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Artificial intelligence. If humans are machines executing on some medium eventually it will be possible to emulate them on some other medium. Believing otherwi

by mosura 3mo ago

Artificial intelligence. If humans are machines executing on some medium eventually it will be possible to emulate them on some other medium. Believing otherwise requires some essentially religious convictions on the existence of the soul or similar.

contagiousflow 3mo ago
Sure, but that only stands if you believe the only purpose of human intelligence is for economic benefit.
- Marha01 3mo ago
  That does not follow. The argument about the possibility of artificial intelligence makes absolutely no claims about the purpose of human or artificial intelligence. One is a claim about "is", another is a claim about "ought".
jplusequalt 3mo ago
>Believing otherwise requires some essentially religious convictions on the existence of the soul or similar. My doubt has nothing to do with religion. I believe we'll never be able to harness the amount of technology required to replicate human intelligence.
zero_shift 3mo ago
We already have human intelligence. Creating new humans is easy (and fun) The only reason to emulate human intelligence is to capture it, exploit it, and reduce the negotiating power of those who have it naturally. Anyone who wants this is not a friend of human beings
- Marha01 3mo ago
  > Creating new humans is easy (and fun) This could not be further from the truth. Creating a new educated, competent human takes ~25 years, and significant costs and resources. AGI can be just copy-pasted at essentially no cost. Even a robot that is mass-produced for tens of thousands of dollars is still much less expensive and takes much less time to make than a competent human.
  - la64710 3mo ago
    But it is more than just fun , it gives purpose to our existence … pardon me but it is idiotic to look at bringing up a child so objectively.
    - Marha01 3mo ago
      Yes, but I think we should separate human economic value from the true purpose of our existence. If AI can replace us in economically valuable tasks, we will have no choice but to do so. The economic value part should be looked at objectively.
      - memonkey 3mo ago
        What is the true purpose of our existence?
        Marha01 3mo ago
        That is a very good question, perhaps without an objective answer. But it's definitely not a 9-5 job, at least for me.
  - goatlover 3mo ago
    Except there's already billions of humans with millions becoming competent humans every year. Also the machine analogy breaks down in some ways for biological organisms. It's messier, more complex and organisms weren't designed for a purpose. There is no software humans are running. That's just a metaphor for whatever the brain & nervous system (throughout the body) does.
- anonymous_sorry 3mo ago
  I do mostly agree with you, but... > Creating new humans is easy If you did a survey I suspect agreement with this statement would be rather bimodal.
  - zero_shift 3mo ago
    That's fair. It starts easy, then gets difficult.

by mosura 3mo ago

contagiousflow 3mo ago

Sure, but that only stands if you believe the only purpose of human intelligence is for economic benefit.

Marha01 3mo ago
That does not follow. The argument about the possibility of artificial intelligence makes absolutely no claims about the purpose of human or artificial intelligence. One is a claim about "is", another is a claim about "ought".

jplusequalt 3mo ago

>Believing otherwise requires some essentially religious convictions on the existence of the soul or similar. My doubt has nothing to do with religion. I believe we'll never be able to harness the amount of technology required to replicate human intelligence.

zero_shift 3mo ago

We already have human intelligence. Creating new humans is easy (and fun) The only reason to emulate human intelligence is to capture it, exploit it, and reduce the negotiating power of those who have it naturally. Anyone who wants this is not a friend of human beings

Marha01 3mo ago
> Creating new humans is easy (and fun) This could not be further from the truth. Creating a new educated, competent human takes ~25 years, and significant costs and resources. AGI can be just copy-pasted at essentially no cost. Even a robot that is mass-produced for tens of thousands of dollars is still much less expensive and takes much less time to make than a competent human.
- la64710 3mo ago
  But it is more than just fun , it gives purpose to our existence … pardon me but it is idiotic to look at bringing up a child so objectively.
  - Marha01 3mo ago
    Yes, but I think we should separate human economic value from the true purpose of our existence. If AI can replace us in economically valuable tasks, we will have no choice but to do so. The economic value part should be looked at objectively.
    - memonkey 3mo ago
      What is the true purpose of our existence?
      - Marha01 3mo ago
        That is a very good question, perhaps without an objective answer. But it's definitely not a 9-5 job, at least for me.
- goatlover 3mo ago
  Except there's already billions of humans with millions becoming competent humans every year. Also the machine analogy breaks down in some ways for biological organisms. It's messier, more complex and organisms weren't designed for a purpose. There is no software humans are running. That's just a metaphor for whatever the brain & nervous system (throughout the body) does.
anonymous_sorry 3mo ago
I do mostly agree with you, but... > Creating new humans is easy If you did a survey I suspect agreement with this statement would be rather bimodal.
- zero_shift 3mo ago
  That's fair. It starts easy, then gets difficult.