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The founding fathers would be aghast at what America became. Hard to imagine modern America passing some of those constitutional amendments that older America p
by mmastrac 3mo ago
The founding fathers would be aghast at what America became. Hard to imagine modern America passing some of those constitutional amendments that older America passed wayyy back.
- petcat 3mo ago[flagged]
- Zigurd 3mo agoWhat about the abolitionists among the signers of the Declaration?
- petcat 3mo agoI don't want to get into a whole thing about the founding fathers and American mythology. Yes, they had some pretty good ideas that have withstood the test of time. They also had some pretty f'ing bad ideas that we had to change. So some comment about the founding fathers rolling over in their graves about what America has become is complete nonsense.
- colordrops 3mo agoWhat is your point? The original comment was really just a wry statement about the extreme level of corruption and ineffectiveness of the US government. Sounds like you find the current situation to be A-OK?
- bastardoperator 3mo agoExecutive war making, overgrown militaries, debt, party politics, concentrated power, corporate power, and foreign entanglement. The framers did not invision America in its current state, to state otherwise would be nonsense because we can just read the words they wrote.
- TFNA 3mo agoOn the other hand, why care what the American founding fathers thought? There have been two centuries since then of developments in democratic countries that some Americans could choose as a model they like more. And now it's the Chinese century anyway.
- esafak 3mo agoBecause they provide a reasonable common foundation. Otherwise you will forever be arguing with Christian nationalists.
- gorgoiler 3mo agoTo be fair, there have been a few democratic developments since the founding fathers were around. 27 at the last count.
- Cider9986 3mo agoPretty good law imo.
- antonvs 3mo ago> On the other hand, why care what the American founding fathers thought? Because they had direct experience with tyranny and exploitation, and documented their response to that in the US founding documents. We care because if you don't learn from history, you're doomed to repeat it. Which is pretty much what's happening right now.
- danudey 3mo agoAt the same time, it's necessary for societies to grow and evolve. Looking back 250 years and saying "This isn't how THEY would have done it" is not always the correct perspective. Anyway, you don't have to look back to the founding fathers. Go back to 1930's Germany and you can see all the parallels you want, much closer to today's situation and in a much more modern and relevant context.
- 3mo ago
- scoofy 3mo agoMany if not most of the founding fathers owned human beings, and the vast majority of people (94% of the population) weren't allowed to vote because they didn't own property or they happened to be female. What are you even talking about?
- amazingamazing 3mo agoWho cares what the slave owners thought. What you should care about are Americans who support this stuff now.
- BizarroLand 3mo agoIt's dumb to overlook the "founding fathers" based on what we now perceive as their personal failings. Once the dead are gone, they're gone. It's ok to rifle through their spiritual corpses for the few nuggets of useful material in them and leave the rest to the trash pile of history.