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Divide this differently: - states where the major cities commonly have snow for > 3 months - states where the major cities commonly have snow for < 1 month I

by runako 2mo ago

Divide this differently: - states where the major cities commonly have snow for > 3 months - states where the major cities commonly have snow for < 1 month Inclement weather is likely the differentiator. Blue state California gets Waymo in its biggest cities, which handily do not get much snow. The other Waymo cities are all below the Mason-Dixon Line.

xnx 2mo ago
Blocked even from testing in NYC. Blocked from DC and Boston. Unfortunately this does have more to do with bad government than bad weather.
- runako 2mo ago
  Boston, according to Waymo[1], is dependent on the legislature making autonomous vehicles legal. Apparently NY state laws also require a human driver at the wheel. The only surprising thing about this is that other states did not require changes in law. It's Good, Actually, that big companies are (sometimes) bound by the same laws that bind the rest of us. In any case, there are more than 2-3 "blue" states. We can note that it's also not running in cold "red" states either. The climate angle fits the data best and aligns with what Waymo says, which aligns with what we have known about the tech for at least a decade. (That note also suggests they are still testing their cold-weather kit and are not quite ready.) 1 - https://waymo.com/blog/shorts/back-to-boston/ https://waymo.com/blog/shorts/back-to-boston/
  - JumpCrisscross 2mo ago
    > that big companies are (sometimes) bound by the same laws that bind the rest of us Not if they’re stupid laws!
    - lokar 2mo ago
      Even then. There is value in uniform rule of law.
      - JumpCrisscross 2mo ago
        > There is value in uniform rule of law Sure. OP's point is these products and investments are accruing disproportionately to red cities and states. Sinking together isn't a great pitch.
        runako 2mo ago
        > these products and investments are accruing disproportionately to red cities and states Is this true at the city level? > Sinking together isn't a great pitch. Surely it's a worse pitch to suggest that companies can ignore laws they don't like, and operate above the law?
        JumpCrisscross 2mo ago
        > it's a worse pitch to suggest that companies can ignore laws they don't like, and operate above the law? It’s also worse to murder kittens. That isn’t the choice at hand. The difference is between states adapting with a regulatory framework and those sticking with economic incumbents. (Also, when the taxi medallion industry was at its peak, lenders did run roughshod over the law.)
        runako 2mo ago
        In context, your comment reads as a defense of companies ignoring laws: >> that big companies are (sometimes) bound by the same laws that bind the rest of us > Not if they’re stupid laws! States won't adapt to new technologies at the same time, this is embedded in the design of federalism.
        JumpCrisscross 2mo ago
        > States won't adapt to new technologies at the same time, this is embedded in the design of federalism …how are you missing this. I’m saying the states failing to adapt need to do so or have their governments replaced. That all of these states are also facing multi-party insurgencies doesn’t strike me as a coïncidence. Pretending the corruption in e.g. New York around this is fine is just such a weird take.
  - bhelkey 2mo ago
    > Apparently NY state laws also require a human driver at the wheel. Earlier this year, Waymo had a permit to test 8 autonomous vehicles with safety drivers in NYC. The permit was not renewed [1]. Waymo can no longer drive autonomously (even with a safety driver) in NYC. What changed between when the testing permit was issued and when a renewal of permit was declined? NYC had a political shift in leadership. [1] https://www.thecityreporter.nyc/2026/04/06/waymo-driverless-cars-testing-roads-autonomous-vehicle/ https://www.thecityreporter.nyc/2026/04/06/waymo-driverless-...
- Zambyte 2mo ago
  Getting around Boston is very easy. Flooding the streets with more cars won't make it easier. A government that listens to the people it governs is a good government.
  - xnx 2mo ago
    Eh, the impression I got from this podcast (https://www.searchengine.show/the-trial-of-the-driverless-car/ https://www.searchengine.show/the-trial-of-the-driverless-ca...) was that unions and other special interests were blocking something that the broader population would be interested in.
    - Zambyte 2mo ago
      Ok. As someone who lives there, I get the impression that the broader population is not interested in more cars on the streets.
warkdarrior 2mo ago
They tried to roll out in New York City, but the city did not approve. https://www.twu.org/twu-tech-newsletter-waymo-no-mo-in-nyc-for-now/ https://www.twu.org/twu-tech-newsletter-waymo-no-mo-in-nyc-f...
- senkora 2mo ago
  I personally saw a Waymo in NYC on June 26th at 14th St and 8th Avenue, so they’ve done some recent testing at least.
  - xnx 2mo ago
    It's still legal for Waymo to manually drive them around for mapping.
    - senkora 2mo ago
      That could definitely be it. I didn’t get a clear view of the driver’s seat, so I don’t know whether or not the driver was manually controlling it.
- cyberax 2mo ago
  NYC's government is focused on maximizing the pain and inconvenience for its citizens. So this tracks.
  - runako 2mo ago
    State law requires a human driver to operate vehicles at all times. This is not coming from NYC.
WarmWash 2mo ago
NYC has Mamdani, who is a very progressive populist mayor, and a longtime (active) supporter of the taxi drivers union. There is close to zero chance it gets approval in NYC before 2030. I'd be totally floored if he goes against the union, but the optics are absolutely terrible for cabs.
- overfeed 2mo ago
  Waymo can't launch anywhere in NY state due to state law, but by all means, trot out your favorite whipping boy.
superfrank 2mo ago
Seattle was announced as a Waymo upcoming city nearly 2 months before Houston, gets a foot less of rain than Houston each year, and usually has only 2 or 3 snow days a year. That's at least one counter example to your theory.
bhelkey 2mo ago
At the start of this year, Waymo had a permit to test eight autonomous vehicles with a safety driver behind the wheel in NYC. The permit expired March 31st [1]. Waymo may no longer test autonomous driving (even with a safety driver) in NYC. Waymo is not currently testing in NYC for political reasons. [1] https://www.thecityreporter.nyc/2026/04/06/waymo-driverless-cars-testing-roads-autonomous-vehicle/ https://www.thecityreporter.nyc/2026/04/06/waymo-driverless-...

by runako 2mo ago

xnx 2mo ago

Blocked even from testing in NYC. Blocked from DC and Boston. Unfortunately this does have more to do with bad government than bad weather.

runako 2mo ago
Boston, according to Waymo[1], is dependent on the legislature making autonomous vehicles legal. Apparently NY state laws also require a human driver at the wheel. The only surprising thing about this is that other states did not require changes in law. It's Good, Actually, that big companies are (sometimes) bound by the same laws that bind the rest of us. In any case, there are more than 2-3 "blue" states. We can note that it's also not running in cold "red" states either. The climate angle fits the data best and aligns with what Waymo says, which aligns with what we have known about the tech for at least a decade. (That note also suggests they are still testing their cold-weather kit and are not quite ready.) 1 - https://waymo.com/blog/shorts/back-to-boston/ https://waymo.com/blog/shorts/back-to-boston/
- JumpCrisscross 2mo ago
  > that big companies are (sometimes) bound by the same laws that bind the rest of us Not if they’re stupid laws!
  - lokar 2mo ago
    Even then. There is value in uniform rule of law.
    - JumpCrisscross 2mo ago
      > There is value in uniform rule of law Sure. OP's point is these products and investments are accruing disproportionately to red cities and states. Sinking together isn't a great pitch.
      - runako 2mo ago
        > these products and investments are accruing disproportionately to red cities and states Is this true at the city level? > Sinking together isn't a great pitch. Surely it's a worse pitch to suggest that companies can ignore laws they don't like, and operate above the law?
        JumpCrisscross 2mo ago
        > it's a worse pitch to suggest that companies can ignore laws they don't like, and operate above the law? It’s also worse to murder kittens. That isn’t the choice at hand. The difference is between states adapting with a regulatory framework and those sticking with economic incumbents. (Also, when the taxi medallion industry was at its peak, lenders did run roughshod over the law.)
        runako 2mo ago
        In context, your comment reads as a defense of companies ignoring laws: >> that big companies are (sometimes) bound by the same laws that bind the rest of us > Not if they’re stupid laws! States won't adapt to new technologies at the same time, this is embedded in the design of federalism.
        JumpCrisscross 2mo ago
        > States won't adapt to new technologies at the same time, this is embedded in the design of federalism …how are you missing this. I’m saying the states failing to adapt need to do so or have their governments replaced. That all of these states are also facing multi-party insurgencies doesn’t strike me as a coïncidence. Pretending the corruption in e.g. New York around this is fine is just such a weird take.
- bhelkey 2mo ago
  > Apparently NY state laws also require a human driver at the wheel. Earlier this year, Waymo had a permit to test 8 autonomous vehicles with safety drivers in NYC. The permit was not renewed [1]. Waymo can no longer drive autonomously (even with a safety driver) in NYC. What changed between when the testing permit was issued and when a renewal of permit was declined? NYC had a political shift in leadership. [1] https://www.thecityreporter.nyc/2026/04/06/waymo-driverless-cars-testing-roads-autonomous-vehicle/ https://www.thecityreporter.nyc/2026/04/06/waymo-driverless-...
Zambyte 2mo ago
Getting around Boston is very easy. Flooding the streets with more cars won't make it easier. A government that listens to the people it governs is a good government.
- xnx 2mo ago
  Eh, the impression I got from this podcast (https://www.searchengine.show/the-trial-of-the-driverless-car/ https://www.searchengine.show/the-trial-of-the-driverless-ca...) was that unions and other special interests were blocking something that the broader population would be interested in.
  - Zambyte 2mo ago
    Ok. As someone who lives there, I get the impression that the broader population is not interested in more cars on the streets.

warkdarrior 2mo ago

They tried to roll out in New York City, but the city did not approve. https://www.twu.org/twu-tech-newsletter-waymo-no-mo-in-nyc-for-now/ https://www.twu.org/twu-tech-newsletter-waymo-no-mo-in-nyc-f...

senkora 2mo ago
I personally saw a Waymo in NYC on June 26th at 14th St and 8th Avenue, so they’ve done some recent testing at least.
- xnx 2mo ago
  It's still legal for Waymo to manually drive them around for mapping.
  - senkora 2mo ago
    That could definitely be it. I didn’t get a clear view of the driver’s seat, so I don’t know whether or not the driver was manually controlling it.
cyberax 2mo ago
NYC's government is focused on maximizing the pain and inconvenience for its citizens. So this tracks.
- runako 2mo ago
  State law requires a human driver to operate vehicles at all times. This is not coming from NYC.

WarmWash 2mo ago

NYC has Mamdani, who is a very progressive populist mayor, and a longtime (active) supporter of the taxi drivers union. There is close to zero chance it gets approval in NYC before 2030. I'd be totally floored if he goes against the union, but the optics are absolutely terrible for cabs.

overfeed 2mo ago
Waymo can't launch anywhere in NY state due to state law, but by all means, trot out your favorite whipping boy.

superfrank 2mo ago

Seattle was announced as a Waymo upcoming city nearly 2 months before Houston, gets a foot less of rain than Houston each year, and usually has only 2 or 3 snow days a year. That's at least one counter example to your theory.

bhelkey 2mo ago

At the start of this year, Waymo had a permit to test eight autonomous vehicles with a safety driver behind the wheel in NYC. The permit expired March 31st [1]. Waymo may no longer test autonomous driving (even with a safety driver) in NYC. Waymo is not currently testing in NYC for political reasons. [1] https://www.thecityreporter.nyc/2026/04/06/waymo-driverless-cars-testing-roads-autonomous-vehicle/ https://www.thecityreporter.nyc/2026/04/06/waymo-driverless-...