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> As a professional YouTuber, the main issue I instantly see with this is the lack of monetization. As a video watcher, the main issue I have with YouTube is t

> As a professional YouTuber, the main issue I instantly see with this is the lack of monetization. As a video watcher, the main issue I have with YouTube is the presence of monetization.

ShinyLeftPad 3mo ago
Because people are expected to spend their time, effort and money to provide content for you for free, of course. Seems like the only explanation.
- ndriscoll 3mo ago
  They're not. No one asked OP to use peertube. This is software for people who want to share videos. Coming in and declaring you won't use it because you can't make money from your videos should just get an "okay?" Interjecting into a FOSS space and complaining they are not paying you is beyond bizarre. Doubling down when people basically say "actually I'm specifically looking for non-commercial groups, so your absence is appreciated" is crazy. If you want to make money in something, you're not part of the group who doesn't. There's already a giant platform for you. Why would you say hobbyists are entitled?
  - kalcode 3mo ago
    Thank you. It is a bit bizarre reading this thread.
  - ShinyLeftPad 3mo ago
    > As a video watcher, the main issue I have with YouTube is the presence of monetization. I was replying to that. This commenter is not a hobbyist making video, he watches some hobbyists video, and them getting paid is the issue he has.
    - ndriscoll 3mo ago
      The issue he has is he wants to find/communicate with hobbyists, and instead runs into people trying to turn it into a profession. It becomes difficult to find like-minded people when every topic is infected by grifters. Injecting money into a leisure activity will inevitably ruin it and the people participating. The reason why is on full display here: this entire thread has been derailed by people asking how you're supposed to make money with it, denigrating people who "only" have 100 subscribers (imagine 100 people regularly coming to watch you give a talk or demo or performance out of pure interest!), etc. In a hobby or leisure space, appreciation or encouragement alone is valuable. Monetizing leisure leads to some crazy ideas. Like completely turning the perspective around: "content creators" think what they're doing is interesting enough that not only will I give them my attention, but that I should somehow compensate them for it? Crazy.
      - ShinyLeftPad 3mo ago
        > The issue he has is he wants to find/communicate with hobbyists, and instead runs into people trying to turn it into a profession. To me that is in line with my original quote. He actively seeks work people put in while haivng an issue with them getting compensated for it. Whether YT has monetization or not people's incentives are the same. Imagine that YT has no ads, people would put stuff behind paywalls or upsell aggressively. > denigrating people who "only" have 100 subscribers (imagine 100 people regularly coming to watch you give a talk or demo or performance out of pure interest!), etc I would never denigrate those people. But if you work hard enough and put in enough work that people watch 4000 hours of your videos in last year, and eventually you want to quit the job you don't like and just get paid by creating for people like that guy, and that guy says "monetization is the problem I have", it's kind of sociopathic. Drawing this line between work and hobby, like you have to do stuff you hate for money and god forbid you start getting paid for doing stuff you like
        ndriscoll 3mo ago
        My assertion is that he's not actively seeking work people put in; he's actively seeking people. The sociopathic thing is exactly reducing people, interests, and interactions into something transactional like this. He's looking for people who don't think that way. So putting things behind paywalls is fine; it makes those people disappear. Upselling remains annoying. It recasts every interaction into a sales pitch. What that guy is telling OP is that he's not creating for him. OP came into a thread about a platform for freely sharing video, not for getting a job in the entertainment industry. There's already at least 3 major platforms for that, and the monetization is what that user said he doesn't like about youtube [in contrast to this]. It's like commenting in a thread about a package repo complaining that the problem with FOSS communities is lack of monetization. If you want a job in the field, go somewhere where people are looking for help and will pay you to do things for them. Not places where people are having fun so you can try to upsell. And yes there should be a line between work and hobby. Hobbies are things you do for you. Work is something someone else wants and pays you to do. You are doing it for them. e.g. with making software, work should not be fun. It should be boring. Making it "fun" is just a pain for your colleagues. Conversely, leisure should be fun. Making it into a money-making endeavor makes it unenjoyable for everyone else. There is supposed to be a line.
- BLKNSLVR 3mo ago
  > Seems like the only explanation. Youtube itself is responsible for an entire generation expecting the videos to be free. The monetisation and injection of advertising into roughly-everything is only a relatively recent development. Free-until-monopoly.
  - ShinyLeftPad 3mo ago
    > Youtube itself is responsible for an entire generation expecting the videos to be free. True, it did create this weird world. But then think about all of the amazing high production value work we enjoy because someone once did it for fun, got paid and then decided to keep doing it and make a nice living off it while you still don't pay them a cent. Sadly it's probably impossible for YT to have that original atmosphere.
- BrenBarn 3mo ago
  I don't really expect anything. All the people who want to make money from YouTube can just stop making stuff if money is what's motivating them.
  - ShinyLeftPad 3mo ago
    > I don't really expect anything. You are a self described youtube watcher. Unless you pay for youtube premium, you expect free content literally every time you open youtube. By definition. > All the people who want to make money from YouTube can just stop making stuff if money is what's motivating them. I don't know how old are you but after certain age things are not so black and white. We don't live in severance where we can slave away at a denigrating unethical job we hate just to earn money. People prefer to do something they love AND earn money from it. If they don't do the latter they starve and go bankrupt. Guess what then they can't provide free content for you.

> As a professional YouTuber, the main issue I instantly see with this is the lack of monetization. As a video watcher, the main issue I have with YouTube is the presence of monetization.

ShinyLeftPad 3mo ago

Because people are expected to spend their time, effort and money to provide content for you for free, of course. Seems like the only explanation.

ndriscoll 3mo ago
They're not. No one asked OP to use peertube. This is software for people who want to share videos. Coming in and declaring you won't use it because you can't make money from your videos should just get an "okay?" Interjecting into a FOSS space and complaining they are not paying you is beyond bizarre. Doubling down when people basically say "actually I'm specifically looking for non-commercial groups, so your absence is appreciated" is crazy. If you want to make money in something, you're not part of the group who doesn't. There's already a giant platform for you. Why would you say hobbyists are entitled?
- kalcode 3mo ago
  Thank you. It is a bit bizarre reading this thread.
- ShinyLeftPad 3mo ago
  > As a video watcher, the main issue I have with YouTube is the presence of monetization. I was replying to that. This commenter is not a hobbyist making video, he watches some hobbyists video, and them getting paid is the issue he has.
  - ndriscoll 3mo ago
    The issue he has is he wants to find/communicate with hobbyists, and instead runs into people trying to turn it into a profession. It becomes difficult to find like-minded people when every topic is infected by grifters. Injecting money into a leisure activity will inevitably ruin it and the people participating. The reason why is on full display here: this entire thread has been derailed by people asking how you're supposed to make money with it, denigrating people who "only" have 100 subscribers (imagine 100 people regularly coming to watch you give a talk or demo or performance out of pure interest!), etc. In a hobby or leisure space, appreciation or encouragement alone is valuable. Monetizing leisure leads to some crazy ideas. Like completely turning the perspective around: "content creators" think what they're doing is interesting enough that not only will I give them my attention, but that I should somehow compensate them for it? Crazy.
    - ShinyLeftPad 3mo ago
      > The issue he has is he wants to find/communicate with hobbyists, and instead runs into people trying to turn it into a profession. To me that is in line with my original quote. He actively seeks work people put in while haivng an issue with them getting compensated for it. Whether YT has monetization or not people's incentives are the same. Imagine that YT has no ads, people would put stuff behind paywalls or upsell aggressively. > denigrating people who "only" have 100 subscribers (imagine 100 people regularly coming to watch you give a talk or demo or performance out of pure interest!), etc I would never denigrate those people. But if you work hard enough and put in enough work that people watch 4000 hours of your videos in last year, and eventually you want to quit the job you don't like and just get paid by creating for people like that guy, and that guy says "monetization is the problem I have", it's kind of sociopathic. Drawing this line between work and hobby, like you have to do stuff you hate for money and god forbid you start getting paid for doing stuff you like
      - ndriscoll 3mo ago
        My assertion is that he's not actively seeking work people put in; he's actively seeking people. The sociopathic thing is exactly reducing people, interests, and interactions into something transactional like this. He's looking for people who don't think that way. So putting things behind paywalls is fine; it makes those people disappear. Upselling remains annoying. It recasts every interaction into a sales pitch. What that guy is telling OP is that he's not creating for him. OP came into a thread about a platform for freely sharing video, not for getting a job in the entertainment industry. There's already at least 3 major platforms for that, and the monetization is what that user said he doesn't like about youtube [in contrast to this]. It's like commenting in a thread about a package repo complaining that the problem with FOSS communities is lack of monetization. If you want a job in the field, go somewhere where people are looking for help and will pay you to do things for them. Not places where people are having fun so you can try to upsell. And yes there should be a line between work and hobby. Hobbies are things you do for you. Work is something someone else wants and pays you to do. You are doing it for them. e.g. with making software, work should not be fun. It should be boring. Making it "fun" is just a pain for your colleagues. Conversely, leisure should be fun. Making it into a money-making endeavor makes it unenjoyable for everyone else. There is supposed to be a line.
BLKNSLVR 3mo ago
> Seems like the only explanation. Youtube itself is responsible for an entire generation expecting the videos to be free. The monetisation and injection of advertising into roughly-everything is only a relatively recent development. Free-until-monopoly.
- ShinyLeftPad 3mo ago
  > Youtube itself is responsible for an entire generation expecting the videos to be free. True, it did create this weird world. But then think about all of the amazing high production value work we enjoy because someone once did it for fun, got paid and then decided to keep doing it and make a nice living off it while you still don't pay them a cent. Sadly it's probably impossible for YT to have that original atmosphere.
BrenBarn 3mo ago
I don't really expect anything. All the people who want to make money from YouTube can just stop making stuff if money is what's motivating them.
- ShinyLeftPad 3mo ago
  > I don't really expect anything. You are a self described youtube watcher. Unless you pay for youtube premium, you expect free content literally every time you open youtube. By definition. > All the people who want to make money from YouTube can just stop making stuff if money is what's motivating them. I don't know how old are you but after certain age things are not so black and white. We don't live in severance where we can slave away at a denigrating unethical job we hate just to earn money. People prefer to do something they love AND earn money from it. If they don't do the latter they starve and go bankrupt. Guess what then they can't provide free content for you.