4 ms·

It’s more than power supply. Cooling and ventilation becomes a MUCH bigger deal at rack scale, and that costs electricity too.

by dannyw 4mo ago

thereisnospork 4mo ago
Cooling demand is only fractional with respect to the load: cooling 1MW of heat will only cost a few 10's to low 100's of kW, depending on the specifics. 10-20% overhead on cooling is probably a close enough estimate for napkin math.
psychoslave 4mo ago
And datacenters have impact on everything around them. If at the end of the day to result is a few more yachts and jets and, a lot more of miserable humans starving in ruined ecosystems, maybe that’s not the best go-to direction.
- butvacuum 4mo ago
  You say they have a large impact, but having lived somewhere with some of the largest data centers- they very much don't. At least not more so then any other structure that paves over greenery. love to debate actual discission points. pull up "datacenter dfw" on google maps for mine.
  - ffsm8 4mo ago
    The people having glass literally break from the vibrations would probably disagree with your opinion https://youtu.be/_bP80DEAbuo?is=sg09k66iutKFIFSo https://youtu.be/_bP80DEAbuo?is=sg09k66iutKFIFSo Yet here we are, discussing "data center" as if they're standardized and of similar (nose) isolation. There are no meaningful regulations in building them, and they can be incredibly polluting. So your experience with a potentially well isolated one is sadly not the norm going forward. And we don't even know how close you lived, if you're eg talking about "within 5km/3miles" then your experience would also have little value in this discussion in general.
    - jml7c5 4mo ago
      >The people having glass literally break from the vibrations would probably disagree with your opinion Can you cite a source for this? It's not in the video, as far as I can tell. I would be wary of Benn Jordan's videos. They are full of mistakes and misrepresentations, as Andy Masley has convincingly demonstrated: https://blog.andymasley.com/p/contra-benn-jordan-data-center-and https://blog.andymasley.com/p/contra-benn-jordan-data-center... I recall seeing Benn Jordan's responses on Bluesky and thinking they were quite poor. He was unwilling to admit to mistakes, and kept trying to grasp at newly searched papers that didn't actually support his arguments.
      - hypfer 4mo ago
        Benn unfortunately is one of those people that actually feel stuff, which is a trait that easily gets exploited by bad actors. Indeed, he shot himself in the foot there pretty bad, but I would argue that that was just the result of successful Agitation. I would personally strongly prefer being in the same room with Benn compared with Andy, because one of them is authentic, while the other is calculating. Though, arguably, Benn has been catching up on that lately too. But yeah, taking stuff with a grain of salt should be the default regardless of the person speaking.
      - redsocksfan45 4mo ago
        [dead]
      - butvacuum 4mo ago
        It's irrelevant. Glass is a fickle mistress- a factory defect from 20 years ago can be the nucleus for the whole pane to shatter for any reason, or no reason. Anything loud enough to crack any pane of glass that gets near it means federal agencies are very interested.
    - apublicfrog 4mo ago
      The fact that people have lived and worked near data centres for decades and didn't even know what the term meant - let alone be adversely impacted by them - probably indicates they're broadly an non issue. All of a sudden out of nowhere, AI and data centres got intermingled by the media and now people seem to have big issues with them.
  - well_ackshually 4mo ago
    a constant low 60dB 20Hz hum in the background, 24/7 is as close as a a torture technique invented by the CIA as it can get.
bayindirh 4mo ago
With liquid cooling technologies (direct or rear door heat exchange), cooling efficiently is easier when compared to a decade ago, and it's pretty efficient when you compare the power consumption numbers (server total vs. cooling total). See PUE (Power Usage Effectiveness) for its scientific form.

It’s more than power supply. Cooling and ventilation becomes a MUCH bigger deal at rack scale, and that costs electricity too.

by dannyw 4mo ago

It’s more than power supply. Cooling and ventilation becomes a MUCH bigger deal at rack scale, and that costs electricity too.

thereisnospork 4mo ago

Cooling demand is only fractional with respect to the load: cooling 1MW of heat will only cost a few 10's to low 100's of kW, depending on the specifics. 10-20% overhead on cooling is probably a close enough estimate for napkin math.

psychoslave 4mo ago

And datacenters have impact on everything around them. If at the end of the day to result is a few more yachts and jets and, a lot more of miserable humans starving in ruined ecosystems, maybe that’s not the best go-to direction.

butvacuum 4mo ago
You say they have a large impact, but having lived somewhere with some of the largest data centers- they very much don't. At least not more so then any other structure that paves over greenery. love to debate actual discission points. pull up "datacenter dfw" on google maps for mine.
- ffsm8 4mo ago
  The people having glass literally break from the vibrations would probably disagree with your opinion https://youtu.be/_bP80DEAbuo?is=sg09k66iutKFIFSo https://youtu.be/_bP80DEAbuo?is=sg09k66iutKFIFSo Yet here we are, discussing "data center" as if they're standardized and of similar (nose) isolation. There are no meaningful regulations in building them, and they can be incredibly polluting. So your experience with a potentially well isolated one is sadly not the norm going forward. And we don't even know how close you lived, if you're eg talking about "within 5km/3miles" then your experience would also have little value in this discussion in general.
  - jml7c5 4mo ago
    >The people having glass literally break from the vibrations would probably disagree with your opinion Can you cite a source for this? It's not in the video, as far as I can tell. I would be wary of Benn Jordan's videos. They are full of mistakes and misrepresentations, as Andy Masley has convincingly demonstrated: https://blog.andymasley.com/p/contra-benn-jordan-data-center-and https://blog.andymasley.com/p/contra-benn-jordan-data-center... I recall seeing Benn Jordan's responses on Bluesky and thinking they were quite poor. He was unwilling to admit to mistakes, and kept trying to grasp at newly searched papers that didn't actually support his arguments.
    - hypfer 4mo ago
      Benn unfortunately is one of those people that actually feel stuff, which is a trait that easily gets exploited by bad actors. Indeed, he shot himself in the foot there pretty bad, but I would argue that that was just the result of successful Agitation. I would personally strongly prefer being in the same room with Benn compared with Andy, because one of them is authentic, while the other is calculating. Though, arguably, Benn has been catching up on that lately too. But yeah, taking stuff with a grain of salt should be the default regardless of the person speaking.
    - redsocksfan45 4mo ago
      [dead]
    - butvacuum 4mo ago
      It's irrelevant. Glass is a fickle mistress- a factory defect from 20 years ago can be the nucleus for the whole pane to shatter for any reason, or no reason. Anything loud enough to crack any pane of glass that gets near it means federal agencies are very interested.
  - apublicfrog 4mo ago
    The fact that people have lived and worked near data centres for decades and didn't even know what the term meant - let alone be adversely impacted by them - probably indicates they're broadly an non issue. All of a sudden out of nowhere, AI and data centres got intermingled by the media and now people seem to have big issues with them.
- well_ackshually 4mo ago
  a constant low 60dB 20Hz hum in the background, 24/7 is as close as a a torture technique invented by the CIA as it can get.

bayindirh 4mo ago

With liquid cooling technologies (direct or rear door heat exchange), cooling efficiently is easier when compared to a decade ago, and it's pretty efficient when you compare the power consumption numbers (server total vs. cooling total). See PUE (Power Usage Effectiveness) for its scientific form.