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Plug-In Solar Panels Starting to Sprout in U.S. Backyards
- bookofjoe 3mo agohttps://www.nytimes.com/2026/07/31/business/energy-environment/plug-in-balcony-solar.html?unlocked_article_code=1.4FA.ACo7.zK5plO5Qzn-O&smid=url-share https://www.nytimes.com/2026/07/31/business/energy-environme...
- CodeWriter23 3mo agoThere was a carport fire in my building back in the 90's. The firefighters got all set up to turn their hoses on it but did not actually start using water to fight the fire until the utility guy from the city arrived to de-energize the supply from a nearby vault. How does that safety protocol work when the electrical connections and supplies are distributed around the house and may be inaccessible due to fire?
- Vortigaunt 3mo agocompanies that sell plug-in systems argue that safety risks are minimal or nonexistent. Mr. Scherer of Craftstrom said his company’s systems would not shock electrical workers because they shut off automatically within one second of a power disruption or grid outage. Mr. Boyce of UL Solutions said his company would certify panels only if they did not pose a risk to consumers or utility workers.
- 0xbadcafebee 3mo agoThe device looks for an existing signal from the grid, and if it doesn't find it, it stops feeding power. It even waits for 3-5 minutes before trying again plus some random jitter to avoid thundering herd. It's been a standard in Europe for a while and now finally in the US. This of course depends on the utility and state as not all of them have adopted it but it's quickly becoming the standard everywhere. IEEE 1547 (interconnection behavior), UL 1741 (inverter product safety), UL 3700 (plug-in solar). (also there are newer revisions you need of some standards like UL 1741)
- lokar 3mo agoAlso, utility line workers always treat everything as live until they isolate it and confirm it’s not live (or do the work live in some cases).
- amluto 3mo agoI once chatted with some line workers working nearby, and I asked them what they did about residential solar. They said they didn’t particularly care about anti-islanding: if they needed to, they would deliberately short all the customer wires to ground, and if anything hadn’t turned off, then breakers would trip.
- t0mas88 3mo agoThey even do that to large transmission lines. First shutdown/isolate, then connect to ground or short circuit. If anyone then accidentally turns something back on it will fail immediately. A few years ago a transmission line in the Netherlands was energized while it shouldn't be, during maintenance work, which resulted in the whole line starting to smoke, sag and spark: https://youtu.be/nyjCrP38ICc https://youtu.be/nyjCrP38ICc
- ButlerianJihad 3mo agohttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Balcony_solar_power https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Balcony_solar_power In the United States, Underwriters Laboratories developed the UL 3700 standard specifically for plug-in solar devices, establishing safety specifications for microinverters and connection systems used in these applications.[2] UL-certified plug-in inverters are designed to automatically shut down during grid outages, preventing backfeed that could endanger electrical workers.[7] So that is the standard failure mode, but do customers understand how it works? If I had a balcony solar panel, I'd definitely expect it to be providing backup power when we need it the most. I'd expect it to charge a storage battery, not backfeed into the grid. Surface area means a lot for solar panels. An EV with a solar panel on top is laughable. I own a solar backpack that couldn't charge its power bank within 3 weeks of daily full sun. A "balcony solar panel" may not keep your smartphone charged.
- InsomniacL 3mo agoI imagine the solar panel will detect when the circuit it is plugged in to is de-energised and stop supplying supplemental power to it.
- iolo 3mo agoThis is exactly how our rooftop solar works. The inverter only supplies ac power if it can sync to the grid frequency meaning that the system disconnects without a live grid connection. Even if I had a battery, this would still be a requirement under local regulations.
- micw 3mo agoIn Germany, where this kind of plug-in solar panels is very common (1.5 GW installed power) it is mandatory that the inverter powers itself down as soon as the grid is offline/disconnected. It has to be so fast that you can savely touch the plug after unplugging it. I guess it's standard everywhere.
- paulsutter 3mo agoActually the rule is that your solar system must stop feeding power to the utility if the utility is down. You are allowed to run in isolated mode if your system supports that. Yes, even in Germany.
- analog31 3mo agoEvery way I can think it through, isolated mode means your house is disconnected from the utility when you lose power, which requires more equipment than can be contained in a plug in solar panel.
- futevolei 2mo agoYeah the only code compliant way this is possible is if an additional sub panel is installed and maybe/probably a transfer switch that needs to be manually pulled in order to disconnect the sub panel from the main panel. Possibly OP is confused about running in zero export mode? Would love to hear how we could be wrong…
- CodeWriter23 3mo agoThanks for the answer instead of a downvote.
- deleted 3mo ago[deleted]
- KennyBlanken 3mo agoMaybe the fact that these panels are legal around the world and soon will be legal in a number of US states should be a sign to you that this is not a relevant concern.
- downrightmike 3mo agoLet's just point out that it isn't about the line workers, it is about raising prices on consumers. They'll replace the line worker at the drop of a hat, and fight tooth and nail to grow profits, that's just how corporations work.
- deleted 3mo ago[deleted]
- sixothree 3mo agoAnyone have good suggestions for stands for 2-4 panels?
- Lio 3mo agoOne thing I've read is that if you can dual sided panels mounted on a frame over white gravel and really boost secondary feed as much as 20 to 30%. If they're mounted on a roof then obviously you can't benefit from that so it would be cheaper to go with single sided panels.
- domh 3mo agoThis is going to be made legal in the UK on the 27th August. Max 800w inspired by Germany. I'll definitely get some panels and see how they go.
- Lio 3mo agoThey're a no brainer especially if Lidl can nock them out for around £200 in the centre aisle. Unfortunately for me my back garden has too much shade for panels and I don't think I could get away with them in the front. So that leaves a roof top install and I think once you have scaffold that you might as well have a traditional install.
- domh 3mo agoYeah I'm going to wait for lidl to do them, that's the plan anyway. Anything you can buy now is ~£600 (ecoflow is the brand I've seen). Hoping some others take the plunge first to provide some guidance. Wish plugin batteries were part of it.
- Lio 3mo agoI think plugin batteries are coming too. Right now (well 27th August) you can plug your inverter into a battery but you can't connect the battery to a ring main you have to connect devices directly to it. That is under assessment though so there's a good chance they could copy the way Germany does it, just like they're doing with the panels.
- micw 3mo agoTo be precise (Germany): 800W inverter, 2kWp solar panels (maximum 4 panels). This allows you to get the 800W during long periods of daylight (e.g. east/west configuration). You only need to add the installation to a public database and plug in the inverter. Before it was more complex (special plug needed, only 600W, need allowance from grid operator) and still we have ~1.5 GW installed plug-in solar plants. It's almost always a no-brainer, RoI is typically 3-4 years while the lifespan is 20 years. Edit: My state had a subsidy of 300€ when I bought mine, so the RoI was instant ;-)
- neves 3mo agoWhich are the high quality chinese brands of plug-in panels?
- Lio 3mo agoI've seen Ecoflow mentioned on YouTube but I don't know how reliable that is.
- fooblaster 3mo agoThe thing we should be incentivizing people to use here are batteries, in the exact same configuration. We do not in many places, need more solar power generation, but we need devices that slurp down power at 2pm and dump it out in the three hours after sundown. Utilities should be paying anyone who dumps power to the grid at peak post-sundown demand hours, so that it is a no-brainer to install such a thing.
- jonatron 3mo agoI'm getting a battery soon so I can get paid £1/kWh to dump power at specific times with axle energy https://vpp.axle.energy/landing https://vpp.axle.energy/landing
- barbacoa 3mo agoBe careful with these kind of long term sell back agreements. In the USA lots of early adopters of solar did so under net metering agreements where excess electricity is sold back at full price. After a number of years it was costing the utility companies too much money. So they updated the terms such that residents with solar buy electricity at retail prices (~$0.25) but sell it back at wholesale (~$0.04).
- fooblaster 3mo agoYes, I think the key thing here to to not guarantee that pricing like they did in California over decades. Yes, the benefit will eventually be reduced. But that is considered success is it not?
- barbacoa 3mo ago>But that is considered success is it not? Not if you took out a $50k loan for an early gen solar system and it now only saves $30 a month.
- fooblaster 3mo ago
- plantain 3mo agoThis is absolutely insane. This is the most inefficient way imaginable to deploy solar power. We could deploy 100x the capacity $/Wh with utility-scale farms. Unfortunately we are just completely failing on basic coordination problems like this in the west, every man for himself.
- spockz 3mo agoIt is inefficient in the grand scheme of things yes. But it is very efficient on the level of the individual home owner, especially if they do not own the building so cannot install solar. It is a good way to cheaply reduce the cost of electricity. Yes, installing the solar power globally, and getting a globally connected grid would be more efficient in terms of solar panels/kW(h). But alas, that also requires a lot more infrastructure. In the mean time this can reduce the energy bill for many people. Especially, if tied to a battery. It is not intended to provide independence, for that you need a lot more capacity.
- plantain 3mo agoThese people are already connected to a grid. We already have the infrastructure.
- spockz 3mo agoAFAICT, the Continental US does not have a fully connected grid. This allows electricity providers to charge wildly different rates depending on the state/region. It also requires each net to individually ensure capacity and uptime. Having a connected grid is a requirement for being able to transfer energy from places with significant amount of renewable energy (solar, wind, hydro) to others. Even if this comes with large losses in transfer it is still a net positive. Especially if you factor in the resulting stability.
- triceratops 3mo agoPeople buying panels with their own money doesn't take away dollars from utility solar.
- KennyBlanken 3mo agoThe biggest obstacle to solar in the US: utility companies. Ask anyone who has had a system installed. Your system can be totally compliant with national and state electrical code, installed by a competent installer using staff who are licensed electricians, get a stamp of approval from your own's inspectors - and the utility will refuse to connect it and insist you meet an additional set of their own conditions. And there's nothing you can do about it. No appeals, no review process, nothing. It's not even consistent, with utilities seeming to just obstruct for the sake of obstructing. Over and over I've of systems going in, the utility comes out (eventually) to inspect, refuses to connect. They're called back out, nothing has changed, and the system gets approved. This is legislatures getting tired of all that power company bullshit, and bypassing them. As balcony solar rules hit state legislatures, expect some really absurd scare campaigns by power companies, and lots of lobbying. Power companies see every solar panel they don't own as a threat to the profits they make on their fossil fuel power plants.
- Panino 3mo ago> Ask anyone who has had a system installed. This didn't happen to me or anyone else I know with rooftop solar in multiple states, and I've never heard of it. What citations do you have?
- cortesoft 3mo ago> Ask anyone who has had a system installed. Your system can be totally compliant with national and state electrical code, installed by a competent installer using staff who are licensed electricians, get a stamp of approval from your own's inspectors - and the utility will refuse to connect it and insist you meet an additional set of their own conditions. Well, I am someone who had a system installed… I have a 14000 KwH per year system, and two 13 KwH batteries. It did take a while to get it inspected, which was annoying, although I was able to use it while I waited (I just couldn’t sent power to the power company until after), but they approved it the first time without any additional requirements. What makes you so sure everyone has the experience you are talking about?
- rcdemski 3mo ago
- AuthAuth 3mo agoThis is in my opinion a bad solution to the problem of expensive energy or renewable transition. Having individuals start managing their power via plugin solar and plugin batteries creates a gap between the people who can afford it and those who cant. The people who cant afford it end up paying more for electricity. A better solution is to do this on a local or federal government level and build the required amount of power.
- argentinian 3mo agoIf demand decreases then that can cause energy to become cheaper.
- AuthAuth 3mo agoif demand drops to 0 you still need to pay money to run a power grid and the energy gen capacity.
- argentinian 3mo agoNo, if demand is 0 you wouldn't have a reason to run that.
- missedthecue 3mo agoI dont understand it. If most grid capacity is already installed, the people who don't build their own little island with solar and batteries end up being shrinking demand against a pool of fixed supply. Meaning their bills probably decrease. There is the hiccup of universal distribution which needs regular maintenance, and is separate from electrical supply. But if this is remediated by charging solar owners base fees/connection fees, or if grid maintenance is only minority portion of electric utility bills (in the US it's about 40% with electricity production being 60%), the direction should still be poorer people proportionally benefitting.
- AuthAuth 3mo agoThe power capacity is already built out. They shrink the demand(and revenue) of that built out capacity. But then when renewable power is bad they pop back onto the grid to spike demand. The get to enjoy the best of all worlds free energy when its good and the safety of the grid while the grid gets the worst of all worlds a non paying household that will spike demand at the worst time.
- mannyv 3mo agoI have a two panel system, and the panels are about 430 watts each. Given the current ToD rates for electric, it will take years to pay back. Microinverter: 400 Panels (used): 250 for both Cables: 50 I also picked up two LiFePo4 batteries and two Kasa smart plugs and time shifted my computing infrastructure's electricity usage. That made much more of a difference in my bill, since a few hundred watts moved to .09/kwh. If the bms was smarter i could charge the batteries with solar, but alas i can't cap the recharge current.