4 ms·

> So if things continue as they are today, I think in the near future, being a software developer is going to be more analogous to the medical field, where in t

by p-e-w 3mo ago

> So if things continue as they are today, I think in the near future, being a software developer is going to be more analogous to the medical field, where in the medical field you have different levels of professional expertise. The medical field is also going to change though. Massively. Because people are going to realize you don’t need to pay someone $400k per year to hand out advice about moderate exercise and which antibiotic is appropriate for a sneeze-cough with yellow mucus. Regulation isn’t going to prevent this. AI is already way too easily accessible to ever rein it in again. Not to mention that the US now has serious competition from a hostile country, so they can regulate their own AIs all they want without it making a difference in practice.

oenton 3mo ago
[dead]
zerobees 3mo ago
> Because people are going to realize you don’t need to pay someone $400k per year to hand out advice about moderate exercise and which antibiotic is appropriate for a sneeze-cough with yellow mucus. Who is going to realize that? The same forces that prevent you from walking into a pharmacy and asking for antibiotics based on what you found on WebMD will prevent you from doing it with a ChatGPT printout in hand. Lawyers and doctors are the best-known examples of industries that are in control of who gets admitted to practice the profession.
- hattmall 3mo ago
  It's basically a formality now to get a prescription for what you read on WebMD. Every Insurance has telemedicine, you just call, read the symptom list and get the prescription. Some even let you just email. There's a doctor or at least person with subscribing ability in the loop, but they are barely doing more than rubber stamping hundreds of requests per day.
  - sarchertech 3mo ago
    Only for less regulated drugs and for drugs with minimal side effects, or drugs that are relatively cheap. Mostly for drugs that should probably be OTC anyway. Try doing that for a narcotic, or for an expensive biologic. You could always lie to a doctor about your symptoms.
    - Forgeties79 3mo ago
      Idk man I was in the EU recently as a US citizen. One 15min call about my sore throat and dude gave me not just Tylenol and antibiotics (not too wild) but also oral steroids which was beyond overkill for what I had - very rare moment where I didn’t do what the doctor ordered. I was very surprised to see that prescribed. They didn’t even recommend nexium or anything to protect my stomach.
      - sarchertech 3mo ago
        If you’re youngish and healthy a short course of an oral steroid is very low risk and doesn’t require a PPI. And it’s indicated for severe throat pain. There’s nothing wild about that prescription.
        Forgeties79 3mo ago
        1) not that young and 2) definitely not “severe throat pain.” Drip + mild sore throat that went a few too many days with discolored phlegm. Clearly bacterial infection, clearly needed antibiotics, but definitely not severe
        sarchertech 3mo ago
        Discolored phlegm doesn’t mean bacterial infection. Viral infections, and allergic sinusitis can cause it too. Bacterial sinus infections are absurdly over treated [1]. It can take weeks to recover from a viral infection. Not saying that you are a wuss, but my guess is, the doctor probably over-indexed on the throat pain, assumed you were a bit of wuss for calling the doctor for a sore throat, and decided to give you something to make you feel better quickly. Either way unless you were 65+ a short course of oral steroids is very safe (and even then it’s only very mildly dangerous). 1.https://www.aafp.org/afp/2020/0615/p758 https://www.aafp.org/afp/2020/0615/p758 “Without antibiotics, rhinosinusitis resolved in 46% of patients after one week and in 64% of patients after 14 days. Antibiotics can shorten time to resolution but in only five to 11 more people per 100 compared with placebo or no treatment. Despite this, approximately 86% of U.S. ambulatory visits for acute rhinosinusitis result in oral antibiotic prescriptions.1 In Europe, antibiotic prescription rates for acute rhinosinusitis in primary care range from 72% to 92%”
mminer237 3mo ago
You've been able to Google your symptoms and get a maybe answer for twenty years. I don't see how AI replaces doctors any more than WebMD did.
- red75prime 3mo ago
  By achieving the same or a higher level of effectiveness than doctors, obviously.
  - alternatex 3mo ago
    Nothing effective about self-diagnosis. Quick and easy yes, but not effective. Most things that are worth diagnosing require a visit to a clinic. No doctor is going to lose a job because people are self-diagnosing using the internet.
    - watwut 3mo ago
      They gonna get more work due to results of self diagnosis from the internet.
    - red75prime 3mo ago
      It wouldn't be "Ah! It's lupus." It would be "I need the results of such-and-such tests to make a differential diagnosis."
  - freedomben 3mo ago
    As long as doctors continue to hoard the sole ability to grant access to medications (currently a legal monopoly), they are safe from AI. Expect that to be a very, very long process. They'll continue to be the gatekeepers as long as they have the power, and they are still quite powerful.
  - sarchertech 3mo ago
    My wife is a pediatric ER doctor. She’s board certified in pediatrics and pediatric emergency medicine. Here’s a scenario that regularly plays out. Someone she’s knows calls her up late and says their child has a minor fever, upset stomach or some other mild symptom. They ask “should I go to the ER or can I just wait till tomorrow to go to the pediatrician?” My wife says it’s totally fine to wait until tomorrow. That is not an emergency. And frequently she’ll tell them they don’t even need to go to their pediatrician unless it gets worse or continues for several days. 9/10 what happens is that the person goes to the ER or their pediatrician first thing in the morning and calls my wife to tell her “you were right, it wasn’t an emergency”. Despite that my wife is more highly trained than either their pediatrician or a non-pediatric ER doctor, and they know and trust her, they still wanted to see someone in person. It doesn’t matter how accurate AI diagnosis gets, that’s not going to change anytime soon.

by p-e-w 3mo ago

oenton 3mo ago

[dead]

zerobees 3mo ago

> Because people are going to realize you don’t need to pay someone $400k per year to hand out advice about moderate exercise and which antibiotic is appropriate for a sneeze-cough with yellow mucus. Who is going to realize that? The same forces that prevent you from walking into a pharmacy and asking for antibiotics based on what you found on WebMD will prevent you from doing it with a ChatGPT printout in hand. Lawyers and doctors are the best-known examples of industries that are in control of who gets admitted to practice the profession.

hattmall 3mo ago
It's basically a formality now to get a prescription for what you read on WebMD. Every Insurance has telemedicine, you just call, read the symptom list and get the prescription. Some even let you just email. There's a doctor or at least person with subscribing ability in the loop, but they are barely doing more than rubber stamping hundreds of requests per day.
- sarchertech 3mo ago
  Only for less regulated drugs and for drugs with minimal side effects, or drugs that are relatively cheap. Mostly for drugs that should probably be OTC anyway. Try doing that for a narcotic, or for an expensive biologic. You could always lie to a doctor about your symptoms.
  - Forgeties79 3mo ago
    Idk man I was in the EU recently as a US citizen. One 15min call about my sore throat and dude gave me not just Tylenol and antibiotics (not too wild) but also oral steroids which was beyond overkill for what I had - very rare moment where I didn’t do what the doctor ordered. I was very surprised to see that prescribed. They didn’t even recommend nexium or anything to protect my stomach.
    - sarchertech 3mo ago
      If you’re youngish and healthy a short course of an oral steroid is very low risk and doesn’t require a PPI. And it’s indicated for severe throat pain. There’s nothing wild about that prescription.
      - Forgeties79 3mo ago
        1) not that young and 2) definitely not “severe throat pain.” Drip + mild sore throat that went a few too many days with discolored phlegm. Clearly bacterial infection, clearly needed antibiotics, but definitely not severe
        sarchertech 3mo ago
        Discolored phlegm doesn’t mean bacterial infection. Viral infections, and allergic sinusitis can cause it too. Bacterial sinus infections are absurdly over treated [1]. It can take weeks to recover from a viral infection. Not saying that you are a wuss, but my guess is, the doctor probably over-indexed on the throat pain, assumed you were a bit of wuss for calling the doctor for a sore throat, and decided to give you something to make you feel better quickly. Either way unless you were 65+ a short course of oral steroids is very safe (and even then it’s only very mildly dangerous). 1.https://www.aafp.org/afp/2020/0615/p758 https://www.aafp.org/afp/2020/0615/p758 “Without antibiotics, rhinosinusitis resolved in 46% of patients after one week and in 64% of patients after 14 days. Antibiotics can shorten time to resolution but in only five to 11 more people per 100 compared with placebo or no treatment. Despite this, approximately 86% of U.S. ambulatory visits for acute rhinosinusitis result in oral antibiotic prescriptions.1 In Europe, antibiotic prescription rates for acute rhinosinusitis in primary care range from 72% to 92%”

mminer237 3mo ago

You've been able to Google your symptoms and get a maybe answer for twenty years. I don't see how AI replaces doctors any more than WebMD did.

red75prime 3mo ago
By achieving the same or a higher level of effectiveness than doctors, obviously.
- alternatex 3mo ago
  Nothing effective about self-diagnosis. Quick and easy yes, but not effective. Most things that are worth diagnosing require a visit to a clinic. No doctor is going to lose a job because people are self-diagnosing using the internet.
  - watwut 3mo ago
    They gonna get more work due to results of self diagnosis from the internet.
  - red75prime 3mo ago
    It wouldn't be "Ah! It's lupus." It would be "I need the results of such-and-such tests to make a differential diagnosis."
- freedomben 3mo ago
  As long as doctors continue to hoard the sole ability to grant access to medications (currently a legal monopoly), they are safe from AI. Expect that to be a very, very long process. They'll continue to be the gatekeepers as long as they have the power, and they are still quite powerful.
- sarchertech 3mo ago
  My wife is a pediatric ER doctor. She’s board certified in pediatrics and pediatric emergency medicine. Here’s a scenario that regularly plays out. Someone she’s knows calls her up late and says their child has a minor fever, upset stomach or some other mild symptom. They ask “should I go to the ER or can I just wait till tomorrow to go to the pediatrician?” My wife says it’s totally fine to wait until tomorrow. That is not an emergency. And frequently she’ll tell them they don’t even need to go to their pediatrician unless it gets worse or continues for several days. 9/10 what happens is that the person goes to the ER or their pediatrician first thing in the morning and calls my wife to tell her “you were right, it wasn’t an emergency”. Despite that my wife is more highly trained than either their pediatrician or a non-pediatric ER doctor, and they know and trust her, they still wanted to see someone in person. It doesn’t matter how accurate AI diagnosis gets, that’s not going to change anytime soon.