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AliExpress hit with record $629M fine for counterfeit and illegal goods

51 points by speckx 4mo ago

draw_down 4mo ago
[dead]
nothercastle 4mo ago
Now do Amazon
- cromka 4mo ago
  Exactly. Same toxic sh*t is sold on Amazon with higher prices and no oversight.
- hulitu 4mo ago
  Error. Amazon has lobby.
CM30 4mo ago
Honestly, it's kinda overdue. If a normal shop or business sold as many counterfeit or illegal good as AliExpress (or Amazon), they'd be shut down and the owners/board charged. The fact these companies seem to be able to just get away with having no quality control at all and ignoring every law in sight because they're eCommerce 'marketplaces' is absolutely insane to me. Hopefully something similar happens to Amazon as well.
- blitzar 4mo ago
  This is what happens in the physical world... Apparently there is a "Police Intellectual Property Crime Unit (PIPCU)" at City of London Police that kick in doors. https://www.cityoflondon.police.uk/news/city-of-london/news/2024/july/six-arrested-and-5-million-of-counterfeit-goods-seized-from-shop-basement-during-camden-raid/ https://www.cityoflondon.police.uk/news/city-of-london/news/...
  - sysguest 3mo ago
    well if you're some random guy in china pretending to be a company, that PIPCU can't kick in your doors and it takes only few typings and clickings to forge a new company ID... so... solution? deposit money for ID-guarantee.
- benoau 4mo ago
  This is long overdue for games too, imagine how long a retail store would last if they let kids spend a thousand bucks no questions asked... but this is like a noble goal if it's an app or game.
BlackRabbit1 4mo ago
China like "Let us starve the EU a little bit on all crucial electronics components so they can overthink their decision". Difficult to negotiate if you are all in on a Asian supply chain to get your stuff done.
- snowpid 4mo ago
  Chinu != All Asia. Esspecially on geopolitics Japan, South Korea and Taiwan are anti China.
ChrisArchitect 4mo ago
Source: https://digital-strategy.ec.europa.eu/en/news/commission-fines-aliexpress-eu550-million-breaching-digital-services-act https://digital-strategy.ec.europa.eu/en/news/commission-fin... (https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=48977201 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=48977201)
tancop 4mo ago
unsafe goods are a real problem. counterfeit are not as long as you know its fake before you buy it, and thats true most of the time on these platforms. cut the fine in half.
- crtasm 4mo ago
  How do you know the fake product is safe though?
  - Ekaros 4mo ago
    How do you know non-counterfeit product is safe?
    - goobatrooba 4mo ago
      Generally, testing, certificates, and legal culpability if something goes wrong. But if you buy a fake there is no one you can sue.
      - subscribed 4mo ago
        More like you can get $5 in the class action lawsuit settlement, after 5 years :)
    - crtasm 4mo ago
      GP appears to be claiming people can tell whether a counterfeit is unsafe. I'm curious how they think that's possible.
      - sysguest 3mo ago
        well maybe that comment was to diverge public opinion on "anti-counterfeit" here... the main discussion here was about chinese ecommerce (temu, aliexpress) selling counterfeit fake products... and this guy shows up saying "products are unsafe!" well that pattern is a bit... too obvious to me
iamleppert 4mo ago
Tiktok Shop needs to be next. They openly allow sellers to advertise 1 TB SD cards for $15 each, and many more scams just like it. When you report any of the listings, you get an automated "Doesn't violate our terms." notification. I have started opening up complaints with the BBB, FTC, my state's Attorney General.
- toyg 4mo ago
  Where do you buy reliable SD cards without overpaying? At the moment it feels like I can waste a little money on AliExpress, waste more money on Amazon, or be taxed to finance the existence of some outdated brick&mortar chain...
  - jazzyjackson 4mo ago
    I don’t know man, brick and mortar might not be so outdated if one struggles to find an alternative with good reputation and support. I don’t mind supporting adorama and bh photo, they ship fast and take care to keep me as a customer One may also buy direct from Samsung https://www.samsung.com/us/memory-storage/memory-card/ https://www.samsung.com/us/memory-storage/memory-card/
- subscribed 4mo ago
  I get exactly the same response from ebay when I report counterfeit/fake items. Takes much more effort to get through the reporting process too.
peter_stokes 4mo ago
title should be in euros (€550 million), so its clear the bloc responsible. and as usual, almost every one of the """criteria""" is completely arbitrary if you read the full press release: https://ec.europa.eu/commission/presscorner/detail/en/ip_26_1654 https://ec.europa.eu/commission/presscorner/detail/en/ip_26_... new tax base unlocked! woohoo
akk0 4mo ago
I could not give less of a shit about counterfeit goods, but of course for safety there understandably are rules and those rules should be enforced. In general, though, Aliexpress has a lot of goodwill with me; I buy stuff from there with some regularity and personally have seldom made a bad buy. I'm still rocking my decade old €10 polarized sunglasses, my 2018 €25 soldering iron, screwdriver and so forth.
tracker1 4mo ago
I've had a few bad experiences... massive delayed deliveries and products that are just DOA. I've stopped buying anything through them and will just pay the extra from Amazon or other domestic options.
IronWolve 4mo ago
I've known a few people that had their products copied by china and sold on amazon, ignoring patents. Same with copies of books. I've even bought a couple items just to find out they are knock offs. Its a big issue on amazon.
prirun 4mo ago
I compare online marketplaces to ISPs: we don't expect ISPs to filter the traffic going over their network to make sure it complies with all laws, because that would be impossible. Having actually run a marketplace in a previous life, it's a similar situation. How is a marketplace with millions of products supposed to vet each individual product? About the only thing a marketplace can do is provide some kind of customer feedback mechanism, make sure customers can get refunds easily and quickly, and kick off merchants and buyers that have too many complaints (though they will probably just register again under a different name).

51 points by speckx 4mo ago

draw_down 4mo ago

[dead]

nothercastle 4mo ago

Now do Amazon

cromka 4mo ago
Exactly. Same toxic sh*t is sold on Amazon with higher prices and no oversight.
hulitu 4mo ago
Error. Amazon has lobby.

CM30 4mo ago

Honestly, it's kinda overdue. If a normal shop or business sold as many counterfeit or illegal good as AliExpress (or Amazon), they'd be shut down and the owners/board charged. The fact these companies seem to be able to just get away with having no quality control at all and ignoring every law in sight because they're eCommerce 'marketplaces' is absolutely insane to me. Hopefully something similar happens to Amazon as well.

blitzar 4mo ago
This is what happens in the physical world... Apparently there is a "Police Intellectual Property Crime Unit (PIPCU)" at City of London Police that kick in doors. https://www.cityoflondon.police.uk/news/city-of-london/news/2024/july/six-arrested-and-5-million-of-counterfeit-goods-seized-from-shop-basement-during-camden-raid/ https://www.cityoflondon.police.uk/news/city-of-london/news/...
- sysguest 3mo ago
  well if you're some random guy in china pretending to be a company, that PIPCU can't kick in your doors and it takes only few typings and clickings to forge a new company ID... so... solution? deposit money for ID-guarantee.
benoau 4mo ago
This is long overdue for games too, imagine how long a retail store would last if they let kids spend a thousand bucks no questions asked... but this is like a noble goal if it's an app or game.

BlackRabbit1 4mo ago

China like "Let us starve the EU a little bit on all crucial electronics components so they can overthink their decision". Difficult to negotiate if you are all in on a Asian supply chain to get your stuff done.

snowpid 4mo ago
Chinu != All Asia. Esspecially on geopolitics Japan, South Korea and Taiwan are anti China.

ChrisArchitect 4mo ago

Source: https://digital-strategy.ec.europa.eu/en/news/commission-fines-aliexpress-eu550-million-breaching-digital-services-act https://digital-strategy.ec.europa.eu/en/news/commission-fin... (https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=48977201 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=48977201)

tancop 4mo ago

unsafe goods are a real problem. counterfeit are not as long as you know its fake before you buy it, and thats true most of the time on these platforms. cut the fine in half.

crtasm 4mo ago
How do you know the fake product is safe though?
- Ekaros 4mo ago
  How do you know non-counterfeit product is safe?
  - goobatrooba 4mo ago
    Generally, testing, certificates, and legal culpability if something goes wrong. But if you buy a fake there is no one you can sue.
    - subscribed 4mo ago
      More like you can get $5 in the class action lawsuit settlement, after 5 years :)
  - crtasm 4mo ago
    GP appears to be claiming people can tell whether a counterfeit is unsafe. I'm curious how they think that's possible.
    - sysguest 3mo ago
      well maybe that comment was to diverge public opinion on "anti-counterfeit" here... the main discussion here was about chinese ecommerce (temu, aliexpress) selling counterfeit fake products... and this guy shows up saying "products are unsafe!" well that pattern is a bit... too obvious to me

iamleppert 4mo ago

Tiktok Shop needs to be next. They openly allow sellers to advertise 1 TB SD cards for $15 each, and many more scams just like it. When you report any of the listings, you get an automated "Doesn't violate our terms." notification. I have started opening up complaints with the BBB, FTC, my state's Attorney General.

toyg 4mo ago
Where do you buy reliable SD cards without overpaying? At the moment it feels like I can waste a little money on AliExpress, waste more money on Amazon, or be taxed to finance the existence of some outdated brick&mortar chain...
- jazzyjackson 4mo ago
  I don’t know man, brick and mortar might not be so outdated if one struggles to find an alternative with good reputation and support. I don’t mind supporting adorama and bh photo, they ship fast and take care to keep me as a customer One may also buy direct from Samsung https://www.samsung.com/us/memory-storage/memory-card/ https://www.samsung.com/us/memory-storage/memory-card/
subscribed 4mo ago
I get exactly the same response from ebay when I report counterfeit/fake items. Takes much more effort to get through the reporting process too.

peter_stokes 4mo ago

title should be in euros (€550 million), so its clear the bloc responsible. and as usual, almost every one of the """criteria""" is completely arbitrary if you read the full press release: https://ec.europa.eu/commission/presscorner/detail/en/ip_26_1654 https://ec.europa.eu/commission/presscorner/detail/en/ip_26_... new tax base unlocked! woohoo

akk0 4mo ago

I could not give less of a shit about counterfeit goods, but of course for safety there understandably are rules and those rules should be enforced. In general, though, Aliexpress has a lot of goodwill with me; I buy stuff from there with some regularity and personally have seldom made a bad buy. I'm still rocking my decade old €10 polarized sunglasses, my 2018 €25 soldering iron, screwdriver and so forth.

tracker1 4mo ago

I've had a few bad experiences... massive delayed deliveries and products that are just DOA. I've stopped buying anything through them and will just pay the extra from Amazon or other domestic options.

IronWolve 4mo ago

I've known a few people that had their products copied by china and sold on amazon, ignoring patents. Same with copies of books. I've even bought a couple items just to find out they are knock offs. Its a big issue on amazon.

prirun 4mo ago

I compare online marketplaces to ISPs: we don't expect ISPs to filter the traffic going over their network to make sure it complies with all laws, because that would be impossible. Having actually run a marketplace in a previous life, it's a similar situation. How is a marketplace with millions of products supposed to vet each individual product? About the only thing a marketplace can do is provide some kind of customer feedback mechanism, make sure customers can get refunds easily and quickly, and kick off merchants and buyers that have too many complaints (though they will probably just register again under a different name).