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How do I, as an ordinary person, benefit from Meta's data centers? I don't have any presence on Meta's platforms & the only time I even notice their existence i

How do I, as an ordinary person, benefit from Meta's data centers? I don't have any presence on Meta's platforms & the only time I even notice their existence is when someone sends me a text message via signal for some viral link on one of the social networks. I think you're overestimating the relevance of these data centers for regular people. They can get by just fine w/ local¹ & a lot less environmentally destructive computational resources. ¹https://solidproject.org/ https://solidproject.org/

rahimnathwani 3mo ago
'regular people' use YouTube, Facebook, Instagram etc. Even you use HN. Not everything can be local. My friends and family aren't going to be convinced to use a Jitsi instance running in my house (where I pay $0.35/kWh).
- littlestymaar 3mo ago
  > Even you use HN. A website that runs on an infra that could sit in a cupboard under the stairs serving hundreds of thousands of users with very small loading time. > My friends and family aren't going to be convinced to use a Jitsi instance running in my house > (where I pay $0.35/kWh). Using an old phone or laptop as server means you'll end up with a single digit annual electricity bill for that.
  - rahimnathwani 3mo ago
    Does dang run HN on a single server? Why does HN use Algolia for search and Firebase for its API? "Using an old phone or laptop as server means you'll end up with a single digit annual electricity bill for that." The largest possible single digit annual electricity bill would be $9. That's almost enough to run a 3W device 24x7 for a year. Do you know any old phone or laptop that can serve as a reliable Jitsi server yet draws an average of 3W or less?
    - littlestymaar 3mo ago
      > Does dang run HN on a single server? I don't think Dang is responsible of that part, but I may be wrong. HN used to run on a single server (source: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16076041 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16076041), and I don't see why that would have changed given that the hardware keeps getting better. > Why does HN use Algolia for search Algolia is a YC company, it's pretty much free marketing for their asset. > That's almost enough to run a 3W device 24x7 for a year. Do you know any old phone or laptop that can serve as a reliable Jitsi server yet draws an average of 3W or less? You don't need to run it for 24 hours a day, nor do you need it to be the only process running on your machine. Jitsi is a bit heavy for a phone, but easily fits on an old M1 macbook/mac mini, whose idle power consumption is well below 10W (idle power consumption is what matters, since your machine isn't going to be handling calls all the time). If you shut it down at night, you're almost good. And for any additional service you serve from the machine, you reduce the cost per service further. Modern computers are fast, and fascinatingly energy efficient.
- lioeters 3mo ago
  I always imagined the HN server running on a single machine in some basement, running a magically efficient Lisp program that easily handles millions of requests per second.
  - seltzered_ 3mo ago
    HN supposedly currently runs via M5 Hosting according to https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=45750668 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=45750668 (comment from late 2025), though I think it ran on a single server over a decade ago.
    - littlestymaar 3mo ago
      Back in 2018 it was already running on M5 Hosting, but still on a single server: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16076041 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16076041 (And honestly I don't see why it would have changed given that the hardware has been getting faster in the meantime).
rcpt 3mo ago
People in London buy Instagram ads to sell products to people in Birmingham and that money comes into the US. There are plenty of ways for you to catch some of it.
- simianwords 3mo ago
  This is downvoted but factually correct way of looking at it. The benefits of Meta are convoluted and hard to state in ways that are quantified to simple numbers. (Well you can - Meta contributes ~0.25% of USA's GDP which is enormous) For example, what is the benefit of google existing? Sure you can do google searches. You can use maps. But can you quantify it? The benefits of living in a society that respects pluralist values is that even if you personally have never used Instagram ever, you still respect what it provides for broader society. Its easy to give a popularist argument against anything you don't like - "how does it benefit me?!". Well it need not, but others use the products. On a side note: I'm glad to live during times where we respect pluralist values. I hate football and find it mind numbing. But its great that those people can have their fun and joy without having to convince me. And I can have mine with League of Legends.
  - forgetfreeman 3mo ago
    My patience with the pluralism argument evaporates instantly when the topic of discussion is services that are demonstrably harmful to both individuals and society at large. Trying to hide the tech industry at large and especially social media behind the NFL is wild.
  - ButlerianJihad 3mo ago
    I believe you are thinking of “collectivism”. https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/collectivism https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/collectivism “Pluralism” refers to a society supporting diverse systems of law, religion, or culture. Like the United States. https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/pluralism https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/pluralism I don’t know what “popularist” is but perhaps “populism”; however, the complement of collectivism is individualism.
simianwords 3mo ago
> How do I, as an ordinary person, benefit from Meta's data centers? From the taxes they provide
- measurablefunc 3mo ago
  I've never seen a cent go to any service in my local municipality from Meta's taxes & whatever does end up in the city coffers is not big enough to have any real effect b/c those services could just as easily be financed by direct payments instead of some circuitous route of federal, state, & sales taxes from transactions enabled by corporations like Meta. If I was in SF & working for Google or Meta then maybe you might have a point but I'm not in SF or any major metropolitan area so from my perspective the whole thing is actually a net negative.
  - simianwords 3mo ago
    Brief google search shows that most Meta DC's give around ~15M per year taxes on average per year. I'm not sure what circuitous route you are speaking about. https://www.northernpublicradio.org/wnij-news/2024-12-02/dekalb-park-district-missed-out-on-thousands-of-tax-dollars-from-meta-data-center https://www.northernpublicradio.org/wnij-news/2024-12-02/dek... https://ipmnewsroom.org/how-do-data-centers-benefit-the-places-where-theyre-built-local-mayors-give-mixed-reviews https://ipmnewsroom.org/how-do-data-centers-benefit-the-plac...
    - measurablefunc 3mo ago
      Meta is an unnecessary middleman, all those payments could be handled w/o them & their advertising network. Also, from your own link > META received a 55 percent tax break as part of the Enterprise Zone Tax abatement program, which is a state initiative
      - simianwords 3mo ago
        This doesn't make any sense. You asked this > How do I, as an ordinary person, benefit from Meta's data centres? And I gave the answer. How do you think you can eliminate the middleman? > Enterprise Zone Tax abatement program The amount I showed was after accounting for the Tax abatement program. And its almost as if there's a reason the state wants to have this program in the first place. Almost as if it helps broader society.
alex0015 3mo ago
https://github.com/facebookresearch https://github.com/facebookresearch There's a lot of excellent projects here. Also, people in your community probably own businesses that advertise or sell directly on a Meta platform. That's money affecting many things you interact with online and offline. Also also, you describe yourself as an ordinary person but say you have no presence on any of the largest social media or messaging platforms. I think that's fairly far out of the ordinary.

rahimnathwani 3mo ago

'regular people' use YouTube, Facebook, Instagram etc. Even you use HN. Not everything can be local. My friends and family aren't going to be convinced to use a Jitsi instance running in my house (where I pay $0.35/kWh).

littlestymaar 3mo ago
> Even you use HN. A website that runs on an infra that could sit in a cupboard under the stairs serving hundreds of thousands of users with very small loading time. > My friends and family aren't going to be convinced to use a Jitsi instance running in my house > (where I pay $0.35/kWh). Using an old phone or laptop as server means you'll end up with a single digit annual electricity bill for that.
- rahimnathwani 3mo ago
  Does dang run HN on a single server? Why does HN use Algolia for search and Firebase for its API? "Using an old phone or laptop as server means you'll end up with a single digit annual electricity bill for that." The largest possible single digit annual electricity bill would be $9. That's almost enough to run a 3W device 24x7 for a year. Do you know any old phone or laptop that can serve as a reliable Jitsi server yet draws an average of 3W or less?
  - littlestymaar 3mo ago
    > Does dang run HN on a single server? I don't think Dang is responsible of that part, but I may be wrong. HN used to run on a single server (source: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16076041 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16076041), and I don't see why that would have changed given that the hardware keeps getting better. > Why does HN use Algolia for search Algolia is a YC company, it's pretty much free marketing for their asset. > That's almost enough to run a 3W device 24x7 for a year. Do you know any old phone or laptop that can serve as a reliable Jitsi server yet draws an average of 3W or less? You don't need to run it for 24 hours a day, nor do you need it to be the only process running on your machine. Jitsi is a bit heavy for a phone, but easily fits on an old M1 macbook/mac mini, whose idle power consumption is well below 10W (idle power consumption is what matters, since your machine isn't going to be handling calls all the time). If you shut it down at night, you're almost good. And for any additional service you serve from the machine, you reduce the cost per service further. Modern computers are fast, and fascinatingly energy efficient.
lioeters 3mo ago
I always imagined the HN server running on a single machine in some basement, running a magically efficient Lisp program that easily handles millions of requests per second.
- seltzered_ 3mo ago
  HN supposedly currently runs via M5 Hosting according to https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=45750668 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=45750668 (comment from late 2025), though I think it ran on a single server over a decade ago.
  - littlestymaar 3mo ago
    Back in 2018 it was already running on M5 Hosting, but still on a single server: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16076041 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16076041 (And honestly I don't see why it would have changed given that the hardware has been getting faster in the meantime).

rcpt 3mo ago

People in London buy Instagram ads to sell products to people in Birmingham and that money comes into the US. There are plenty of ways for you to catch some of it.

simianwords 3mo ago
This is downvoted but factually correct way of looking at it. The benefits of Meta are convoluted and hard to state in ways that are quantified to simple numbers. (Well you can - Meta contributes ~0.25% of USA's GDP which is enormous) For example, what is the benefit of google existing? Sure you can do google searches. You can use maps. But can you quantify it? The benefits of living in a society that respects pluralist values is that even if you personally have never used Instagram ever, you still respect what it provides for broader society. Its easy to give a popularist argument against anything you don't like - "how does it benefit me?!". Well it need not, but others use the products. On a side note: I'm glad to live during times where we respect pluralist values. I hate football and find it mind numbing. But its great that those people can have their fun and joy without having to convince me. And I can have mine with League of Legends.
- forgetfreeman 3mo ago
  My patience with the pluralism argument evaporates instantly when the topic of discussion is services that are demonstrably harmful to both individuals and society at large. Trying to hide the tech industry at large and especially social media behind the NFL is wild.
- ButlerianJihad 3mo ago
  I believe you are thinking of “collectivism”. https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/collectivism https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/collectivism “Pluralism” refers to a society supporting diverse systems of law, religion, or culture. Like the United States. https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/pluralism https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/pluralism I don’t know what “popularist” is but perhaps “populism”; however, the complement of collectivism is individualism.

simianwords 3mo ago

> How do I, as an ordinary person, benefit from Meta's data centers? From the taxes they provide

measurablefunc 3mo ago
I've never seen a cent go to any service in my local municipality from Meta's taxes & whatever does end up in the city coffers is not big enough to have any real effect b/c those services could just as easily be financed by direct payments instead of some circuitous route of federal, state, & sales taxes from transactions enabled by corporations like Meta. If I was in SF & working for Google or Meta then maybe you might have a point but I'm not in SF or any major metropolitan area so from my perspective the whole thing is actually a net negative.
- simianwords 3mo ago
  Brief google search shows that most Meta DC's give around ~15M per year taxes on average per year. I'm not sure what circuitous route you are speaking about. https://www.northernpublicradio.org/wnij-news/2024-12-02/dekalb-park-district-missed-out-on-thousands-of-tax-dollars-from-meta-data-center https://www.northernpublicradio.org/wnij-news/2024-12-02/dek... https://ipmnewsroom.org/how-do-data-centers-benefit-the-places-where-theyre-built-local-mayors-give-mixed-reviews https://ipmnewsroom.org/how-do-data-centers-benefit-the-plac...
  - measurablefunc 3mo ago
    Meta is an unnecessary middleman, all those payments could be handled w/o them & their advertising network. Also, from your own link > META received a 55 percent tax break as part of the Enterprise Zone Tax abatement program, which is a state initiative
    - simianwords 3mo ago
      This doesn't make any sense. You asked this > How do I, as an ordinary person, benefit from Meta's data centres? And I gave the answer. How do you think you can eliminate the middleman? > Enterprise Zone Tax abatement program The amount I showed was after accounting for the Tax abatement program. And its almost as if there's a reason the state wants to have this program in the first place. Almost as if it helps broader society.

alex0015 3mo ago

https://github.com/facebookresearch https://github.com/facebookresearch There's a lot of excellent projects here. Also, people in your community probably own businesses that advertise or sell directly on a Meta platform. That's money affecting many things you interact with online and offline. Also also, you describe yourself as an ordinary person but say you have no presence on any of the largest social media or messaging platforms. I think that's fairly far out of the ordinary.