3 ms·

Being afraid and hoping you are never forced to add code to a project you do not want to add is letting the chilling effects work as designed. We need to all l

by lrvick 2mo ago

Being afraid and hoping you are never forced to add code to a project you do not want to add is letting the chilling effects work as designed. We need to all loudly and publicly say "Fuck off, I will defend my rights if needed", so they understand how expensive the fight is going to be. Fear is power. Do not give your enemies power.

deleted 2mo ago
[deleted]
otterley 2mo ago
> hoping you are never forced to add code to a project you do not want to add You keep saying that, but that's not the realistic outcome. The realistic outcome isn't an injunction forcing you to add code. It'd be to force you to pull it out of circulation.
- lrvick 2mo ago
  They cannot force me to do either. But it would be a fascinating case study to watch them try. I feel it would only help prove the decentralized censorship-resistant tactics of the project work as intended. Government overreach should be in the threat model of every FOSS project.
  - hnlmorg 2mo ago
    There are already case studies that demonstrate governments can do exactly what the GP lawyer claimed could happen. You’re not treading any new and untested ground here.
hnlmorg 2mo ago
People don’t disagree with your moral position. The problem is you’re bringing a butter knife to a drone fight. There are more effective ways protest this law than posting punk-rhetoric on a nerd forum for a project that will likely fly under the governments radar anyway.
- iamnothere 2mo ago
  Public expressions of defiance are motivating to people who don’t yet recognize that they have allies.
  - lrvick 2mo ago
    At least one person understands my intentions. You made my day.
    - iamnothere 2mo ago
      There are more of us than it appears, but we usually don’t speak out. Thanks for making a stand.
      - hnlmorg 2mo ago
        We get their intentions. We just disagree with the effectiveness of it. Posting rhetoric on an anonymous message board is not making a stand. If and when they’re doxxed by US media outlets, and slapped with life-changing court orders, with their work and families directly affected by their decisions; then they’re making a stand. But until that point, their words are as meaningless as their view of this law. Eg I can confidently say I’m not going to comply with this law either. But you have no reason to assume that will make any difference nor that I wouldn’t fold the moment I’m put under the slightest amount of pressure. If people really wanted to make a stand then they’d be drumming up support in real life, not anonymously. They’d be speaking to government representatives. They’d be raising financial support for lobbying change. I’m old enough to have lived through multiple iterations of unpleasant laws being passed and each time a movement against it has been online-only, that protest has achieved nothing. So I know the real reason this maintainer is speaking as boldly as they are is because they know the government hasn’t heard of them nor their distro. Ie it’s a “making a stand” by doing exactly nothing. But it will also achieve exactly nothing too.
        lrvick 2mo ago
        Who needs to dox me? I am a using my legal name on here and am super easy to look up. This law is stupid and I gleefully and openly mock it and those that think it is enforceable under my well known public identity. No one should take these unenforceable overreaches seriously. People will be jailed for not putting age verification code in software as soon as they will for piracy, or owning a 3D printer without gun-detecting spyware. It is a fear tactic with no ability to enforce. My message here should be pretty clear: Open source international community owned operating systems can just completely refuse to comply and nothing will happen to them.

by lrvick 2mo ago

deleted 2mo ago

[deleted]

otterley 2mo ago

> hoping you are never forced to add code to a project you do not want to add You keep saying that, but that's not the realistic outcome. The realistic outcome isn't an injunction forcing you to add code. It'd be to force you to pull it out of circulation.

lrvick 2mo ago
They cannot force me to do either. But it would be a fascinating case study to watch them try. I feel it would only help prove the decentralized censorship-resistant tactics of the project work as intended. Government overreach should be in the threat model of every FOSS project.
- hnlmorg 2mo ago
  There are already case studies that demonstrate governments can do exactly what the GP lawyer claimed could happen. You’re not treading any new and untested ground here.

hnlmorg 2mo ago

People don’t disagree with your moral position. The problem is you’re bringing a butter knife to a drone fight. There are more effective ways protest this law than posting punk-rhetoric on a nerd forum for a project that will likely fly under the governments radar anyway.

iamnothere 2mo ago
Public expressions of defiance are motivating to people who don’t yet recognize that they have allies.
- lrvick 2mo ago
  At least one person understands my intentions. You made my day.
  - iamnothere 2mo ago
    There are more of us than it appears, but we usually don’t speak out. Thanks for making a stand.
    - hnlmorg 2mo ago
      We get their intentions. We just disagree with the effectiveness of it. Posting rhetoric on an anonymous message board is not making a stand. If and when they’re doxxed by US media outlets, and slapped with life-changing court orders, with their work and families directly affected by their decisions; then they’re making a stand. But until that point, their words are as meaningless as their view of this law. Eg I can confidently say I’m not going to comply with this law either. But you have no reason to assume that will make any difference nor that I wouldn’t fold the moment I’m put under the slightest amount of pressure. If people really wanted to make a stand then they’d be drumming up support in real life, not anonymously. They’d be speaking to government representatives. They’d be raising financial support for lobbying change. I’m old enough to have lived through multiple iterations of unpleasant laws being passed and each time a movement against it has been online-only, that protest has achieved nothing. So I know the real reason this maintainer is speaking as boldly as they are is because they know the government hasn’t heard of them nor their distro. Ie it’s a “making a stand” by doing exactly nothing. But it will also achieve exactly nothing too.
      - lrvick 2mo ago
        Who needs to dox me? I am a using my legal name on here and am super easy to look up. This law is stupid and I gleefully and openly mock it and those that think it is enforceable under my well known public identity. No one should take these unenforceable overreaches seriously. People will be jailed for not putting age verification code in software as soon as they will for piracy, or owning a 3D printer without gun-detecting spyware. It is a fear tactic with no ability to enforce. My message here should be pretty clear: Open source international community owned operating systems can just completely refuse to comply and nothing will happen to them.