3 ms·

These are usually from a missing context (i.e. specifying where the car is right now). Tokenizer issues (how many Xs are in Y) are a better giveaway, but models

These are usually from a missing context (i.e. specifying where the car is right now). Tokenizer issues (how many Xs are in Y) are a better giveaway, but models can solve them using tools nowadays. I think the best way to uncover an LLM is to reveal its superhuman aspects. Ask it for an A* algorithm for your problem. If it can just type down a working algorithm in a few seconds, that is definitely not a human. Although with some careful system prompt design, you could probably mask that aspect too.

tsimionescu 2mo ago
> These are usually from a missing context (i.e. specifying where the car is right now). The reason for the mistake is irrelevant here. All that matters is that you catch the agent saying something that basically no human would, especially in this type of game.
- sigmoid10 2mo ago
  If it is missing context, it will be indistinguishable from mistakes that humans could make as well.
  - tsimionescu 2mo ago
    No, the context is obvious to any human, that's the whole point. No one would think you've left your car at a car wash, as no one ever does that, and if they did, they wouldn't even consider driving there. It's obvious to any human that the question is a little trick and that the answer is extremely obvious.
    - sigmoid10 2mo ago
      Counter example: A person who always has their car brought to the car wash by someone else (could be super wealthy, could be company cars, could be a million other reasons...) is asked whether to go or drive to the car wash. Of course they'll tell you to just walk if it's close anyway. To them the car is already there implicitly. Human life experience is not universal. And so context can't be either.
prplxd_nihilist 2mo ago
> These are usually from a missing context (i.e. specifying where the car is right now). That shouldn't be an issue. The very act of taking the car to car wash contains the information that it is with you and you are at your home. Doesn't this prove that LLMs don't actually think?
- sigmoid10 2mo ago
  What if your car is not brought to the wash by you (common for companies or rich people). If someone asks you how to get it and the car wash is close by, of course you will tell them to go on foot. Human life experience is not universal and thus context can never be either. This is also a huge problem in inter-human communication, since most people suck at putting themselves in other people's shoes. But for LLMs everyone somehow assumes the humans must be right by default, when in fact you can tell even less about a model's training and world experience than for an average human.

tsimionescu 2mo ago

> These are usually from a missing context (i.e. specifying where the car is right now). The reason for the mistake is irrelevant here. All that matters is that you catch the agent saying something that basically no human would, especially in this type of game.

sigmoid10 2mo ago
If it is missing context, it will be indistinguishable from mistakes that humans could make as well.
- tsimionescu 2mo ago
  No, the context is obvious to any human, that's the whole point. No one would think you've left your car at a car wash, as no one ever does that, and if they did, they wouldn't even consider driving there. It's obvious to any human that the question is a little trick and that the answer is extremely obvious.
  - sigmoid10 2mo ago
    Counter example: A person who always has their car brought to the car wash by someone else (could be super wealthy, could be company cars, could be a million other reasons...) is asked whether to go or drive to the car wash. Of course they'll tell you to just walk if it's close anyway. To them the car is already there implicitly. Human life experience is not universal. And so context can't be either.

prplxd_nihilist 2mo ago

> These are usually from a missing context (i.e. specifying where the car is right now). That shouldn't be an issue. The very act of taking the car to car wash contains the information that it is with you and you are at your home. Doesn't this prove that LLMs don't actually think?

sigmoid10 2mo ago
What if your car is not brought to the wash by you (common for companies or rich people). If someone asks you how to get it and the car wash is close by, of course you will tell them to go on foot. Human life experience is not universal and thus context can never be either. This is also a huge problem in inter-human communication, since most people suck at putting themselves in other people's shoes. But for LLMs everyone somehow assumes the humans must be right by default, when in fact you can tell even less about a model's training and world experience than for an average human.