6 ms·

I agree completely that happiness comes from within. And yet there is a duality that has always struck me as important, though hard to explain: it's easiest to

by ef4 14y ago

I agree completely that happiness comes from within. And yet there is a duality that has always struck me as important, though hard to explain: it's easiest to be happy when you're striving toward a goal you believe in. But you need to keep your sense of self, your ego, non-attached to the outcome of the striving. That is, you need to invest yourself 100% into doing things that are important to you, but remain detached from whether you ultimately achieve what you wanted to achieve. I think Buddhists call this "skillful attachment".

hmbg 14y ago
"Skillful attachment", what a wonderful expression! Doesn't seem that widespread, google-wise, but it definitely goes in my decidedly not very Buddhistic list of rules to live by.
theorique 14y ago
Agreed. The idea is to act as if the outcome of what you were working on was the most important thing in the world to you, but to place no value on the actual outcome itself.
- thibauts 14y ago
  I think this can be put as "enjoy the process".
- jes 14y ago
  So, I should work to be a great spouse (say), but not care whether I actually achieve that outcome? Why not work to achieve things of value precisely because they are of value to you?
  - zaptheimpaler 14y ago
    Because you won't always achieve them. If you value the end result, it will be all the more disappointing if you fail to achieve it.
  - theorique 14y ago
    Well, it's a paradox. If you are fixated on the goal, rather than being present performing the actions that will get you to the goal, you are actually less likely to reach the goal successfully. Thinking about the goal obsessively is counterproductive. Maybe "detach from the outcome" is a better word. Anchor your happiness and well-being on performing the actions within your control that you believe will take you to that outcome, and do not make that happiness and well-being conditional on reaching that outcome.
- datashaman 14y ago
  A similar principle in poker (which has many lessons for life in general) is that as long as you keep making the correct decisions, in the long run you will win. If you invest emotionally in the prize you will likely make the wrong decision.
  - theorique 14y ago
    > A similar principle in poker (which has many lessons for life in general) is that as long as you keep making the correct decisions, in the long run you will win. If you invest emotionally in the prize you will likely make the wrong decision. Excellent point. A bad outcome realized through a correct decision making process is painful, but is still a "better" result than a good outcome realized through a flawed decision making process. When poker players go "on tilt" they start breaking their process and it shows in their long run results. There are few places where this is more on display than in high stakes poker tournaments.
thewarrior 14y ago
This is the main philosophy of the Hindu scripture the Bhagavad Gita which says : "Your right is only to work, and never to its fruits. Don't be motivated by the fruits of work. Nor should you be attached to inaction."
neumann_alfred 14y ago
Marc Aurel: If something in the exterior world makes you discontent, then it is not that object which troubles you, but rather your judgement of it; yet to blot out this judgement instantly is within your power. And if your dissatisfaction is based on the condition of your soul, who can prohibit you from correcting your views? Likewise, if you are discontent because you are not doing what seems reasonable to you, why not be active rather than discontent? "But something stronger than me is obstructing me." Still, do not be discontent; for the cause for your inaction is not within you. "But life has no meaning for me if this is not done." Well then, end your life, as calm as if you had succeeded; but don't forget to forgive your adversaries. Words that strike me in their simplicity and depth every time I read them, but that's Marc Aurel for ya :)
- dfc 14y ago
  Who is Marc Aurel? I found one link making it seem that "Marc Aurel" was actually "Marcus Aurelius" and had a citation referencing Meditations. But google could not find that quote in any translation for Meditations. The "that's Marc Aurel for ya" makes it seem that he is a well known writer/thinker so maybe I am way off base thinking its Marcus Aurelius.
  - adamdavis 14y ago
    > The "that's Marc Aurel for ya" makes it seem that he is a well known writer/thinker so maybe I am way off base thinking its Marcus Aurelius. Why would you think that you're off base? From what I gather Marcus Aurelius is a well known* thinker/writer - just ordered a copy of Mediations for myself after reading this post and comments. * edit
    - dfc 14y ago
      Because I never heard anyone refer to him as Marc Aurel in any of my philosophy classes and could not find any references to "marc aurel" on the internet. The familiarity of the statement made it seem like "marc aurel" was a household name. I also could not find the sentence in any copy of Meditations I found on the internet. Fyi: you can grab a copy of Meditations from a number of classics sites on the internet: http://classics.mit.edu/Antoninus/meditations.html http://classics.mit.edu/Antoninus/meditations.html

by ef4 14y ago

hmbg 14y ago

"Skillful attachment", what a wonderful expression! Doesn't seem that widespread, google-wise, but it definitely goes in my decidedly not very Buddhistic list of rules to live by.

theorique 14y ago

Agreed. The idea is to act as if the outcome of what you were working on was the most important thing in the world to you, but to place no value on the actual outcome itself.

thibauts 14y ago
I think this can be put as "enjoy the process".
jes 14y ago
So, I should work to be a great spouse (say), but not care whether I actually achieve that outcome? Why not work to achieve things of value precisely because they are of value to you?
- zaptheimpaler 14y ago
  Because you won't always achieve them. If you value the end result, it will be all the more disappointing if you fail to achieve it.
- theorique 14y ago
  Well, it's a paradox. If you are fixated on the goal, rather than being present performing the actions that will get you to the goal, you are actually less likely to reach the goal successfully. Thinking about the goal obsessively is counterproductive. Maybe "detach from the outcome" is a better word. Anchor your happiness and well-being on performing the actions within your control that you believe will take you to that outcome, and do not make that happiness and well-being conditional on reaching that outcome.
datashaman 14y ago
A similar principle in poker (which has many lessons for life in general) is that as long as you keep making the correct decisions, in the long run you will win. If you invest emotionally in the prize you will likely make the wrong decision.
- theorique 14y ago
  > A similar principle in poker (which has many lessons for life in general) is that as long as you keep making the correct decisions, in the long run you will win. If you invest emotionally in the prize you will likely make the wrong decision. Excellent point. A bad outcome realized through a correct decision making process is painful, but is still a "better" result than a good outcome realized through a flawed decision making process. When poker players go "on tilt" they start breaking their process and it shows in their long run results. There are few places where this is more on display than in high stakes poker tournaments.

thewarrior 14y ago

This is the main philosophy of the Hindu scripture the Bhagavad Gita which says : "Your right is only to work, and never to its fruits. Don't be motivated by the fruits of work. Nor should you be attached to inaction."

neumann_alfred 14y ago

Marc Aurel: If something in the exterior world makes you discontent, then it is not that object which troubles you, but rather your judgement of it; yet to blot out this judgement instantly is within your power. And if your dissatisfaction is based on the condition of your soul, who can prohibit you from correcting your views? Likewise, if you are discontent because you are not doing what seems reasonable to you, why not be active rather than discontent? "But something stronger than me is obstructing me." Still, do not be discontent; for the cause for your inaction is not within you. "But life has no meaning for me if this is not done." Well then, end your life, as calm as if you had succeeded; but don't forget to forgive your adversaries. Words that strike me in their simplicity and depth every time I read them, but that's Marc Aurel for ya :)

dfc 14y ago
Who is Marc Aurel? I found one link making it seem that "Marc Aurel" was actually "Marcus Aurelius" and had a citation referencing Meditations. But google could not find that quote in any translation for Meditations. The "that's Marc Aurel for ya" makes it seem that he is a well known writer/thinker so maybe I am way off base thinking its Marcus Aurelius.
- adamdavis 14y ago
  > The "that's Marc Aurel for ya" makes it seem that he is a well known writer/thinker so maybe I am way off base thinking its Marcus Aurelius. Why would you think that you're off base? From what I gather Marcus Aurelius is a well known* thinker/writer - just ordered a copy of Mediations for myself after reading this post and comments. * edit
  - dfc 14y ago
    Because I never heard anyone refer to him as Marc Aurel in any of my philosophy classes and could not find any references to "marc aurel" on the internet. The familiarity of the statement made it seem like "marc aurel" was a household name. I also could not find the sentence in any copy of Meditations I found on the internet. Fyi: you can grab a copy of Meditations from a number of classics sites on the internet: http://classics.mit.edu/Antoninus/meditations.html http://classics.mit.edu/Antoninus/meditations.html