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This will lead to some new and exciting ways of starting a housefire.

kibwen 2mo ago
While the potential for fires shouldn't be dismissed, for batteries designed to be stationary rather than mobile (such as in an e-bike), you can use a chemistry optimized for stability rather than optimizing for compact weight and size.
- vvbull 2mo ago
  It's not the batteries that are the concern. It's skipping the fuse box.
  - toast0 2mo ago
    UK has ring mains, so appliances have fused plugs to protect the mains wires from being overloaded.
alexjurkiewicz 2mo ago
How many houses in Britain have wiring that is less than 800 W away from starting a fire? How many of those houses have the disposable income to buy a plug in battery? Yes, more electricity means more risk of fire. But 800W batteries do not seem like a major safety issue
xbmcuser 2mo ago
The new sodium batteries are a lot safer than the lithium chemistries. And we already do have type of home batteries they are just called UPS systems. The real game changer will be when 3-5kwh plugin batteries fall below $150-200pkwh as at those prices batteries will make sense even for apartment owners/renters with no solar to use it to demand shift as time of day electricity prices get more common.
- hkt 2mo ago
  Why that number in particular? Are you thinking of payback period of something else?
  - xbmcuser 2mo ago
    Yes payback period batteries as at those prices payback period falls below 5 years with just 4-5c arbitrage so even if you don't have solar like most apartments it is still useful. And the price is low enough that it can be made mandatory for all new home construction without inflating home prices.
- vvbull 2mo ago
  The problem isn't the battery catching fire, it's that you no longer have a circuit breaker between your appliances and the generator. Meaning you could, especially if you have several batteries, push load through wires in the wall in excess of what is rated for.
  - gambiting 2mo ago
    Maybe you don't know this, but in the UK every single appliance has its own individual fuse right inside the plug.
    - angry_octet 2mo ago
      You can have multiple loads and sources that are in-spec but the wiring between them is overloaded.
      - gambiting 2mo ago
        Sure, but now we're talking about some freak situation where you have multiple sources with a combined allowed load of more than 32amps with 3 or more connected devices drawing at their max rating or above, but only when on battery power when you have no grid connection. Like, it could happen but we're entering the "fun to think about" territory.

While the potential for fires shouldn't be dismissed, for batteries designed to be stationary rather than mobile (such as in an e-bike), you can use a chemistry optimized for stability rather than optimizing for compact weight and size.

vvbull 2mo ago
It's not the batteries that are the concern. It's skipping the fuse box.
- toast0 2mo ago
  UK has ring mains, so appliances have fused plugs to protect the mains wires from being overloaded.

alexjurkiewicz 2mo ago

How many houses in Britain have wiring that is less than 800 W away from starting a fire? How many of those houses have the disposable income to buy a plug in battery? Yes, more electricity means more risk of fire. But 800W batteries do not seem like a major safety issue

xbmcuser 2mo ago

The new sodium batteries are a lot safer than the lithium chemistries. And we already do have type of home batteries they are just called UPS systems. The real game changer will be when 3-5kwh plugin batteries fall below $150-200pkwh as at those prices batteries will make sense even for apartment owners/renters with no solar to use it to demand shift as time of day electricity prices get more common.

hkt 2mo ago
Why that number in particular? Are you thinking of payback period of something else?
- xbmcuser 2mo ago
  Yes payback period batteries as at those prices payback period falls below 5 years with just 4-5c arbitrage so even if you don't have solar like most apartments it is still useful. And the price is low enough that it can be made mandatory for all new home construction without inflating home prices.
vvbull 2mo ago
The problem isn't the battery catching fire, it's that you no longer have a circuit breaker between your appliances and the generator. Meaning you could, especially if you have several batteries, push load through wires in the wall in excess of what is rated for.
- gambiting 2mo ago
  Maybe you don't know this, but in the UK every single appliance has its own individual fuse right inside the plug.
  - angry_octet 2mo ago
    You can have multiple loads and sources that are in-spec but the wiring between them is overloaded.
    - gambiting 2mo ago
      Sure, but now we're talking about some freak situation where you have multiple sources with a combined allowed load of more than 32amps with 3 or more connected devices drawing at their max rating or above, but only when on battery power when you have no grid connection. Like, it could happen but we're entering the "fun to think about" territory.