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Uh, no, I was in the Army and I learned way more than not getting killed or court martialed. In fact, you saying that says either your military sucks at trainin

by zedshaw 14y ago

Uh, no, I was in the Army and I learned way more than not getting killed or court martialed. In fact, you saying that says either your military sucks at training or you're lying. It also doesn't answer my direct criticism of your comment. You claimed you can't learn any skill in 10 weeks, which is complete bullshit. People learn quite a lot of things in less time, so saying that is stupid. Maybe you meant to say something less hyperbolic like, "I doubt that someone could master programming in 10 weeks." This is true, but then they don't claim to create master programmers, they claim to create junior programmers, which I (as someone who actually does train people for a living) can say is entirely possible.

meaty 14y ago
The military, well the British Army which is my only experience (not strictly true [1]), does suck at training. I mean really suck. Most knowledge is pumped down via training manuals written by people detached from the equipment or scenarios or is done via assimilation. That inevitably ends up with people who have ascended to a higher rank due to ass-licking giving years out of date advice to lower ranks. At the end of the day, it's a pyramid of process and chaos. Thank fuck I had the chance to resign my commission (cuts cuts cuts) before I got shipped to Iraq. I'm saying that you cannot learn any skill to a reasonably merchantable level in 10 weeks. Regarding hyperbole, we haven't forgotten "Rails Is a Ghetto" yet... [1] My background is EE, particularly RF comms. I took the technical lead on a project and had to write training guides for the US military to use certain communications equipment. The mantra amongst the specifications was "dumb it down so a brain damaged monkey could operate it".
- zedshaw 14y ago
  So, you get to say something incredibly invalid and easily disproven like "you can not learn any skill in 10 weeks" because I wrote an essay in 2008? Four years ago? Let me guess, you aren't very good at this whole logical argument thing which why you're just wrong here. Again, merchantable skill is subjective and based on the free market, so no, I could learn a "merchantable" skill in 2 hours. Cleaning toilets comes to mind as one very such skill. You're just wrong. It's possible to learn skills in 10 weeks of 8-10 hour days, and learn them well. It's possible to become a junior programmer in that time. It's possible to learn a ton of different skill in that time. You actually meant mastering these skills, and just refuse to admit it.
  - meaty 14y ago
    No that's not what I suggested. Read it again a couple of times, carefully. I think it was a logical and concise argument. Perhaps a better statement is: "any semi technical skill takes way more than 10 weeks to become productive and not a risk". Are you happy now?
    - dools 14y ago
      I still disagree. There are a shitload of very technical skills you can learn in 10 weeks proficiently enough to produce valuable work. Risk management is up to the employer.

by zedshaw 14y ago

meaty 14y ago

The military, well the British Army which is my only experience (not strictly true [1]), does suck at training. I mean really suck. Most knowledge is pumped down via training manuals written by people detached from the equipment or scenarios or is done via assimilation. That inevitably ends up with people who have ascended to a higher rank due to ass-licking giving years out of date advice to lower ranks. At the end of the day, it's a pyramid of process and chaos. Thank fuck I had the chance to resign my commission (cuts cuts cuts) before I got shipped to Iraq. I'm saying that you cannot learn any skill to a reasonably merchantable level in 10 weeks. Regarding hyperbole, we haven't forgotten "Rails Is a Ghetto" yet... [1] My background is EE, particularly RF comms. I took the technical lead on a project and had to write training guides for the US military to use certain communications equipment. The mantra amongst the specifications was "dumb it down so a brain damaged monkey could operate it".

zedshaw 14y ago
So, you get to say something incredibly invalid and easily disproven like "you can not learn any skill in 10 weeks" because I wrote an essay in 2008? Four years ago? Let me guess, you aren't very good at this whole logical argument thing which why you're just wrong here. Again, merchantable skill is subjective and based on the free market, so no, I could learn a "merchantable" skill in 2 hours. Cleaning toilets comes to mind as one very such skill. You're just wrong. It's possible to learn skills in 10 weeks of 8-10 hour days, and learn them well. It's possible to become a junior programmer in that time. It's possible to learn a ton of different skill in that time. You actually meant mastering these skills, and just refuse to admit it.
- meaty 14y ago
  No that's not what I suggested. Read it again a couple of times, carefully. I think it was a logical and concise argument. Perhaps a better statement is: "any semi technical skill takes way more than 10 weeks to become productive and not a risk". Are you happy now?
  - dools 14y ago
    I still disagree. There are a shitload of very technical skills you can learn in 10 weeks proficiently enough to produce valuable work. Risk management is up to the employer.