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I'd bring the cheapo French press kit it into the A- domain once you appreciate the number one trick to making good coffee: DON'T BOIL THE WATER. Water that is

I'd bring the cheapo French press kit it into the A- domain once you appreciate the number one trick to making good coffee: DON'T BOIL THE WATER. Water that is hot, but well below boiling brings out the flavor of the beans a million times more than boiling water. Get a glass kettle, and turn it off when you start to get some decent bubble action on the bottom. Once you get that down, zomg - a French press with even the cheapest beans you find can make an amazzzzzing cup of coffee. Beats the pants of Starbucks, and comes quite close to a proper cup of coffee made with good beans. Another trick is to rotate your cheap beans, instead of just sticking to your favorite. Dark roast of choice one week, medium the next, and so on. By the time you loop back to your favorite, it'll taste unbelievable.

bestham 3mo ago
Are you saying that the temperature of the water when it hit the ground beans that matter or the fact that the water was brought up to a boil or 100°C?
- somenameforme 3mo ago
  The temperature when it makes contacts with the ground beans. I see no reason why you couldn't boil it and then let it cool first.
  - geocar 3mo ago
    > The temperature when it makes contacts with the ground beans. You could certainly boil it and then let it cool first, but that'd take a lot of extra work. It's not so much work with the right tool: I have a button on my kettle that does exactly that, and another button that will use a little thermostat to keep it warm. Works great. https://www.sageappliances.com/en-gb/product/bke825?sku=SKE825BSS3GUK1 https://www.sageappliances.com/en-gb/product/bke825?sku=SKE8...
WA 3mo ago
Starbucks uses espresso machines that cost 4-5 figures. They have automatic thermal control. They never boil the water. While I agree with your overall sentiment, claiming that Starbucks makes coffee too hot and thus tastes bad is nonsense.
- somenameforme 3mo ago
  I'm not speculating why Starbucks coffee tastes how it does, I have no idea there. It's just a handy medium for comparison because a cup in Laos is going to taste the same as a cup in NYC. And while they don't make great coffee, they also don't make horrible coffee - and so I think beating Starbucks is a pretty good and understandable baseline to aim for.
- pnt12 3mo ago
  I'm from Portugal and we have a strong espresso culture, as in 90% of the people probably have multiple espresso every day. Many Portuguese agree that Starbucks espresso sucks compared to most conventional cafes. At most people go there for the American type drinks, which are a complete different style (and the coffee flavor hides behind all other ingredients, it doesn't have to be that good).
  - jdcasale 3mo ago
    The previous comment didn't say that Starbucks doesn't suck (they probably agree that it does -- I've never met anyone who really likes coffee who doesn't agree that modern at-scale Starbucks is awful), they just asserted that the badness there is not explained by faulty temperature control.
- d4ng 3mo ago
  So why does Starbucks coffee still consistently taste like shit?
  - ThunderSizzle 3mo ago
    So you buy their sugary crap to hide the shit coffee. Pumpkin spice lattes.
lelanthran 3mo ago
> DON'T BOIL THE WATER. Water that is hot, but well below boiling "Boiling" differs in temperature from place to place. Mineral content of water, altitude makes a large difference.
- Iolaum 3mo ago
  Not sure this is a meaningful factor for normal circumstances (for example below 1km altitude and for water that's safe to drink). According to CGPT at 1km altitude the boiling temperature of water is 96.7 C.
  - brailsafe 3mo ago
    > Not sure this is a meaningful factor for normal circumstances (for example below 1km altitude and for water that's safe to drink). Some very populated cities are above 2km, many are above 1km, and most great coffee is grown ~>=2km. Water hardness and flavour is a big deal as well.
atraac 3mo ago
> DON'T BOIL THE WATER. Water that is hot, but well below boiling brings out the flavor of the beans a million times more than boiling water. That actually depends on the coffee. Pouring 99C+ water onto light roasted coffee is perfectly fine in most cases and will actually extract more.

bestham 3mo ago

Are you saying that the temperature of the water when it hit the ground beans that matter or the fact that the water was brought up to a boil or 100°C?

somenameforme 3mo ago
The temperature when it makes contacts with the ground beans. I see no reason why you couldn't boil it and then let it cool first.
- geocar 3mo ago
  > The temperature when it makes contacts with the ground beans. You could certainly boil it and then let it cool first, but that'd take a lot of extra work. It's not so much work with the right tool: I have a button on my kettle that does exactly that, and another button that will use a little thermostat to keep it warm. Works great. https://www.sageappliances.com/en-gb/product/bke825?sku=SKE825BSS3GUK1 https://www.sageappliances.com/en-gb/product/bke825?sku=SKE8...

WA 3mo ago

Starbucks uses espresso machines that cost 4-5 figures. They have automatic thermal control. They never boil the water. While I agree with your overall sentiment, claiming that Starbucks makes coffee too hot and thus tastes bad is nonsense.

somenameforme 3mo ago
I'm not speculating why Starbucks coffee tastes how it does, I have no idea there. It's just a handy medium for comparison because a cup in Laos is going to taste the same as a cup in NYC. And while they don't make great coffee, they also don't make horrible coffee - and so I think beating Starbucks is a pretty good and understandable baseline to aim for.
pnt12 3mo ago
I'm from Portugal and we have a strong espresso culture, as in 90% of the people probably have multiple espresso every day. Many Portuguese agree that Starbucks espresso sucks compared to most conventional cafes. At most people go there for the American type drinks, which are a complete different style (and the coffee flavor hides behind all other ingredients, it doesn't have to be that good).
- jdcasale 3mo ago
  The previous comment didn't say that Starbucks doesn't suck (they probably agree that it does -- I've never met anyone who really likes coffee who doesn't agree that modern at-scale Starbucks is awful), they just asserted that the badness there is not explained by faulty temperature control.
d4ng 3mo ago
So why does Starbucks coffee still consistently taste like shit?
- ThunderSizzle 3mo ago
  So you buy their sugary crap to hide the shit coffee. Pumpkin spice lattes.

lelanthran 3mo ago

> DON'T BOIL THE WATER. Water that is hot, but well below boiling "Boiling" differs in temperature from place to place. Mineral content of water, altitude makes a large difference.

Iolaum 3mo ago
Not sure this is a meaningful factor for normal circumstances (for example below 1km altitude and for water that's safe to drink). According to CGPT at 1km altitude the boiling temperature of water is 96.7 C.
- brailsafe 3mo ago
  > Not sure this is a meaningful factor for normal circumstances (for example below 1km altitude and for water that's safe to drink). Some very populated cities are above 2km, many are above 1km, and most great coffee is grown ~>=2km. Water hardness and flavour is a big deal as well.

atraac 3mo ago

> DON'T BOIL THE WATER. Water that is hot, but well below boiling brings out the flavor of the beans a million times more than boiling water. That actually depends on the coffee. Pouring 99C+ water onto light roasted coffee is perfectly fine in most cases and will actually extract more.