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Let's not conflate the issue. If poverty was a contributing factor for obesity, then poor people worldwide would show higher rates of poverty. People don't ge

Let's not conflate the issue. If poverty was a contributing factor for obesity, then poor people worldwide would show higher rates of poverty. People don't get fat because they are poor, they get fat because they don't care that they're getting fat. If anything, being poor would be a disincentive for obesity - why spend money on something that you don't have to when money's in short supply? By basic logic, the poorer you are, the less obese you should tend to be. Notwithstanding the occasional actual medical condition which leads to obesity, being obese is a conscious, cultural decision, and blaming it on poverty seems ridiculous.

msh 14y ago
In first world countries there is a link between obesity and poverty. In general if you are poor you a re more likely to be fat. For example see http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/14684391 http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/14684391 You also seem to imply that it's cheaper not to be fat, in many first world countries the unhealthy food seem to be the cheapest!
- notdrunkatall 14y ago
  I know that there is a link between obesity and poverty, but correlation does not necessarily imply causation, and in this case, anyone who buys and cooks their own food will immediately recognize the causation claim to be ridiculous. The unhealthy food being the cheapest food argument is bunkum - just go to reddit.com/r/budgetfood and try to tell them that processed food is cheaper. There is nothing cheaper than chicken thighs, rice, beans, noodles, and various veggies. Every week, I make a crock-pot of something tasty and healthy from scratch. This week, I made a wonderful soup with fresh carrots, potatoes, celery, onions, and pork loin. The total cost was about $15, and I got 7 big portions. Substitute something less expensive than pork loin, and it's even cheaper. Last week, I made a huge pot of spaghetti sauce, complete with italian sausage, fresh mushrooms, onions, garlic, and a few extra cans of whole tomatoes for about $10, and I wasn't even really trying to do that one cheaply. I got about ten portions out of that one. The week before, I made a quiche type-thing with a dozen eggs, some breakfast sausage, a bag of hashbrown potatoes, onions, tomatoes, and a bag of cheese. Total cost: about $10. Not the healthiest thing, but better than processed junk, and again, fills you up quite nicely 7-8 times. I could go on, but you get the picture, I'm sure, and this is just with a crock pot - if I had a functional kitchen, my cooking options would expand considerably. People who eat unhealthy food don't eat it because it's cheaper than healthy food, they eat it because they don't want to cook. But if you really want to know why poor people tend to be obese, watch what they drink: sugar. All day, every day, it's sugary drinks, from kool-aid to sweet tea to sodas - I don't know why, but for some reason poor people tend to drink a lot of sugary trash. Which, again, is more expensive than the healthier option: water. Leftist apologists like to trot out the 'healthy food is more expensive' argument because suggesting that poor people are obese because of their lifestyle decisions rather than their supposed status as victims of the system runs contrary to the left's general line of bullshit, which is that if there is a problem, it stems from systemic failure, and that a government policy should be implemented to alleviate that issue. Of course, not all problems can be fixed with government programs, this being one of them. People are not obese because they are victims, they are obese because they value stuffing their face with unhealthy food more than they value being fit. It really is that simple, and unfortunately, that is a social problem that no government policy can fix.
  - msh 14y ago
    My original argument was that there was a causality between poverty and obesity which I thought you argued against but I am glad that we agree. The underlying reasons for this link I don't think we will agree on.
    - notdrunkatall 14y ago
      I think you may be a little confused about the difference between causation and correlation. There is a correlation between obesity and poverty, but whether poverty is a cause of obesity or not is far from certain, and it is my stance that it is not a cause at all - and especially not because 'processed foods are cheaper than healthy foods.' Anyone who believes that has not spent nearly enough time in grocery stores, and anyone who believes that poor people are fat primarily because of an inability to afford healthy foods has not spent enough time around poor people.
      - msh 14y ago
        No I am not confused. If you read my original post I only talk about correlation, not cause. I think you do the argument far to black and white but that was not what was my point.

msh 14y ago

In first world countries there is a link between obesity and poverty. In general if you are poor you a re more likely to be fat. For example see http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/14684391 http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/14684391 You also seem to imply that it's cheaper not to be fat, in many first world countries the unhealthy food seem to be the cheapest!

notdrunkatall 14y ago
I know that there is a link between obesity and poverty, but correlation does not necessarily imply causation, and in this case, anyone who buys and cooks their own food will immediately recognize the causation claim to be ridiculous. The unhealthy food being the cheapest food argument is bunkum - just go to reddit.com/r/budgetfood and try to tell them that processed food is cheaper. There is nothing cheaper than chicken thighs, rice, beans, noodles, and various veggies. Every week, I make a crock-pot of something tasty and healthy from scratch. This week, I made a wonderful soup with fresh carrots, potatoes, celery, onions, and pork loin. The total cost was about $15, and I got 7 big portions. Substitute something less expensive than pork loin, and it's even cheaper. Last week, I made a huge pot of spaghetti sauce, complete with italian sausage, fresh mushrooms, onions, garlic, and a few extra cans of whole tomatoes for about $10, and I wasn't even really trying to do that one cheaply. I got about ten portions out of that one. The week before, I made a quiche type-thing with a dozen eggs, some breakfast sausage, a bag of hashbrown potatoes, onions, tomatoes, and a bag of cheese. Total cost: about $10. Not the healthiest thing, but better than processed junk, and again, fills you up quite nicely 7-8 times. I could go on, but you get the picture, I'm sure, and this is just with a crock pot - if I had a functional kitchen, my cooking options would expand considerably. People who eat unhealthy food don't eat it because it's cheaper than healthy food, they eat it because they don't want to cook. But if you really want to know why poor people tend to be obese, watch what they drink: sugar. All day, every day, it's sugary drinks, from kool-aid to sweet tea to sodas - I don't know why, but for some reason poor people tend to drink a lot of sugary trash. Which, again, is more expensive than the healthier option: water. Leftist apologists like to trot out the 'healthy food is more expensive' argument because suggesting that poor people are obese because of their lifestyle decisions rather than their supposed status as victims of the system runs contrary to the left's general line of bullshit, which is that if there is a problem, it stems from systemic failure, and that a government policy should be implemented to alleviate that issue. Of course, not all problems can be fixed with government programs, this being one of them. People are not obese because they are victims, they are obese because they value stuffing their face with unhealthy food more than they value being fit. It really is that simple, and unfortunately, that is a social problem that no government policy can fix.
- msh 14y ago
  My original argument was that there was a causality between poverty and obesity which I thought you argued against but I am glad that we agree. The underlying reasons for this link I don't think we will agree on.
  - notdrunkatall 14y ago
    I think you may be a little confused about the difference between causation and correlation. There is a correlation between obesity and poverty, but whether poverty is a cause of obesity or not is far from certain, and it is my stance that it is not a cause at all - and especially not because 'processed foods are cheaper than healthy foods.' Anyone who believes that has not spent nearly enough time in grocery stores, and anyone who believes that poor people are fat primarily because of an inability to afford healthy foods has not spent enough time around poor people.
    - msh 14y ago
      No I am not confused. If you read my original post I only talk about correlation, not cause. I think you do the argument far to black and white but that was not what was my point.