4 ms·

This has the knock-on effect that it becomes impossible to excel in your first semester. Both of my kids worked hard and were prepared for college, and they di

This has the knock-on effect that it becomes impossible to excel in your first semester. Both of my kids worked hard and were prepared for college, and they did very well their first years, as they were used to the pace and level of information. It's something they are proud of, and it gave them confidence in their future lives. By eliminating the chance to excel, we make life worse for students who should be standing out.

Jtsummers 2mo ago
> This has the knock-on effect that it becomes impossible to excel in your first semester. No, it eliminates the grade and GPA award for excelling. You can still excel, unless you absolutely require external validation for your work. And even then, it's still college, professors notice top performers even if they aren't giving them an A+++++ and have to give them a Pass instead.
- GlibMonkeyDeath 2mo ago
  In my opinion you are under-appreciating the external validation. Removing grades disincentives excelling. Why work any harder than getting a "pass"? At the larger schools (like Michigan), professors (if a professor is actually grading the class, and not an adjunct or grad student) are hardly going to remember individual performances on freshman exams, or even pay much attention.
  - Jtsummers 2mo ago
    This is one semester, not all, and they still will be getting individual marks (necessary to determine final grade). They can excel if they want to, and they'll have external signals if that's what they need. It just won't be reflected in their GPA for that semester. Oh no, the horror.
  - doctorwho42 2mo ago
    Classes in college aren't everything, I found that extracurriculars in college were more important than straight A's. I have only had one company ask for my transcripts and GPA. Ever! And guess what, they were the one company I never wanted to work for after the interviews. You know what the best companies I ever worked for cared more about? That I got the degree, and a million questions about my skills and projects that I engaged in.
  - everybodyknows 2mo ago
    > Why work any harder than getting a "pass"? Some students have a personality quirk called "intellectual interest", and actually want to learn something about disciplines that lie far outside any likely future major of their own.
culi 2mo ago
Kids can absolutely still excel. This just means their "excellence" isn't reduced to a 1-dimensional score. Excelling by writing a phenomenal essay that you still think about or creating a relationship with a professor that stays with you beyond the class is probably an even more meaningful way to excel than achieving some test score
al_borland 2mo ago
I struggled my freshman year. In high school, I never had to study or do much of anything outside of class. College was a huge adjustment. My high school also had an experimental math program that didn’t help anything. I’m a decent test taker, so I placed into classes my high school did not prepare me for. My GPA being low, but not failing, gave me the wake up call I needed to make the needed adjustments. A “Pass” wouldn’t have given me that wake up call, and a “Fail” may have just bounced me out, not giving me the chance to right the ship.

Jtsummers 2mo ago

> This has the knock-on effect that it becomes impossible to excel in your first semester. No, it eliminates the grade and GPA award for excelling. You can still excel, unless you absolutely require external validation for your work. And even then, it's still college, professors notice top performers even if they aren't giving them an A+++++ and have to give them a Pass instead.

GlibMonkeyDeath 2mo ago
In my opinion you are under-appreciating the external validation. Removing grades disincentives excelling. Why work any harder than getting a "pass"? At the larger schools (like Michigan), professors (if a professor is actually grading the class, and not an adjunct or grad student) are hardly going to remember individual performances on freshman exams, or even pay much attention.
- Jtsummers 2mo ago
  This is one semester, not all, and they still will be getting individual marks (necessary to determine final grade). They can excel if they want to, and they'll have external signals if that's what they need. It just won't be reflected in their GPA for that semester. Oh no, the horror.
- doctorwho42 2mo ago
  Classes in college aren't everything, I found that extracurriculars in college were more important than straight A's. I have only had one company ask for my transcripts and GPA. Ever! And guess what, they were the one company I never wanted to work for after the interviews. You know what the best companies I ever worked for cared more about? That I got the degree, and a million questions about my skills and projects that I engaged in.
- everybodyknows 2mo ago
  > Why work any harder than getting a "pass"? Some students have a personality quirk called "intellectual interest", and actually want to learn something about disciplines that lie far outside any likely future major of their own.

culi 2mo ago

Kids can absolutely still excel. This just means their "excellence" isn't reduced to a 1-dimensional score. Excelling by writing a phenomenal essay that you still think about or creating a relationship with a professor that stays with you beyond the class is probably an even more meaningful way to excel than achieving some test score

al_borland 2mo ago

I struggled my freshman year. In high school, I never had to study or do much of anything outside of class. College was a huge adjustment. My high school also had an experimental math program that didn’t help anything. I’m a decent test taker, so I placed into classes my high school did not prepare me for. My GPA being low, but not failing, gave me the wake up call I needed to make the needed adjustments. A “Pass” wouldn’t have given me that wake up call, and a “Fail” may have just bounced me out, not giving me the chance to right the ship.