4 ms·

"low morality" and "care" are keywords that you are trying to manipulate the reader to the [right] side of some cause. I don't feel at all bad seeing a Tesla,

by mlrtime 3mo ago

"low morality" and "care" are keywords that you are trying to manipulate the reader to the [right] side of some cause. I don't feel at all bad seeing a Tesla, does that make me "low morality"?

Lomlioto 3mo ago
It might make you less moral. Elon Musk is not someone. He is the CEO of Tesla and owning Tesla made it possible for him to buy Twitter. He is literaly the richest person on the planet and changes opinions by controlling Twitter as a platform (1984 anyone?) He has more reach and more money than anyone else. His character clearly shows that you can't trust him. It doesn't even matter if he sometimes does something good, he doesn't care. Being responsible for cutting USAID without any plan? This killed real humans and kids. The richest person on the planet is responsible for this. This becomes a real issue for everything dangerous he does because he just pushes stuff, doesn't matter if it has long term consequences. Polluting our atmosphere with Starlink satelites? Who cares eh? He doesn't. Instead him thinking about making our planet better, he thinks its fundamental that we become a multi-planet species. We are in 2026 not in 2100. We haven't even solved basic income, food stability etc. Tesla is not a random company.
- deleted 3mo ago
  [deleted]
- urbsgpw 3mo ago
  I mean ok, starlink could be an issue. But the USAID defunding is an ideological stance with which you can, based on your own stance, agree or disagree. You could also argue that without USAID in the first place, there wouldn't be incentives for overpopulation? My point being, it seems incredibly simplistic to just assume that aid is good and no aid is bad. This is just first order effects that you're looking at. Also, if you want to look at how real world systems operate (u like USAID, for example, but NATO, a western imperialist project, operates much the same), institutions rarely respond to slow change (i.e. evolution). That's the surest route to keep the status quo (once a government agency has been set up, it will rarely be wound down). Now maybe the status quo is preferable! But maybe it isn't. And maybe - most likely - it depends on subjective preferences and your Weltanschauung. And I would argue that for all his marketing and missing deadlines, the man has changed the world for the better (my view). And I would also argue if he were a Biden and Harris supporter, this comment section would look completely different. And that tells us just as much about the HN crowd as it does about Elon. Now I won't go into his political views, but he obviously isn't alone with those views (for which I think HN believes are influenced by Elon, which is incredibly patronizing) and maybe, just maybe, there are valid reasons for those views. As for the model itself - seems like a similar set of metrics we always get with SOTA and near SOTA models, they compare themselves to anthropic and they are usually way cheaper. But the combination of the harness (claude code) and the models makes their end product noticeably better than the competition (admittedly haven't tried codex). I'll definitely give it a try with pi if its on openrouter (currently using GLM 5.2 there mainly).
  - Jtarii 3mo ago
    So your stance is withdrawing aid and directly causing the deaths of millions is morally ambiguous/neutral because the aid contributed to the larger population in the first place? This just seems like such a comically evil position to hold I don't know if I am understanding you correctly.
    - urbsgpw 3mo ago
      Directly? I would love to see that study. I'm saying a lot of the populace is against foreign aid. And that populace has the right to shut it off. And we live in nation states - the state giving the aid can always shut it off (for whatever reason). Granted, I see no reason to do it SO abruptly (and I agree that was an infantile show), but I am not convinced aid as such is a net benefit for humanity. At the very least this is something you can do an econometric analysis and discuss different policy choices. Now, that being said, I do agree it would have probably made more sense, from an austerity point of view, to cut the military aid to Israel.
      - estearum 3mo ago
        > Directly? I would love to see that study. Lol, no you wouldn't. If you would, this would not be news to you. "We have a right to do it" is not a response to the allegation of being immoral. There are plenty of immoral things someone is well within their rights to do.
      - Jtarii 3mo ago
        Holy shit, infinite ethical murder exploit 1. Give aid 2. Population goes up 3. Revoke aid 4. Everyone dies 5. Go to 1 Great moral system you have there.
  - Lomlioto 3mo ago
    We can discuss if the richest country in the world, polluting the planet the most, should invest a little bit of money into global aid. But discontinuing something like this without a ramp-down phase is just sick. I also don't get your rant about Biden/Harris etc. i talke about what Elon Musk does and did. Btw. He did 2 nazi salutes, nazis put humans into chambers and killed them on mass.

by mlrtime 3mo ago

"low morality" and "care" are keywords that you are trying to manipulate the reader to the [right] side of some cause. I don't feel at all bad seeing a Tesla, does that make me "low morality"?

Lomlioto 3mo ago

It might make you less moral. Elon Musk is not someone. He is the CEO of Tesla and owning Tesla made it possible for him to buy Twitter. He is literaly the richest person on the planet and changes opinions by controlling Twitter as a platform (1984 anyone?) He has more reach and more money than anyone else. His character clearly shows that you can't trust him. It doesn't even matter if he sometimes does something good, he doesn't care. Being responsible for cutting USAID without any plan? This killed real humans and kids. The richest person on the planet is responsible for this. This becomes a real issue for everything dangerous he does because he just pushes stuff, doesn't matter if it has long term consequences. Polluting our atmosphere with Starlink satelites? Who cares eh? He doesn't. Instead him thinking about making our planet better, he thinks its fundamental that we become a multi-planet species. We are in 2026 not in 2100. We haven't even solved basic income, food stability etc. Tesla is not a random company.

deleted 3mo ago
[deleted]
urbsgpw 3mo ago
I mean ok, starlink could be an issue. But the USAID defunding is an ideological stance with which you can, based on your own stance, agree or disagree. You could also argue that without USAID in the first place, there wouldn't be incentives for overpopulation? My point being, it seems incredibly simplistic to just assume that aid is good and no aid is bad. This is just first order effects that you're looking at. Also, if you want to look at how real world systems operate (u like USAID, for example, but NATO, a western imperialist project, operates much the same), institutions rarely respond to slow change (i.e. evolution). That's the surest route to keep the status quo (once a government agency has been set up, it will rarely be wound down). Now maybe the status quo is preferable! But maybe it isn't. And maybe - most likely - it depends on subjective preferences and your Weltanschauung. And I would argue that for all his marketing and missing deadlines, the man has changed the world for the better (my view). And I would also argue if he were a Biden and Harris supporter, this comment section would look completely different. And that tells us just as much about the HN crowd as it does about Elon. Now I won't go into his political views, but he obviously isn't alone with those views (for which I think HN believes are influenced by Elon, which is incredibly patronizing) and maybe, just maybe, there are valid reasons for those views. As for the model itself - seems like a similar set of metrics we always get with SOTA and near SOTA models, they compare themselves to anthropic and they are usually way cheaper. But the combination of the harness (claude code) and the models makes their end product noticeably better than the competition (admittedly haven't tried codex). I'll definitely give it a try with pi if its on openrouter (currently using GLM 5.2 there mainly).
- Jtarii 3mo ago
  So your stance is withdrawing aid and directly causing the deaths of millions is morally ambiguous/neutral because the aid contributed to the larger population in the first place? This just seems like such a comically evil position to hold I don't know if I am understanding you correctly.
  - urbsgpw 3mo ago
    Directly? I would love to see that study. I'm saying a lot of the populace is against foreign aid. And that populace has the right to shut it off. And we live in nation states - the state giving the aid can always shut it off (for whatever reason). Granted, I see no reason to do it SO abruptly (and I agree that was an infantile show), but I am not convinced aid as such is a net benefit for humanity. At the very least this is something you can do an econometric analysis and discuss different policy choices. Now, that being said, I do agree it would have probably made more sense, from an austerity point of view, to cut the military aid to Israel.
    - estearum 3mo ago
      > Directly? I would love to see that study. Lol, no you wouldn't. If you would, this would not be news to you. "We have a right to do it" is not a response to the allegation of being immoral. There are plenty of immoral things someone is well within their rights to do.
    - Jtarii 3mo ago
      Holy shit, infinite ethical murder exploit 1. Give aid 2. Population goes up 3. Revoke aid 4. Everyone dies 5. Go to 1 Great moral system you have there.
- Lomlioto 3mo ago
  We can discuss if the richest country in the world, polluting the planet the most, should invest a little bit of money into global aid. But discontinuing something like this without a ramp-down phase is just sick. I also don't get your rant about Biden/Harris etc. i talke about what Elon Musk does and did. Btw. He did 2 nazi salutes, nazis put humans into chambers and killed them on mass.