to become a stick-up kid or pack a 9 mil. Should I be worried? If there's some sort of threshold dosage, I might go over it at any time.
- carlosjobim 2mo ago
  Well argued. Now will you apply all your same arguments to social media "rage bait"?
acdha 2mo ago
> Gangster rap has inspired a lot of murders and other violent crime world wide, I don't think anybody would deny that anymore Citation needed here. I haven’t known anyone to do that despite it being pretty mainstream and U.S. crime rates have been going down for ages so there doesn’t appear to be a general correlation (repeat for the video games which have been so railed against). I think most people understand the difference between entertainment and reality in that context. What makes social media different is that it’s portrayed as real: people get constant reinforcement that “people like me” think horrible things about Muslims, LGBTQ, liberals, etc. and use that to justify “strike first” messaging. We’ve seen that same playbook in the past (Bosnia, Rwanda, etc.) but those required more money and state control of media whereas social media is far more accessible to even a small minority of extremists looking to spread their messages. > Still, what music do you think that African child soldiers listen to when they go on a raid to burn a village and kill everybody they find? I note that you conspicuously omit the white-coded heavy metal used by other war criminals, but more importantly you’d need to again submit show some data supporting causation rather than simple popularity and answer the big question about whether it’s the case that the music has that effect or simply that people trying to indoctrinate use music which is already popular because it’s familiar and had the mood they wanted. For example, I don’t think anyone would say Metallica inspires torture despite it being used in the American torture program in Guantanamo — almost all of the millions of people who listen to their albums have never engaged in serious violence and the people who committed war crimes would’ve picked something else if they were in a different cultural context.
- carlosjobim 2mo ago
  If you truly deny the effect that gangster rap has, then I can't take your comment as honest. Then we might just as well say that ISIS propaganda also has no effect on their targeted audience, and their stuff is just for entertainment. Because what "citations" do you have that people can be influenced by ISIS propaganda. When a drill rapper makes a song threatening to murder specific people, and also posts these threats on social media, and finally commits to it and murders somebody. Is that not reality? Because it happens all the time. But maybe the social media post is the only problem in this situation? If political terrorists are listening to music all day about bombing cafés, kidnapping people, smuggling drugs and assassinating their enemies and they actually do so at thousands per year - would you say this music is just entertainment for people living in that world. Because that is exactly the situation with gangster rap, and has been for a long time. And you might listen to it just for entertainment so it's nothing to be concerned about. To you it's entertainment because you're comfortably distant from the effects. How do you think somebody who's had their sibling murdered by a gang feels hearing that gangs music being blasted where they rap about murdering and mutilating people? > the white-coded heavy metal used by other war criminals Whatever this is, it is not played on the radio all day and Sony and Warner aren't making millions from it and they're not performing at the half time show. Maybe their songs are catchy and they should be played in cafés and in your Uber. I've heard that some ISIS songs are supposed to be quite catchy.

wpietri 2mo ago

> Gangster rap has inspired a lot of murders and other violent crime world wide What's your evidence for this? You seem to be making the claim that without gangster rap there's a bunch of violent crime that wouldn't have happened. But it seems more plausible to me that the bulk of that crime is due to the drug trade and other social and economic factors, and that gangster rap is just the musical expression of what's already going on. And I'd expect the same to be true of, say, country music. Are you also going to claim that people who listened to a lot of Johnny Cash were more inclined to shoot people, possibly in Reno, just to watch them die? Did many Merle Haggard fans turn to crime because of him? Personally, I listened to plenty of Ice T, NWA, and Snoop. Sometimes I still do. I have yet to become a stick-up kid or pack a 9 mil. Should I be worried? If there's some sort of threshold dosage, I might go over it at any time.

carlosjobim 2mo ago
Well argued. Now will you apply all your same arguments to social media "rage bait"?

acdha 2mo ago

> Gangster rap has inspired a lot of murders and other violent crime world wide, I don't think anybody would deny that anymore Citation needed here. I haven’t known anyone to do that despite it being pretty mainstream and U.S. crime rates have been going down for ages so there doesn’t appear to be a general correlation (repeat for the video games which have been so railed against). I think most people understand the difference between entertainment and reality in that context. What makes social media different is that it’s portrayed as real: people get constant reinforcement that “people like me” think horrible things about Muslims, LGBTQ, liberals, etc. and use that to justify “strike first” messaging. We’ve seen that same playbook in the past (Bosnia, Rwanda, etc.) but those required more money and state control of media whereas social media is far more accessible to even a small minority of extremists looking to spread their messages. > Still, what music do you think that African child soldiers listen to when they go on a raid to burn a village and kill everybody they find? I note that you conspicuously omit the white-coded heavy metal used by other war criminals, but more importantly you’d need to again submit show some data supporting causation rather than simple popularity and answer the big question about whether it’s the case that the music has that effect or simply that people trying to indoctrinate use music which is already popular because it’s familiar and had the mood they wanted. For example, I don’t think anyone would say Metallica inspires torture despite it being used in the American torture program in Guantanamo — almost all of the millions of people who listen to their albums have never engaged in serious violence and the people who committed war crimes would’ve picked something else if they were in a different cultural context.

carlosjobim 2mo ago
If you truly deny the effect that gangster rap has, then I can't take your comment as honest. Then we might just as well say that ISIS propaganda also has no effect on their targeted audience, and their stuff is just for entertainment. Because what "citations" do you have that people can be influenced by ISIS propaganda. When a drill rapper makes a song threatening to murder specific people, and also posts these threats on social media, and finally commits to it and murders somebody. Is that not reality? Because it happens all the time. But maybe the social media post is the only problem in this situation? If political terrorists are listening to music all day about bombing cafés, kidnapping people, smuggling drugs and assassinating their enemies and they actually do so at thousands per year - would you say this music is just entertainment for people living in that world. Because that is exactly the situation with gangster rap, and has been for a long time. And you might listen to it just for entertainment so it's nothing to be concerned about. To you it's entertainment because you're comfortably distant from the effects. How do you think somebody who's had their sibling murdered by a gang feels hearing that gangs music being blasted where they rap about murdering and mutilating people? > the white-coded heavy metal used by other war criminals Whatever this is, it is not played on the radio all day and Sony and Warner aren't making millions from it and they're not performing at the half time show. Maybe their songs are catchy and they should be played in cafés and in your Uber. I've heard that some ISIS songs are supposed to be quite catchy.