5 ms·

Why take the time to write an insightful comment on the actual news at hand when you can score brownie points with yet another knee jerk 'MS is dying' comment l

Why take the time to write an insightful comment on the actual news at hand when you can score brownie points with yet another knee jerk 'MS is dying' comment linking to blog spam that further links to one graph that somehow proves your point? What about this news then? http://www.winbeta.org/news/windows-8-overtakes-android-web-traffic-just-ten-days-according-statcounter http://www.winbeta.org/news/windows-8-overtakes-android-web-... How does that fit in with the graph you posted? Statistics are like bikinis, they hide more than what they reveal. However, this being the top comment on this article says more than about HN than you.

k3n 14y ago
You make an excellent point, because I don't trust those Win8 numbers at all.
- untog 14y ago
  So when you see numbers you agree with, it's fine. But when you see numbers you don't agree with, you don't trust them? OK.
  - k3n 14y ago
    Can you show me where I said that I ever trusted any of StatCounter's data?
    - cooldeal 14y ago
      This is the problem with the OP I was talking about. Comments without any reasoning or insight, just "this is it". And this is why length of the comment is usually negatively correlated with comment quality. You failed to tell why you didn't trust the numbers in your original comment. Was it because of Statcounter? Do you suspect they were cooked up by Microsoft? Or did you feel that it didn't jive with your real world anecdote? Or did you think Windows 8 is such a failure that such numbers are impossible? "I don't trust those numbers" can mean any or all of the above including more, the replies have to guess what you meant.
      - k3n 14y ago
        > "I don't trust those numbers" can mean any or all of the above including more, the replies have to guess what you meant. No, you [they] do not have to guess; one could inquire for clarification, or simply ignore the comment. To make a gross logical fallacy -- such as Untog did -- is not my fault nor is it my problem. Untog drew a conclusion where data was nonexistant, and then extrapolated his conclusion to draw an even more unsubstantiated conclusion. What is so hard about not putting words in someone's mouth?
        cooldeal 14y ago
        You make a good point but you're just wrong.
- cooldeal 14y ago
  Wasn't it Statcounter that first said Chrome overtook IE in web usage and then Microsoft tried to muddy that by pointing to some other statistics site? It's hard to believe they're making things up to favor MS after that blog battle. What about Steams' statistics? http://winsupersite.com/windows-8/windows-8-thunders-past-mac-os-x-steam http://winsupersite.com/windows-8/windows-8-thunders-past-ma... Would you trust that or is Gabe who famously said Windows 8 is going to be catastrophe is now faking stats?
  - deleted 14y ago
    [deleted]
  - dvanduzer 14y ago
    Gamers are notorious early adopters. Only 5% adoption of Windows 8 by Steam users sounds extremely low to me. And your link says OS X share may be only of the Steam market is 3.3%, and OS X share of the total desktop market is between 6% and 10% depending on who you ask. Using some terribly sloppy, but not entirely unreasonable math, OSX-Steam has captured 30-50% of the available market in two years. That sounds wildly successful.
  - k3n 14y ago
    I don't think the Steam figures are indicative of anything other than the fact that gamers prefer Windows because it's still the only viable platform for mainstream PC gaming. And was Gabe explicitly commenting on adoption rate of Win8? Or perhaps was he referring to the fact that developing games for Win8 will likely lead to fewer and lower-quality games on that platform?
muxxa 14y ago
The winbeta article you've linked to is a repost of this article: http://microsoft-news.com/windows-8-overtake-android-web-presence-in-less-than-10-days/ http://microsoft-news.com/windows-8-overtake-android-web-pre... This completely ignores mobile android use! It's basically comparing desktop Android (Tablets) with Windows 8. StatCounter doesn't publish web traffic os data across mobile and desktop, but if you look at overall mobile vs. desktop, it's 86.7% vs. 13.3% [1] If you look at the data for the start of the graph: Android has 31% of mobile [2] (0.133 * .31 = 0.041, or 4% of the overall mobile+desktop) Android also has 0.64% of desktop [3] (0.867 * 0.0064 = 0.0055, or 0.5% of the overall) So Android has 4.5% of Mobile + Desktop While Win8 has 0.35% of desktop [3] (0.867 * 0.0035 = 0.003, or 0.35% overall) so it's 4.5% for Android vs. 0.35% for Win8 For the end of the period in the graph, Win8 has risen to 0.71% or 0.61% overall (Android will have stayed the same at 4.5%). [1] http://gs.statcounter.com/#mobile_vs_desktop-ww-daily-20121021-20121021-bar http://gs.statcounter.com/#mobile_vs_desktop-ww-daily-201210... [2] http://gs.statcounter.com/#mobile_os-ww-daily-20121021-20121021-bar http://gs.statcounter.com/#mobile_os-ww-daily-20121021-20121... [3] http://gs.statcounter.com/chart.php?bar=1&statType_hidden=os&region_hidden=ww&granularity=daily&statType=Operating%20System&region=Worldwide&fromMonthYear=2012-10&fromDay=21&toMonthYear=2012-10&toDay=21&csv=1 http://gs.statcounter.com/chart.php?bar=1&statType_hidde...

k3n 14y ago

You make an excellent point, because I don't trust those Win8 numbers at all.

untog 14y ago
So when you see numbers you agree with, it's fine. But when you see numbers you don't agree with, you don't trust them? OK.
- k3n 14y ago
  Can you show me where I said that I ever trusted any of StatCounter's data?
  - cooldeal 14y ago
    This is the problem with the OP I was talking about. Comments without any reasoning or insight, just "this is it". And this is why length of the comment is usually negatively correlated with comment quality. You failed to tell why you didn't trust the numbers in your original comment. Was it because of Statcounter? Do you suspect they were cooked up by Microsoft? Or did you feel that it didn't jive with your real world anecdote? Or did you think Windows 8 is such a failure that such numbers are impossible? "I don't trust those numbers" can mean any or all of the above including more, the replies have to guess what you meant.
    - k3n 14y ago
      > "I don't trust those numbers" can mean any or all of the above including more, the replies have to guess what you meant. No, you [they] do not have to guess; one could inquire for clarification, or simply ignore the comment. To make a gross logical fallacy -- such as Untog did -- is not my fault nor is it my problem. Untog drew a conclusion where data was nonexistant, and then extrapolated his conclusion to draw an even more unsubstantiated conclusion. What is so hard about not putting words in someone's mouth?
      - cooldeal 14y ago
        You make a good point but you're just wrong.
cooldeal 14y ago
Wasn't it Statcounter that first said Chrome overtook IE in web usage and then Microsoft tried to muddy that by pointing to some other statistics site? It's hard to believe they're making things up to favor MS after that blog battle. What about Steams' statistics? http://winsupersite.com/windows-8/windows-8-thunders-past-mac-os-x-steam http://winsupersite.com/windows-8/windows-8-thunders-past-ma... Would you trust that or is Gabe who famously said Windows 8 is going to be catastrophe is now faking stats?
- deleted 14y ago
  [deleted]
- dvanduzer 14y ago
  Gamers are notorious early adopters. Only 5% adoption of Windows 8 by Steam users sounds extremely low to me. And your link says OS X share may be only of the Steam market is 3.3%, and OS X share of the total desktop market is between 6% and 10% depending on who you ask. Using some terribly sloppy, but not entirely unreasonable math, OSX-Steam has captured 30-50% of the available market in two years. That sounds wildly successful.
- k3n 14y ago
  I don't think the Steam figures are indicative of anything other than the fact that gamers prefer Windows because it's still the only viable platform for mainstream PC gaming. And was Gabe explicitly commenting on adoption rate of Win8? Or perhaps was he referring to the fact that developing games for Win8 will likely lead to fewer and lower-quality games on that platform?

muxxa 14y ago

The winbeta article you've linked to is a repost of this article: http://microsoft-news.com/windows-8-overtake-android-web-presence-in-less-than-10-days/ http://microsoft-news.com/windows-8-overtake-android-web-pre... This completely ignores mobile android use! It's basically comparing desktop Android (Tablets) with Windows 8. StatCounter doesn't publish web traffic os data across mobile and desktop, but if you look at overall mobile vs. desktop, it's 86.7% vs. 13.3% [1] If you look at the data for the start of the graph: Android has 31% of mobile [2] (0.133 * .31 = 0.041, or 4% of the overall mobile+desktop) Android also has 0.64% of desktop [3] (0.867 * 0.0064 = 0.0055, or 0.5% of the overall) So Android has 4.5% of Mobile + Desktop While Win8 has 0.35% of desktop [3] (0.867 * 0.0035 = 0.003, or 0.35% overall) so it's 4.5% for Android vs. 0.35% for Win8 For the end of the period in the graph, Win8 has risen to 0.71% or 0.61% overall (Android will have stayed the same at 4.5%). [1] http://gs.statcounter.com/#mobile_vs_desktop-ww-daily-20121021-20121021-bar http://gs.statcounter.com/#mobile_vs_desktop-ww-daily-201210... [2] http://gs.statcounter.com/#mobile_os-ww-daily-20121021-20121021-bar http://gs.statcounter.com/#mobile_os-ww-daily-20121021-20121... [3] http://gs.statcounter.com/chart.php?bar=1&statType_hidden=os&region_hidden=ww&granularity=daily&statType=Operating%20System&region=Worldwide&fromMonthYear=2012-10&fromDay=21&toMonthYear=2012-10&toDay=21&csv=1 http://gs.statcounter.com/chart.php?bar=1&statType_hidde...