5 ms·

anyone i have met that did Psychedelics more than a few times, permanently changed their brain chemistry in a way that was obvious. sure they dissolve some kind

anyone i have met that did Psychedelics more than a few times, permanently changed their brain chemistry in a way that was obvious. sure they dissolve some kind of prison, but many people never make it back from that dissolution and end up somewhere worse

virgil_disgr4ce 2mo ago
> did Psychedelics more than a few times If you want to specify LSD, you should do that, not "psychedelics." There are many, many psychedelics. They have sometimes radical differences. You cannot generalize that word into "many people never make it back." That is flat-out wrong, not to mention harmful.
- mikert89 2mo ago
  i disagree. i have a unique view of this type of drug use. i was part of a large social circle of psychedelic users, over the course of many years. i very rarely took part. i watched close friends change.
- jdietrich 2mo ago
  >There are many, many psychedelics. They have sometimes radical differences. Psilocybin is a more selective 5-HT2A agonist than LSD and is more rapidly metabolised. At normal recreational or clinical doses, they really aren't very different. LSD isn't quite as well-researched as psilocybin as a psychiatric drug, but the data we have suggests that it isn't meaningfully different in terms of risks or benefits.
bossyTeacher 2mo ago
> anyone i have met that did Psychedelics more than a few times, permanently changed their brain chemistry in a way that was obvious. sure they dissolve some kind of prison, but many people never make it back from that dissolution and end up somewhere worse Way to generalise. I also know people who drank water, went to sleep and never woke up. Ego dissolution is dosage dependent and you don't need to reach that point to get positive benefits. Also, many people do psychdelics that probably shouldn't.
- mikert89 2mo ago
  unfortunately, I think repeated psychedlic use has deterministic and predictable changes to peoples personalities. its not some "awakening", its a structural change in the brain. i watched many close friends fade away after too much use
  - bossyTeacher 2mo ago
    Surely, that's dosage dependent and frequency dependent. One per week vs once every three months vs once per year. Low dose vs medium dose vs high dose. Plus, these things are illegal which means that most of the time you are not getting the real but instead pharmacologically similar substances that might have secondary effects. This is way you can't reliably imply a correlation because it is a black market and often what you think you consumed is not what you actually consumed. Unless you actually tested what your friends consumed, you don't know what it was.
    - inigyou 2mo ago
      Pills and white powders get mixed up and adulterated that way, but I think everyone who eats mushrooms and hallucinates ate the right mushrooms. LSD is sometimes but rarely substituted for other hallucinogenic drugs that can be delivered on blotter paper, of which there aren't many.
      - bossyTeacher 2mo ago
        >I think everyone who eats mushrooms and hallucinates ate the right mushrooms That's a tautology. But what you meant is not true. Some of the compounds are chosen because they are chemically similar and have psilocybin like effects. Even if you were to test this with a standard kit it would be classified as psilocybin. Your average consumer would be none the wiser. The reason these compounds exist is literally because of that very reason. They were made in the context of slow moving policies targeting psychedelics by listing specific compounds.
        2mo ago
inigyou 2mo ago
As I understand it it can be a lot worse, a lot better, or anywhere in between. Scientifically backed coaching can probably shift it towards the "better" side. This is a new area of research because the whole thing was written off for several decades due to the war on drugs.
salemh 2mo ago
Co-signed here with psilocybin being dangerous based on direct personal experience, and seeing inumerable issues with party friends. Apologists of psylocybin will sometimes say 'its not as harsh and dangerous as LSD.' Ok, damaging effects of this drug are always apologized away and covered up. The biggest problem with psilocibyn is people are told its benign, then they go on a 'trip', and sometimes in their come-down delusion completely destroy their lives: leave their families, leave their career, and tend to 'come to' (if they do) several months later. Bad trips are supposedly 'experiences' (and now your in the realm of metaphysics), and going to jail or hurting yourself and others supposedly just should be washed over, or, you have permanent anxiety while sober now. The psychadelic apologists make themselves unfalsifiable because they can help people stuck in a purely materiastic mindset - which our souls know is completely false. Anyone in the party scene, or 'psychonaughts' (as I was, and did massive amounts of mushrooms for years, and had friends doing the same, sometimes 2-5x a week), the consequences of screwing with your brain chemistry cannot be avoided. Joe Rogan has done immense damage with minimizing risks of monkeying with your brain chemistry. This also relates to weed, which is not the weed of forty years ago compressed bricks with seeds in it, but its incredibly intense. You'll never hear so many excuses about their drug addiction then from weed smokers who spend hundreds a week, and can't miss a single day of smoking, toking, edibles, oils. NA and AA would be better paths to start with these trauma's, then fix the underlying trauma itself - which is also a spiritual problem, and not material. We, wealthy-west should theoretically be the most 'happy', and not lead for the last 60 years in depression, suicide, psychologists and psychiatrists, etc. Its not true, which is why nothing is working. Or to summarize, as the meme goes - something like 'these non spiritual normies taking psychadelics getting one-shot by a seven-dimensional demon, now leave their husband and career, wanting to 'teach about love' in the amazon.'
- inigyou 2mo ago
  If you're a real person, you've been shadowbanned since 2021 and don't seem to have noticed.
an0malous 2mo ago
Sure but "somewhere worse" is usually defined relative to the current societal framework. Society requires almost every adult to participate in labor, if LSD made you want to sit around and make paintings all day instead of work we would consider it a negative even though it would be a positive within other conceivable societal frameworks. For example, if AI removes the need for labor then maybe it would be fine and even desirable for everyone to just be high and make paintings all day. The complete dissolution that some people experience is likewise terrible for society, because people with no ego are poor, unmotivated workers amongst other potential behavioral issues, but in a Tibetan monastery you might be considered a saint. Ramana Maharshi was supposedly found as a young boy living in a pit with flies and bugs eating away at his flesh, he was completely oblivious to even his personal wellbeing much less societal norms and expectations. He was and still is considered one of the greatest Vedic sages in recent history. I'm not saying that everyone should go do LSD and I don't know the details or stories of the people you saw. Like I said, I understand the perspective of people who feel responsible for maintaining a social order. I'm just trying to point out how relative all of this is to societal frameworks.
joquarky 2mo ago
They "never make it back" to what exactly? What are you using as attributes to form a judgement of what is "worse"?

virgil_disgr4ce 2mo ago

> did Psychedelics more than a few times If you want to specify LSD, you should do that, not "psychedelics." There are many, many psychedelics. They have sometimes radical differences. You cannot generalize that word into "many people never make it back." That is flat-out wrong, not to mention harmful.

mikert89 2mo ago
i disagree. i have a unique view of this type of drug use. i was part of a large social circle of psychedelic users, over the course of many years. i very rarely took part. i watched close friends change.
jdietrich 2mo ago
>There are many, many psychedelics. They have sometimes radical differences. Psilocybin is a more selective 5-HT2A agonist than LSD and is more rapidly metabolised. At normal recreational or clinical doses, they really aren't very different. LSD isn't quite as well-researched as psilocybin as a psychiatric drug, but the data we have suggests that it isn't meaningfully different in terms of risks or benefits.

bossyTeacher 2mo ago

> anyone i have met that did Psychedelics more than a few times, permanently changed their brain chemistry in a way that was obvious. sure they dissolve some kind of prison, but many people never make it back from that dissolution and end up somewhere worse Way to generalise. I also know people who drank water, went to sleep and never woke up. Ego dissolution is dosage dependent and you don't need to reach that point to get positive benefits. Also, many people do psychdelics that probably shouldn't.

mikert89 2mo ago
unfortunately, I think repeated psychedlic use has deterministic and predictable changes to peoples personalities. its not some "awakening", its a structural change in the brain. i watched many close friends fade away after too much use
- bossyTeacher 2mo ago
  Surely, that's dosage dependent and frequency dependent. One per week vs once every three months vs once per year. Low dose vs medium dose vs high dose. Plus, these things are illegal which means that most of the time you are not getting the real but instead pharmacologically similar substances that might have secondary effects. This is way you can't reliably imply a correlation because it is a black market and often what you think you consumed is not what you actually consumed. Unless you actually tested what your friends consumed, you don't know what it was.
  - inigyou 2mo ago
    Pills and white powders get mixed up and adulterated that way, but I think everyone who eats mushrooms and hallucinates ate the right mushrooms. LSD is sometimes but rarely substituted for other hallucinogenic drugs that can be delivered on blotter paper, of which there aren't many.
    - bossyTeacher 2mo ago
      >I think everyone who eats mushrooms and hallucinates ate the right mushrooms That's a tautology. But what you meant is not true. Some of the compounds are chosen because they are chemically similar and have psilocybin like effects. Even if you were to test this with a standard kit it would be classified as psilocybin. Your average consumer would be none the wiser. The reason these compounds exist is literally because of that very reason. They were made in the context of slow moving policies targeting psychedelics by listing specific compounds.
      - 2mo ago

inigyou 2mo ago

As I understand it it can be a lot worse, a lot better, or anywhere in between. Scientifically backed coaching can probably shift it towards the "better" side. This is a new area of research because the whole thing was written off for several decades due to the war on drugs.

salemh 2mo ago

Co-signed here with psilocybin being dangerous based on direct personal experience, and seeing inumerable issues with party friends. Apologists of psylocybin will sometimes say 'its not as harsh and dangerous as LSD.' Ok, damaging effects of this drug are always apologized away and covered up. The biggest problem with psilocibyn is people are told its benign, then they go on a 'trip', and sometimes in their come-down delusion completely destroy their lives: leave their families, leave their career, and tend to 'come to' (if they do) several months later. Bad trips are supposedly 'experiences' (and now your in the realm of metaphysics), and going to jail or hurting yourself and others supposedly just should be washed over, or, you have permanent anxiety while sober now. The psychadelic apologists make themselves unfalsifiable because they can help people stuck in a purely materiastic mindset - which our souls know is completely false. Anyone in the party scene, or 'psychonaughts' (as I was, and did massive amounts of mushrooms for years, and had friends doing the same, sometimes 2-5x a week), the consequences of screwing with your brain chemistry cannot be avoided. Joe Rogan has done immense damage with minimizing risks of monkeying with your brain chemistry. This also relates to weed, which is not the weed of forty years ago compressed bricks with seeds in it, but its incredibly intense. You'll never hear so many excuses about their drug addiction then from weed smokers who spend hundreds a week, and can't miss a single day of smoking, toking, edibles, oils. NA and AA would be better paths to start with these trauma's, then fix the underlying trauma itself - which is also a spiritual problem, and not material. We, wealthy-west should theoretically be the most 'happy', and not lead for the last 60 years in depression, suicide, psychologists and psychiatrists, etc. Its not true, which is why nothing is working. Or to summarize, as the meme goes - something like 'these non spiritual normies taking psychadelics getting one-shot by a seven-dimensional demon, now leave their husband and career, wanting to 'teach about love' in the amazon.'

inigyou 2mo ago
If you're a real person, you've been shadowbanned since 2021 and don't seem to have noticed.

an0malous 2mo ago

Sure but "somewhere worse" is usually defined relative to the current societal framework. Society requires almost every adult to participate in labor, if LSD made you want to sit around and make paintings all day instead of work we would consider it a negative even though it would be a positive within other conceivable societal frameworks. For example, if AI removes the need for labor then maybe it would be fine and even desirable for everyone to just be high and make paintings all day. The complete dissolution that some people experience is likewise terrible for society, because people with no ego are poor, unmotivated workers amongst other potential behavioral issues, but in a Tibetan monastery you might be considered a saint. Ramana Maharshi was supposedly found as a young boy living in a pit with flies and bugs eating away at his flesh, he was completely oblivious to even his personal wellbeing much less societal norms and expectations. He was and still is considered one of the greatest Vedic sages in recent history. I'm not saying that everyone should go do LSD and I don't know the details or stories of the people you saw. Like I said, I understand the perspective of people who feel responsible for maintaining a social order. I'm just trying to point out how relative all of this is to societal frameworks.

joquarky 2mo ago

They "never make it back" to what exactly? What are you using as attributes to form a judgement of what is "worse"?