3 ms·

Any amount of joy you lost is a fraction of joy lost from people blatantly stealing the fruits of other people's's labor. Communities do not have to be parasite

Any amount of joy you lost is a fraction of joy lost from people blatantly stealing the fruits of other people's's labor. Communities do not have to be parasites to exist. Similar amounts of joy could be created over a different interest that didn't require stealing and hurting others.

lubujackson 3mo ago
[dead]
sandcat_ 3mo ago
Hey now, that’s a bit of a harsh way to talk about record labels. Sure most of the money you pay goes to the top performers, no matter what you actually listen to, but that doesn’t make them parasites. Executives have to eat too.
- charcircuit 3mo ago
  The parasitic community I was referring to was what.cd.
b345 3mo ago
Funny because that is exactly how capitalism works.
ktallett 3mo ago
Is it stealing if when I buy digital I don't own it?
- BLKNSLVR 3mo ago
  You have stolen a temporary license!
- charcircuit 3mo ago
  You own a license when you buy it digitally. Stealing is never okay regardless of if something is technically buying or not.
  - ktallett 3mo ago
    You can't steal something unless there is ownership of it by the other person. There has to be loss for it to be stolen. Stealing isn't ok, but downloading music or movies without paying isn't stealing.
    - charcircuit 3mo ago
      >There has to be loss for it to be stolen. Counter example: Pirating a song is considered stealing as you are taking something for free without paying for it. You are using a definition that is different from the average person.
      - Telaneo 3mo ago
        Pirating songs is not stealing. It's copyright infringement. If I go to the store, pick up a carton of milk with my right hand, and magically get a second carton of milk in my left hand, then walk out the store with the carton of milk in my left hand, leaving the original carton in the store, then I have not stolen anything. If that is stealing, then I can only conclude that stealing is (a)moral, and we need a different word for what I would consider to be stealing.
        charcircuit 3mo ago
        People don't magically get a copy of an artists song on the computer. They steal it.
        Telaneo 3mo ago
        Copying is not stealing. If you're of the opinion that that's stealing, then it is my opinion that stealing is OK.
      - ktallett 3mo ago
        Piracy has been proven in court to not be stealing. I'm using the legal definition of stealing.
BLKNSLVR 3mo ago
The article touches on the topic and mentions Nine Inch Nails' and Radiohead's 'free' album releases. There's also the possibility/likelihood (I can't recall the results of the research) that increasing exposure, via piracy, is actually better for the artist long term. And then, as others have already responded, the worst offenders are, generally, the industry insiders themselves. Reports of the death of music are greatly exaggerated. Reports of the death of the music industry are widely looked forward to. I pirated plenty as a kid with no money, it was cheap and it was easy - does anyone here remember high-speed dubbing? I also recorded a _lot_ of music off the radio. On the rare occasion I bough an album I made sure it was worth being the only thing I listen to for weeks - and the only way to know that is to have prior knowledge. I buy plenty as an adult with a music budget. I believe that's how it should be.
- charcircuit 3mo ago
  >increasing exposure, via piracy, is actually better for the artist long term. If breaking someone's kneecaps extended their life by 20 years I wouldn't want someone to randomly break my kneecaps and feel good about it because they "did me a favor." >I pirated plenty as a kid with no money Neither age nor wealth exempts someone's stealing from being a crime. In fact I see it as worse crime as it sets a bad example that may be hard to change later.
  - Brackumannu 3mo ago
    [dead]
  - BLKNSLVR 3mo ago
    Fair enough, I don't think your choice of analogy is very apt , but I won't try to change your mind. I'm entirely comfortable with my choices and my effect on society in general.
  - dns_snek 3mo ago
    Breaking someone's kneecaps is unquestionably a crime, copyright infringement for private consumption is not a crime, it's a civil offense (because listening to pirated MP3s doesn't make you a danger to society) so equating the two is a fallacy. I'm sure you already knew this since these arguments have been rehashed thousands of times over the past few decades. I don't think you'd find much (if any) support on the moral angle either when it comes to people who genuinely can't afford to pay the asking price. I've never seen any authors, artists, etc. openly object to fans pirating their work in these circumstances but I've seen many of them openly encourage it. Seeing how you're equating the two, do you think they also like to have their kneecaps broken?
keiferski 3mo ago
It’s always really bizarre to me how pirates justify stealing creative works as some sort of culture. The record companies were/are awful, for sure, but the solution is to support musicians directly then, not come up with elaborate justifications for your theft. I imagine most of this is done by people with secure professions that don’t worry about getting paid for their work. When it comes to music and other art forms, the primary concern should be the creator. Not people that want to get stuff for free. And I can assure you: musicians would like to get paid for their work, and they don’t think it’s cool or fun that people just steal their stuff. The occasional super-successful artist being pro-piracy is not representative.
- b345 3mo ago
  If there was a mainstream way of supporting artists directly and having permanent ownership of music, piracy would be punching down and could possibly be a taboo practice. But as the current order stands, its punching up and fucking the suits more than artists and I really like that.
  - keiferski 3mo ago
    Bandcamp? Direct sales on their website? I can understand the piracy argument 25 years ago, when these didn't exist. But at this point, I think there are plenty of ways to directly support artists.
- matheusmoreira 3mo ago
  [dead]
Telaneo 3mo ago
Copyright infringement is not stealing.

lubujackson 3mo ago

[dead]

sandcat_ 3mo ago

Hey now, that’s a bit of a harsh way to talk about record labels. Sure most of the money you pay goes to the top performers, no matter what you actually listen to, but that doesn’t make them parasites. Executives have to eat too.

charcircuit 3mo ago
The parasitic community I was referring to was what.cd.

b345 3mo ago

Funny because that is exactly how capitalism works.

ktallett 3mo ago

Is it stealing if when I buy digital I don't own it?

BLKNSLVR 3mo ago
You have stolen a temporary license!
charcircuit 3mo ago
You own a license when you buy it digitally. Stealing is never okay regardless of if something is technically buying or not.
- ktallett 3mo ago
  You can't steal something unless there is ownership of it by the other person. There has to be loss for it to be stolen. Stealing isn't ok, but downloading music or movies without paying isn't stealing.
  - charcircuit 3mo ago
    >There has to be loss for it to be stolen. Counter example: Pirating a song is considered stealing as you are taking something for free without paying for it. You are using a definition that is different from the average person.
    - Telaneo 3mo ago
      Pirating songs is not stealing. It's copyright infringement. If I go to the store, pick up a carton of milk with my right hand, and magically get a second carton of milk in my left hand, then walk out the store with the carton of milk in my left hand, leaving the original carton in the store, then I have not stolen anything. If that is stealing, then I can only conclude that stealing is (a)moral, and we need a different word for what I would consider to be stealing.
      - charcircuit 3mo ago
        People don't magically get a copy of an artists song on the computer. They steal it.
        Telaneo 3mo ago
        Copying is not stealing. If you're of the opinion that that's stealing, then it is my opinion that stealing is OK.
    - ktallett 3mo ago
      Piracy has been proven in court to not be stealing. I'm using the legal definition of stealing.

BLKNSLVR 3mo ago

The article touches on the topic and mentions Nine Inch Nails' and Radiohead's 'free' album releases. There's also the possibility/likelihood (I can't recall the results of the research) that increasing exposure, via piracy, is actually better for the artist long term. And then, as others have already responded, the worst offenders are, generally, the industry insiders themselves. Reports of the death of music are greatly exaggerated. Reports of the death of the music industry are widely looked forward to. I pirated plenty as a kid with no money, it was cheap and it was easy - does anyone here remember high-speed dubbing? I also recorded a _lot_ of music off the radio. On the rare occasion I bough an album I made sure it was worth being the only thing I listen to for weeks - and the only way to know that is to have prior knowledge. I buy plenty as an adult with a music budget. I believe that's how it should be.

charcircuit 3mo ago
>increasing exposure, via piracy, is actually better for the artist long term. If breaking someone's kneecaps extended their life by 20 years I wouldn't want someone to randomly break my kneecaps and feel good about it because they "did me a favor." >I pirated plenty as a kid with no money Neither age nor wealth exempts someone's stealing from being a crime. In fact I see it as worse crime as it sets a bad example that may be hard to change later.
- Brackumannu 3mo ago
  [dead]
- BLKNSLVR 3mo ago
  Fair enough, I don't think your choice of analogy is very apt , but I won't try to change your mind. I'm entirely comfortable with my choices and my effect on society in general.
- dns_snek 3mo ago
  Breaking someone's kneecaps is unquestionably a crime, copyright infringement for private consumption is not a crime, it's a civil offense (because listening to pirated MP3s doesn't make you a danger to society) so equating the two is a fallacy. I'm sure you already knew this since these arguments have been rehashed thousands of times over the past few decades. I don't think you'd find much (if any) support on the moral angle either when it comes to people who genuinely can't afford to pay the asking price. I've never seen any authors, artists, etc. openly object to fans pirating their work in these circumstances but I've seen many of them openly encourage it. Seeing how you're equating the two, do you think they also like to have their kneecaps broken?

keiferski 3mo ago

It’s always really bizarre to me how pirates justify stealing creative works as some sort of culture. The record companies were/are awful, for sure, but the solution is to support musicians directly then, not come up with elaborate justifications for your theft. I imagine most of this is done by people with secure professions that don’t worry about getting paid for their work. When it comes to music and other art forms, the primary concern should be the creator. Not people that want to get stuff for free. And I can assure you: musicians would like to get paid for their work, and they don’t think it’s cool or fun that people just steal their stuff. The occasional super-successful artist being pro-piracy is not representative.

b345 3mo ago
If there was a mainstream way of supporting artists directly and having permanent ownership of music, piracy would be punching down and could possibly be a taboo practice. But as the current order stands, its punching up and fucking the suits more than artists and I really like that.
- keiferski 3mo ago
  Bandcamp? Direct sales on their website? I can understand the piracy argument 25 years ago, when these didn't exist. But at this point, I think there are plenty of ways to directly support artists.
matheusmoreira 3mo ago
[dead]

Telaneo 3mo ago