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I'm all for fusion research. Love the idea of clean, inexhaustible power. However, the NIF has consistently over promised and under delivered, and they have no

I'm all for fusion research. Love the idea of clean, inexhaustible power. However, the NIF has consistently over promised and under delivered, and they have no idea _what_ their problems are [1]. They could use a little restraint when making schedule predictions. [1] http://fire.pppl.gov/NIF_NIC_report_rev5_koonin_2012.pdf http://fire.pppl.gov/NIF_NIC_report_rev5_koonin_2012.pdf

cjensen 14y ago
Yep. NIF is such an old project that it was used as the "digitizer" in the original TRON movie. Still no progress.
- shardling 14y ago
  What a silly thing to say -- of course there has been progress, even if it's only a better understanding of what doesn't work.
  - cjensen 14y ago
    Only the US bothers with lasers because everyone else understands that lasers don't work for fusion. Tokamaks are where it's at. The only real use of NIF is to better understand fusion so as to better understand how nuclear weapons work. I just want them to be honest about it.
    - uvdiv 14y ago
      Only the US bothers with lasers because everyone else understands that lasers don't work for fusion. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Laser_Mégajoule https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Laser_Mégajoule I personally think lasers are much more promising, if only because of how much room there is for disruption with solid-state lasers. Look at how horrible the NIF lasers are: ~1% efficient [0], billions of dollars, the size of a warehouse [1]. And the fusion end seems to work fine. [0] https://lasers.llnl.gov/about/nif/about.php https://lasers.llnl.gov/about/nif/about.php [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Ignition_Facility#Driver_laser https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Ignition_Facility#Dri...
- rndmize 14y ago
  Uh, no. There have been multiple lasers built at LLNL of increasing power over the decades - NIF is the replacement for NOVA, which was the replacement for SHIVA - which was used in TRON. Each successive laser has been least an order of magnitude more powerful than the previous I believe. And to say "no progress" is to belittle the efforts of a lot of people that are pushing the boundaries of physics and the associated engineering problems.

cjensen 14y ago

Yep. NIF is such an old project that it was used as the "digitizer" in the original TRON movie. Still no progress.

shardling 14y ago
What a silly thing to say -- of course there has been progress, even if it's only a better understanding of what doesn't work.
- cjensen 14y ago
  Only the US bothers with lasers because everyone else understands that lasers don't work for fusion. Tokamaks are where it's at. The only real use of NIF is to better understand fusion so as to better understand how nuclear weapons work. I just want them to be honest about it.
  - uvdiv 14y ago
    Only the US bothers with lasers because everyone else understands that lasers don't work for fusion. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Laser_Mégajoule https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Laser_Mégajoule I personally think lasers are much more promising, if only because of how much room there is for disruption with solid-state lasers. Look at how horrible the NIF lasers are: ~1% efficient [0], billions of dollars, the size of a warehouse [1]. And the fusion end seems to work fine. [0] https://lasers.llnl.gov/about/nif/about.php https://lasers.llnl.gov/about/nif/about.php [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Ignition_Facility#Driver_laser https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Ignition_Facility#Dri...
rndmize 14y ago
Uh, no. There have been multiple lasers built at LLNL of increasing power over the decades - NIF is the replacement for NOVA, which was the replacement for SHIVA - which was used in TRON. Each successive laser has been least an order of magnitude more powerful than the previous I believe. And to say "no progress" is to belittle the efforts of a lot of people that are pushing the boundaries of physics and the associated engineering problems.