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Everyone apart from a few stragglers agree the climate is changing. Most people agree the world won’t change its behaviour on its own to stop that. So we can t

Everyone apart from a few stragglers agree the climate is changing. Most people agree the world won’t change its behaviour on its own to stop that. So we can thus incentivise change (things like renewables being far cheaper than fossil fuel) globally, and adapt to reality. There are a vocal minority whining about how we need to stop eating beef or milk annd stop using energy and there are those who make beef and milk more sustainable and make generating energy sustainable. I have time for the latter. The former can go hand out with the coal rollers.

jcattle 2mo ago
How do you make beef and milk more sustainable? I'm honestly wondering. To me it seems similar to saying: we can make coal power plants more efficient. Equivalent to more "efficient" (however you want to define that) forms of animal husbandry. It doesn't change the fact that you're still burning coal, while you could be putting up solar.
- hdgvhicv 2mo ago
  The goal isn’t to burn coal, it’s to generate electricity or heat, so make the alternative ways better and you win. Your force people to stop heating their homes they’ll revolt. You give them a better alternative they’ll take it. > How do you make beef and milk more sustainable? This is the right question. And is being answered, along with other improvements in farming. I have no idea about the specifics, as I’m not a farmer. https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0022030225007234 https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S002203022... https://discoverwildscience.com/the-dutch-are-growing-floating-farms-and-the-cows-dont-seem-bothered-4-317451/ https://discoverwildscience.com/the-dutch-are-growing-floati... Far too many so-called environmentalists are far more concerned with stopping life rather than practical methods to reduce and eliminate harm, and they get ignored - and worse fought back against. “If you build a solar farm generating 100MWh rather than an ethanol farm generating 50MWh that’s bad because the it’s a supper slope to banning beefburgers”
  - jcattle 2mo ago
    You are not stopping people from taking in calories. In your analogy it would be the same as saying: you are not allowed to heat your home with a coal burner. Same as saying you are not allowed to eat beef. You can still eat lots of other stuff, just not beef. The goal isn’t to eat beef, it’s calorie intake. Now I am not saying that we should ban cattle farming or beef and dairy consumption. In the end I see this as a problem of our current system not being able to effectively reflect environmental impact in price. Cattle farming has an environmental cost which is higher than other alternatives (chicken, soy etc.). This environmental cost is not directly passed on to the consumer. All of the alternatives you listed will not succeed in our current system because the environmental savings they might have can not be passed on to the customer. On the contrary: usually lower environmental impact has a monetary cost associated, making prices higher for products from these initiatives.
Aefiam 2mo ago
It is not just a few stragglers, 30% of americans believe climate change isnt real, the us president is one of them. Fighting climate change is not going to be successful without sacrifice, we tried that for the last decades and fossil fuel consumption has only risen. Of course people dont want to do that and so instead deny it happening or that it will be magically fixed in the future.

jcattle 2mo ago

How do you make beef and milk more sustainable? I'm honestly wondering. To me it seems similar to saying: we can make coal power plants more efficient. Equivalent to more "efficient" (however you want to define that) forms of animal husbandry. It doesn't change the fact that you're still burning coal, while you could be putting up solar.

hdgvhicv 2mo ago
The goal isn’t to burn coal, it’s to generate electricity or heat, so make the alternative ways better and you win. Your force people to stop heating their homes they’ll revolt. You give them a better alternative they’ll take it. > How do you make beef and milk more sustainable? This is the right question. And is being answered, along with other improvements in farming. I have no idea about the specifics, as I’m not a farmer. https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0022030225007234 https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S002203022... https://discoverwildscience.com/the-dutch-are-growing-floating-farms-and-the-cows-dont-seem-bothered-4-317451/ https://discoverwildscience.com/the-dutch-are-growing-floati... Far too many so-called environmentalists are far more concerned with stopping life rather than practical methods to reduce and eliminate harm, and they get ignored - and worse fought back against. “If you build a solar farm generating 100MWh rather than an ethanol farm generating 50MWh that’s bad because the it’s a supper slope to banning beefburgers”
- jcattle 2mo ago
  You are not stopping people from taking in calories. In your analogy it would be the same as saying: you are not allowed to heat your home with a coal burner. Same as saying you are not allowed to eat beef. You can still eat lots of other stuff, just not beef. The goal isn’t to eat beef, it’s calorie intake. Now I am not saying that we should ban cattle farming or beef and dairy consumption. In the end I see this as a problem of our current system not being able to effectively reflect environmental impact in price. Cattle farming has an environmental cost which is higher than other alternatives (chicken, soy etc.). This environmental cost is not directly passed on to the consumer. All of the alternatives you listed will not succeed in our current system because the environmental savings they might have can not be passed on to the customer. On the contrary: usually lower environmental impact has a monetary cost associated, making prices higher for products from these initiatives.

Aefiam 2mo ago

It is not just a few stragglers, 30% of americans believe climate change isnt real, the us president is one of them. Fighting climate change is not going to be successful without sacrifice, we tried that for the last decades and fossil fuel consumption has only risen. Of course people dont want to do that and so instead deny it happening or that it will be magically fixed in the future.