6 ms·

Would you mind saying what the topic of the article you started writing was? Also, did you do it in a sandbox on your account page or just out in the open? Wit

Would you mind saying what the topic of the article you started writing was? Also, did you do it in a sandbox on your account page or just out in the open? Without more context your statement creates an extremely biased view against Wikipedia.

CJefferson 14y ago
Why is it a extremely biased view against Wikipedia? I just stated exactly what happened, when I tried to make a new article. Now, you can argue that I shouldn't just start making an article, but that's another discussion. I started writing an article about 'C++14', the new C++ standard. I was writing a nicely referenced list of the new features which have already been voted into the standard, when a box popped up telling me there was a conflict, as someone else had wiped the page clean. So I threw my text away and left wikipedia again.
- jacques_chester 14y ago
  And that, right there, is the ratchet function which has shut the door on wikipedia. Insiders can quickly undo anything. They are familiar with the tools and the procedures. You might have contributed for the rest of your life. That potential stream of valuable contributions is now lost to wikipedia, potentially forever. Now compound that over every single expert to whom so much was promised by the interface, and from whom the promise was removed by wikipedians.
  - rsync 14y ago
    Bingo. I just experienced this myself merely days ago. No details. Just a well formed, minor contribution to an article that was insta-deleted because of "notability". Which was news to me because, while I am aware articles themselves need to be notable, now some folks are enforcing notability on subsets of articles. In this case, a single row in a table listing like items.
    - pekk 14y ago
      Meanwhile, for every object ever drawn in an anime, that anime MUST be mentioned in the article for the object. Because this is notable content, you see... Wikipedia, 2030: "The Holocaust was also mentioned in episode #22 of Robot Cheerleader Girl, where Tanaka-san fell headfirst into a bucket while giving a speech about it."
    - tptacek 14y ago
      Which article?
- martey 14y ago
  Looking at the revision history of the page - https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=C%2B%2B14&action=history https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=C%2B%2B14&act... - your contributions were not deleted, but were merged into the main C++ article by another contributor. Other articles about individual C++ standards already redirect there - see https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=C%2B%2B98&redirect=no https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=C%2B%2B98&red... I think your experience suggests that Wikipedia's tools are not as user-friendly as they should be to new or inexperienced editors, rather than that contributing to Wikipedia is useless, because your contributions will be deleted.
  - Jtsummers 14y ago
    That's a problem though, it got merged in as a blurb, but the article itself hadn't had a chance to be fleshed out (where it could've been enough to justify its own page) after just a few minutes.
    - icebraining 14y ago
      I think you're supposed to use a Userspace draft for such purpose: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Help:Userspace_draft http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Help:Userspace_draft That said, I only know about them by chance.
      - Jtsummers 14y ago
        Interesting. Just tried making up a page and saw a bulleted list of info at the top. You can also start your new article at Special:Mypage/Erlang++. There, you can develop the article with less risk of deletion, ask other editors to help work on it, and move it into "article space" when it is ready. That points out the userspace pages. However, it's not loud enough. If the risk is so high of deletion/merging in short spans (minutes), then this should be the preferred and well advertised method of creating articles.
        Gormo 14y ago
- Aardwolf 14y ago
  I see no mention of C++14 on the site of the C++ committee: http://www.open-std.org/jtc1/sc22/wg21/ http://www.open-std.org/jtc1/sc22/wg21/ Where is there an official mention of the name C++14?
  - CJefferson 14y ago
    There are mentions in the public ally available meetings of the C++ committee.

CJefferson 14y ago

Why is it a extremely biased view against Wikipedia? I just stated exactly what happened, when I tried to make a new article. Now, you can argue that I shouldn't just start making an article, but that's another discussion. I started writing an article about 'C++14', the new C++ standard. I was writing a nicely referenced list of the new features which have already been voted into the standard, when a box popped up telling me there was a conflict, as someone else had wiped the page clean. So I threw my text away and left wikipedia again.

jacques_chester 14y ago
And that, right there, is the ratchet function which has shut the door on wikipedia. Insiders can quickly undo anything. They are familiar with the tools and the procedures. You might have contributed for the rest of your life. That potential stream of valuable contributions is now lost to wikipedia, potentially forever. Now compound that over every single expert to whom so much was promised by the interface, and from whom the promise was removed by wikipedians.
- rsync 14y ago
  Bingo. I just experienced this myself merely days ago. No details. Just a well formed, minor contribution to an article that was insta-deleted because of "notability". Which was news to me because, while I am aware articles themselves need to be notable, now some folks are enforcing notability on subsets of articles. In this case, a single row in a table listing like items.
  - pekk 14y ago
    Meanwhile, for every object ever drawn in an anime, that anime MUST be mentioned in the article for the object. Because this is notable content, you see... Wikipedia, 2030: "The Holocaust was also mentioned in episode #22 of Robot Cheerleader Girl, where Tanaka-san fell headfirst into a bucket while giving a speech about it."
  - tptacek 14y ago
    Which article?
martey 14y ago
Looking at the revision history of the page - https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=C%2B%2B14&action=history https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=C%2B%2B14&act... - your contributions were not deleted, but were merged into the main C++ article by another contributor. Other articles about individual C++ standards already redirect there - see https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=C%2B%2B98&redirect=no https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=C%2B%2B98&red... I think your experience suggests that Wikipedia's tools are not as user-friendly as they should be to new or inexperienced editors, rather than that contributing to Wikipedia is useless, because your contributions will be deleted.
- Jtsummers 14y ago
  That's a problem though, it got merged in as a blurb, but the article itself hadn't had a chance to be fleshed out (where it could've been enough to justify its own page) after just a few minutes.
  - icebraining 14y ago
    I think you're supposed to use a Userspace draft for such purpose: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Help:Userspace_draft http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Help:Userspace_draft That said, I only know about them by chance.
    - Jtsummers 14y ago
      Interesting. Just tried making up a page and saw a bulleted list of info at the top. You can also start your new article at Special:Mypage/Erlang++. There, you can develop the article with less risk of deletion, ask other editors to help work on it, and move it into "article space" when it is ready. That points out the userspace pages. However, it's not loud enough. If the risk is so high of deletion/merging in short spans (minutes), then this should be the preferred and well advertised method of creating articles.
      - Gormo 14y ago
Aardwolf 14y ago
I see no mention of C++14 on the site of the C++ committee: http://www.open-std.org/jtc1/sc22/wg21/ http://www.open-std.org/jtc1/sc22/wg21/ Where is there an official mention of the name C++14?
- CJefferson 14y ago
  There are mentions in the public ally available meetings of the C++ committee.