3 ms·

There hasn't been a clear goal for an American war since the first Gulf War.

by forshaper 3mo ago

AlexCoventry 3mo ago
The goals for intervention in the Serbia/Bosnia conflict were clear and noble, IMO.
- forshaper 3mo ago
  I considered that closer to truly multi-national, but we might as well take the win.
- Cthulhu_ 3mo ago
  That wasn't an American operation though, that was a NATO and UN operation involving American, British, French and Dutch forces.
kingleopold 3mo ago
clear goal is making trillions to war profiteer friends, is this too hard to see for the public?
- Fizz43 3mo ago
  The public loves that narrative but it collapses under scrutiny.
  - streetfighter64 3mo ago
    The military industrial complex is a "narrative"? If anything the public does not understand it enough. But please, do scrutinize it. What is the goal of all of the USAs wars in the middle east, if not to funnel taxpayer money into the pockets of shareholders of weapons companies? The latest one for example, in Iran, is clearly just because Trump can profit off of it, and because Israel wants to destroy all of their enemies in the region. And of course, Israel is a great consumer of USAs military technology (which they buy with "aid" i.e. taxpayer money from USA itself).
    - Fizz43 3mo ago
      Just to be clear what your position is. You believe that US is getting involved in wars particularly the middle east because US government wants to give money directly to military contractors or it wants to boost the value of these weapons companies to benefit the people who invested.
      - streetfighter64 3mo ago
        If they just wrote the owners of the weapons companies a check directly, the public wouldn't like that as much as the "patriotic" "war on terror". But of course there's also other reasons such as religious fundamentalism (christian zionism) that influence it.
        Fizz43 3mo ago
        They do write weapons companies direct checks through research and procurement contracts. No one cares because the amount is tiny. Its not this huge market being pumped like slopulists pretend it is. Politicians dont need to invest in defense companies to get rich they can invest in anything with their insider knowledge. Defense companies dont need a war to get government money.
        streetfighter64 3mo ago
        > research and procurement contracts. No one cares because the amount is tiny. > In Fiscal Year (FY) 2024, DOD obligated more money on defense contracts ($445 billion) than all other government agencies combined ($310 billion). https://www.gao.gov/blog/snapshot-government-wide-contracting-fy-2024-interactive-dashboard https://www.gao.gov/blog/snapshot-government-wide-contractin... > Defense companies dont need a war to get government money. > military operations in support of the Global War on Terrorism (GWOT). DOD's reported annual obligations for GWOT have shown a steady increase from about $0.2 billion in fiscal year 2001 to about $162.4 billion in fiscal year 2008 https://www.gao.gov/products/gao-09-233r https://www.gao.gov/products/gao-09-233r
sillyfluke 3mo ago
I'm not sure its accurate to imply that being completely delusional means you have no goal. Gulf War part II had a goal regardless of the deceit involved. The Afghanistan war though I thought took the cake for the sheer delusional premise. To tie it to the sibling comment about Bosnia, Paddy Ashdown who was the High Representative for Bosina & Herzegovina was also one of the lone voices warning about the Afghanistan war in the beginning. I wasn't able to find the article containing the original warnings, but here is one article from the early days[0]. [0] https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2001/oct/11/britainand911.afghanistan https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2001/oct/11/britainand9...

There hasn't been a clear goal for an American war since the first Gulf War.

AlexCoventry 3mo ago

The goals for intervention in the Serbia/Bosnia conflict were clear and noble, IMO.

forshaper 3mo ago
I considered that closer to truly multi-national, but we might as well take the win.
Cthulhu_ 3mo ago
That wasn't an American operation though, that was a NATO and UN operation involving American, British, French and Dutch forces.

kingleopold 3mo ago

clear goal is making trillions to war profiteer friends, is this too hard to see for the public?

Fizz43 3mo ago
The public loves that narrative but it collapses under scrutiny.
- streetfighter64 3mo ago
  The military industrial complex is a "narrative"? If anything the public does not understand it enough. But please, do scrutinize it. What is the goal of all of the USAs wars in the middle east, if not to funnel taxpayer money into the pockets of shareholders of weapons companies? The latest one for example, in Iran, is clearly just because Trump can profit off of it, and because Israel wants to destroy all of their enemies in the region. And of course, Israel is a great consumer of USAs military technology (which they buy with "aid" i.e. taxpayer money from USA itself).
  - Fizz43 3mo ago
    Just to be clear what your position is. You believe that US is getting involved in wars particularly the middle east because US government wants to give money directly to military contractors or it wants to boost the value of these weapons companies to benefit the people who invested.
    - streetfighter64 3mo ago
      If they just wrote the owners of the weapons companies a check directly, the public wouldn't like that as much as the "patriotic" "war on terror". But of course there's also other reasons such as religious fundamentalism (christian zionism) that influence it.
      - Fizz43 3mo ago
        They do write weapons companies direct checks through research and procurement contracts. No one cares because the amount is tiny. Its not this huge market being pumped like slopulists pretend it is. Politicians dont need to invest in defense companies to get rich they can invest in anything with their insider knowledge. Defense companies dont need a war to get government money.
        streetfighter64 3mo ago
        > research and procurement contracts. No one cares because the amount is tiny. > In Fiscal Year (FY) 2024, DOD obligated more money on defense contracts ($445 billion) than all other government agencies combined ($310 billion). https://www.gao.gov/blog/snapshot-government-wide-contracting-fy-2024-interactive-dashboard https://www.gao.gov/blog/snapshot-government-wide-contractin... > Defense companies dont need a war to get government money. > military operations in support of the Global War on Terrorism (GWOT). DOD's reported annual obligations for GWOT have shown a steady increase from about $0.2 billion in fiscal year 2001 to about $162.4 billion in fiscal year 2008 https://www.gao.gov/products/gao-09-233r https://www.gao.gov/products/gao-09-233r

sillyfluke 3mo ago

I'm not sure its accurate to imply that being completely delusional means you have no goal. Gulf War part II had a goal regardless of the deceit involved. The Afghanistan war though I thought took the cake for the sheer delusional premise. To tie it to the sibling comment about Bosnia, Paddy Ashdown who was the High Representative for Bosina & Herzegovina was also one of the lone voices warning about the Afghanistan war in the beginning. I wasn't able to find the article containing the original warnings, but here is one article from the early days[0]. [0] https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2001/oct/11/britainand911.afghanistan https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2001/oct/11/britainand9...