4 ms·

I'm not familiar with what you're talking about. Can you share a real world example of a case like this? You're saying a social media comment about a crime is s

by kraf 4mo ago

I'm not familiar with what you're talking about. Can you share a real world example of a case like this? You're saying a social media comment about a crime is somehow punished harshly and much harsher than the crime itself?

kolektiv 4mo ago
It's a common (and somewhat right-wing) trope, but it's not really true. Thousands of people aren't arrested for "mean comments" or similar. That isn't to say the UK has no problem with the balance of freedom of expression and regulation, but it is nothing like the impression you'd get from some sources. There are some high-profile cases which are commonly misrepresented to support these claims.
- bko 4mo ago
  > Thousands of people aren't arrested for "mean comments" or similar What are they arrested for, or are you disputing the number?
  - inigyou 4mo ago
    Lucy Connolly was arrested for threatening to kill a thousand people, for example.
    - recursive-call 4mo ago
      I think generally the argument is that these usually aren’t credible threats, they’re hyperbole, and the police are overstepping by arresting people for saying they’ll do something when they have no evidence that that person would actually do that. A free society doesn’t arrest someone for saying “I’m going to burn down so-and-so’s house.” It waits until you actually go to so-and-so’s house with a can of petrol, and then arrests you.
      - XorNot 4mo ago
        Sending death threats has never been legal. The statical lie with the UK numbers is the vast majority of cases are about the use of messaging services in domestic violence cases.
        deleted 4mo ago
        [deleted]
        bombcar 4mo ago
        It’s the same problem as amber alerts - the stories you here about are the dramatic stranger danger ones, but the vast majority of the statistics are “boring” custody disputes.
      - ceejayoz 4mo ago
        > A free society doesn’t arrest someone for saying “I’m going to burn down so-and-so’s house.” I feel like it's a significantly freer society when others can't threaten to murder me without consequences.
        marysol5 4mo ago
        It's always weird that these "freeze peach absolutism" never seem to notice that death, is the ultimate censorship
      - buttercraft 4mo ago
        The poster up thread said people were being arrested for "mean tweets" and now you've moved it to "but those death threats weren't serious!" No, the original claim was dishonest bullshit.
      - marysol5 4mo ago
        They were credible threats though, as the people were doing EXACTLY what she called for
- philipallstar 4mo ago
  It is definitely true. It's "right wing" because the soft power is with the left (or was until maybe very recently) and so only principled people of the left (e.g. Bill Maher) and all the people of the right (either principled on speech or saying things that are more likely to be censored) are going to be talking about it.
  - marysol5 4mo ago
    What on earth are you on about, we've had 20+ years of right-wing governments. >and all the people of the right Tell that to the Tory MP who had me arrested for upsetting them, or the UKIP goon's forcibly removed me from their "Free Speech Conference"
    - philipallstar 4mo ago
      > What on earth are you on about, we've had 20+ years of right-wing governments. The Tories were barely right-wing, and they were in power for 14 years, not 20+, and for the first 4 they were in a coalition with the lib dems. Look at the immigration numbers in the UK to see how not right-wing they were. Insane to think that's actually right wing. > or the UKIP goon's forcibly removed me from their "Free Speech Conference" The UKIP conference removing you is not evidence of general soft power in the UK.
bko 4mo ago
Here's an example of Westmidlands police bragging about arresting a 12 year old for racist posts. There are 30 arrests a day for offensive online messages. It's not heavily reported for some reason but it's very real. https://www.thetimes.com/uk/crime/article/police-make-30-arrests-a-day-for-offensive-online-messages-zbv886tqf https://www.thetimes.com/uk/crime/article/police-make-30-arr... https://x.com/WMPolice/status/1282627004018364416 https://x.com/WMPolice/status/1282627004018364416
- rwmj 4mo ago
  If you walk through a town shouting racist stuff you'll get arrested too, and rightly so.
  - bigstrat2003 4mo ago
    The kid is 12 years old. If he ran around shouting racist stuff in town, that should be addressed by his parents, not by an arrest.
  - asdiovjdfi 4mo ago
    In my Northern European small city, just yesterday, there was some non-native shouting "WHITE NIGGA" at children in the city center. Nothing happend to him.
philipallstar 4mo ago
Here's an overview of the situation: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c62ln7mzd5ro https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c62ln7mzd5ro
- inigyou 4mo ago
  So people are getting arrested for tweeting they want to set fire to a hotel full of people? Seems good to me
- ceejayoz 4mo ago
  Are you sure that link's the one you meant to share? > The former childminder from Northampton, who is married to a Conservative councillor, had posted an abhorrent message on X, calling for people to "set fire" to hotels housing asylum seekers following the murder of three young girls at a dance class in Southport in July 2024. > Yet the fact both men were able to address a huge crowd in London is perhaps evidence that there is rather more leeway for free speech in this country than those likening the UK to a "tin pot dictatorship" suggest. Seems fine?
  - philipallstar 4mo ago
    > Are you sure that link's the one you meant to share? Sorry, I'm confused by the question.
    - ceejayoz 4mo ago
      The link seems to make the opposite point you intended. Criminal threats with appropriate punishment, and regular old hateful speech is ongoing.
      - philipallstar 4mo ago
        The link is far broader than that, but even in this case: there was no threat. No more than a university lecturer tweeting that he wanted a white genocide.

by kraf 4mo ago

kolektiv 4mo ago

It's a common (and somewhat right-wing) trope, but it's not really true. Thousands of people aren't arrested for "mean comments" or similar. That isn't to say the UK has no problem with the balance of freedom of expression and regulation, but it is nothing like the impression you'd get from some sources. There are some high-profile cases which are commonly misrepresented to support these claims.

bko 4mo ago
> Thousands of people aren't arrested for "mean comments" or similar What are they arrested for, or are you disputing the number?
- inigyou 4mo ago
  Lucy Connolly was arrested for threatening to kill a thousand people, for example.
  - recursive-call 4mo ago
    I think generally the argument is that these usually aren’t credible threats, they’re hyperbole, and the police are overstepping by arresting people for saying they’ll do something when they have no evidence that that person would actually do that. A free society doesn’t arrest someone for saying “I’m going to burn down so-and-so’s house.” It waits until you actually go to so-and-so’s house with a can of petrol, and then arrests you.
    - XorNot 4mo ago
      Sending death threats has never been legal. The statical lie with the UK numbers is the vast majority of cases are about the use of messaging services in domestic violence cases.
      - deleted 4mo ago
        [deleted]
      - bombcar 4mo ago
        It’s the same problem as amber alerts - the stories you here about are the dramatic stranger danger ones, but the vast majority of the statistics are “boring” custody disputes.
    - ceejayoz 4mo ago
      > A free society doesn’t arrest someone for saying “I’m going to burn down so-and-so’s house.” I feel like it's a significantly freer society when others can't threaten to murder me without consequences.
      - marysol5 4mo ago
        It's always weird that these "freeze peach absolutism" never seem to notice that death, is the ultimate censorship
    - buttercraft 4mo ago
      The poster up thread said people were being arrested for "mean tweets" and now you've moved it to "but those death threats weren't serious!" No, the original claim was dishonest bullshit.
    - marysol5 4mo ago
      They were credible threats though, as the people were doing EXACTLY what she called for
philipallstar 4mo ago
It is definitely true. It's "right wing" because the soft power is with the left (or was until maybe very recently) and so only principled people of the left (e.g. Bill Maher) and all the people of the right (either principled on speech or saying things that are more likely to be censored) are going to be talking about it.
- marysol5 4mo ago
  What on earth are you on about, we've had 20+ years of right-wing governments. >and all the people of the right Tell that to the Tory MP who had me arrested for upsetting them, or the UKIP goon's forcibly removed me from their "Free Speech Conference"
  - philipallstar 4mo ago
    > What on earth are you on about, we've had 20+ years of right-wing governments. The Tories were barely right-wing, and they were in power for 14 years, not 20+, and for the first 4 they were in a coalition with the lib dems. Look at the immigration numbers in the UK to see how not right-wing they were. Insane to think that's actually right wing. > or the UKIP goon's forcibly removed me from their "Free Speech Conference" The UKIP conference removing you is not evidence of general soft power in the UK.

bko 4mo ago

Here's an example of Westmidlands police bragging about arresting a 12 year old for racist posts. There are 30 arrests a day for offensive online messages. It's not heavily reported for some reason but it's very real. https://www.thetimes.com/uk/crime/article/police-make-30-arrests-a-day-for-offensive-online-messages-zbv886tqf https://www.thetimes.com/uk/crime/article/police-make-30-arr... https://x.com/WMPolice/status/1282627004018364416 https://x.com/WMPolice/status/1282627004018364416

rwmj 4mo ago
If you walk through a town shouting racist stuff you'll get arrested too, and rightly so.
- bigstrat2003 4mo ago
  The kid is 12 years old. If he ran around shouting racist stuff in town, that should be addressed by his parents, not by an arrest.
- asdiovjdfi 4mo ago
  In my Northern European small city, just yesterday, there was some non-native shouting "WHITE NIGGA" at children in the city center. Nothing happend to him.

philipallstar 4mo ago

Here's an overview of the situation: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c62ln7mzd5ro https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c62ln7mzd5ro

inigyou 4mo ago
So people are getting arrested for tweeting they want to set fire to a hotel full of people? Seems good to me
ceejayoz 4mo ago
Are you sure that link's the one you meant to share? > The former childminder from Northampton, who is married to a Conservative councillor, had posted an abhorrent message on X, calling for people to "set fire" to hotels housing asylum seekers following the murder of three young girls at a dance class in Southport in July 2024. > Yet the fact both men were able to address a huge crowd in London is perhaps evidence that there is rather more leeway for free speech in this country than those likening the UK to a "tin pot dictatorship" suggest. Seems fine?
- philipallstar 4mo ago
  > Are you sure that link's the one you meant to share? Sorry, I'm confused by the question.
  - ceejayoz 4mo ago
    The link seems to make the opposite point you intended. Criminal threats with appropriate punishment, and regular old hateful speech is ongoing.
    - philipallstar 4mo ago
      The link is far broader than that, but even in this case: there was no threat. No more than a university lecturer tweeting that he wanted a white genocide.