13 ms·

How employment changes when firms adopt generative AI

54 points by nreece 3mo ago

Eufrat 3mo ago
What is the value of saying this when ChatGPT was released in 2022? There’s no way there’s enough data to make any meaningful extrapolation about anything.
- henry2023 3mo ago
  The current narrative is that AI is displacing jobs. Similar to the current post there’s just not enough data to be conclusive.
  - TomasBM 3mo ago
    Current narrative where? I don't see this narrative being more prominent than the "AI won't be displacing jobs because things worked out in the past" counternarrative. For example, only recently has The Economist published articles that go more towards that narrative (AFAIK) [1]. > there’s just not enough data to be conclusive. With this, I can agree. We can still extrapolate based on what we currently know. [1] https://www.economist.com/leaders/2026/05/14/prepare-for-an-ai-jobs-apocalypse https://www.economist.com/leaders/2026/05/14/prepare-for-an-...
    - codessta 3mo ago
      [dead]
- claw-el 3mo ago
  To get onto Hacker News and other social media sites for marketing exposure?
pjmlp 3mo ago
The human teams that were there doing CMS translations, or doing image assets, are no more...
guptadagger 3mo ago
is that more or less than regular headcount growth?
- delusional 3mo ago
  It's not entirely clear to me, but I believe this is 10% over the control. The 10% is therefore relative to "regular headcount growth".
shevy-java 3mo ago
So, more skynet leads to more real jobs? I am confused. Wasn't the initial claim that AI kills all jobs? I feel the claim right now is not really correct. One needs to do a thorough analysis of the whole job market across different countries, say, over 5 years. Or at the least 3 years but very complete and unbiased either way.
- deleted 3mo ago
  [deleted]
- protocolture 3mo ago
  The claim is and always has been that automation increases net jobs. There's never been an automation revolution that worked otherwise. The counter claim that LLMs were special for some reason has never been supported. And a lot of its proponents have other axes to grind, like UBI, Socialism, Communism etc. It would suit their worldview for this time to be different, and so thats the message they push.
  - somenameforme 3mo ago
    I'm not entirely sure that's the claim or conclusion. Like they said the companies increasing headcount are also being pumped full of $$$. That's a non-permanent state of affairs because it's heavily fueled by speculation about possible future scenarios which may or may not come to pass. I think the bigger conclusion is that LLMs are, for now, having a minimal effect on the labor market. And I think this makes sense. In spite of individual claims of 10x productivity boost or whatever, their effect on the bottom line of companies seems to remain quite unclear, at best. On the contrary the token-maxing catastrophe seems to have resulted in companies becoming far more price conscious towards LLM usage.
    - Shitty-kitty 3mo ago
      I't has been very good as suppressing wages.
  - Retric 3mo ago
whatever1 3mo ago
Because people are wasting time and tokens doing irrelevant to the bottom line things. Cool you spent 2 days and $200 building a react UI for your spreadsheet.
- whstl 3mo ago
  Bingo. Bullshit work grows to accommodate productivity gains. Is it easier to implement a design now? Then let’s redesign every quarter. Is it easier to refactor the whole codebase? Then let’s rewrite in whatever new hotness. This is not different from web frameworks 10-20 years ago. Is it easier to make a website using Rails? If so, why did I see an explosion in devs-per-project after I started using Rails? Because of the BS.
cma 3mo ago
[dead]
keyle 3mo ago
That's interesting and goes directly against what everyone complains about in the employment sector. I'm sure there is a big caveat in there somewhere.
- arcticbull 3mo ago
  Companies over-hired in 2021 assuming that their COVID metrics explosion would persist, but they didn't. We saw low attrition for years, and a low-hire/low-fire employment environment. Then the time came to pay the piper. The tech everything's-hypergrowth era is, for now, over. Most of the low-hanging fruit that we've collected for the last 20 years of bull market (putting tech into every business) is gone, and companies hired in advance of having the next business to overlay on their current ones. For many that didn't materialize.
rebuilder 3mo ago
We can’t really say what this means. Maybe heavy AI use caused companies to perform better and grow. Or maybe the type of company that went big into AI was the type of company that was getting investments and growing because of it?
jdw64 3mo ago
>AI adoption and the associated gains are unevenly distributed.
camillomiller 3mo ago
These studies miss a huge point, which is: working with automation outside of programming is tedious, frustrating, and soul crushing. I see it already with some non technical clients. I have notice a terrible trend of people just offloading everything to agents or prompting even the simplest interaction with other humans. Let me tell you, it’s fucking dire.
- consp 3mo ago
  Inside can be as well. Please manually review these 5000 lines of slop I generated while watching YouTube and verify the unreadable readme due to all the bloat and icons is correct with the code. If that is not soul crushing I would not know what is.
  - Terr_ 3mo ago
    > bloat "Look at all the traditional signals of thought, quality, or attention that it inserted, which being totally counterfeit have actually become strictly counterproductive--at least to anybody who has to actually use it!"
  - camillomiller 3mo ago
    Yesterday a fellow agency who’s sharing a client with me proceeded to send me a roughly 1000-thousand words LLM-generated message on slack explaining a strange behavior on a newsletter flow that did the following: - explained back to me the original request I had filed with details - assumed the request was about something it was not - didn’t reply to my question - had no actionable element whatsoever - repeated all of the above twice with different words. This is a senior person running a marketing agency. The absurdity here is that I have a high cost per hour that falls back onto our shared client. Who I will now have to brief about how I spent about 2 hours due to this comms back and forth and deciphering LLM-novels on a problem that could have been solved in a 30min slot if the agency only took 5 minutes to read, understand and use their brain. The added time was for me to basically go back to my comms, understand if I had communicated poorly (I asked a non-tech third party: they got it in 3 minutes), and reassess everything twice. Result: two hours to do something that amounted to changing a link behavior.
thesumofall 3mo ago
Skeptical of the study approach, but it is an entirely possible scenario if we don’t hit AGI. Many of the non-tech companies are only now starting to invest into AI. For many of them, AI might unlock new business approaches. Eg a company switches to real time pricing. Great, but suddenly you need people swapping price tags. Or you launch a project to replace paper price tags with electronic tags. Those need to be regularly maintained and charged, etc. Oops, our legacy ERP system can’t deal with that. Let’s upgrade that
- awesomeMilou 3mo ago
  [flagged]
  - butler14 3mo ago
    That’s because Aldi /did/ the upgrade…?
lmc 3mo ago
"Oh yeah, we had to hire a bunch of guys to clean up the slop"
mgc_blackbox 3mo ago
[flagged]
frobisher 3mo ago
Too soon.
nairboon 3mo ago
So they studied change in "headcount" (full-time, part-time?), but what are these heads doing? A more interesting metric to study would be changes in wages for a normalized position (e.g. 40h/week, 4w PTO/y). Then you could disentangle the different effects of actually hiring a highly paid worker or replacing a highly paid worker with two new assistants + an AI subscription for less total compensation. AI is just the latest stage of a long trend in automation. If you check the first chart in the recent article of the NY FED [1] you'll see that the labor share has been on a decline for decades, and the trend hints at an accelerating decline. In light of this larger trend, I wouldn't expect that the wages of the "increased headcount" according to ramp's article is growing or holding ground. [1]: https://libertystreeteconomics.newyorkfed.org/2026/06/the-post-covid-decline-in-the-labor-share/ https://libertystreeteconomics.newyorkfed.org/2026/06/the-po...
- deleted 3mo ago
  [deleted]
Havoc 3mo ago
Seems like a questionable correlation. The companies with money to burn on AI are those those that are growing and doing well so ofc their growing headcount too
- arcticbull 3mo ago
  One of the study authors, Ara, tweeted that they control for that by comparing early adopters against firms who haven't yet, and built like-for-like control groups with similar pre-adoption growth trajectories. (This is a rough quote).
  - Havoc 3mo ago
    Fair enough
programmer4web 3mo ago
[flagged]

54 points by nreece 3mo ago

What is the value of saying this when ChatGPT was released in 2022? There’s no way there’s enough data to make any meaningful extrapolation about anything.

henry2023 3mo ago
The current narrative is that AI is displacing jobs. Similar to the current post there’s just not enough data to be conclusive.
- TomasBM 3mo ago
  Current narrative where? I don't see this narrative being more prominent than the "AI won't be displacing jobs because things worked out in the past" counternarrative. For example, only recently has The Economist published articles that go more towards that narrative (AFAIK) [1]. > there’s just not enough data to be conclusive. With this, I can agree. We can still extrapolate based on what we currently know. [1] https://www.economist.com/leaders/2026/05/14/prepare-for-an-ai-jobs-apocalypse https://www.economist.com/leaders/2026/05/14/prepare-for-an-...
  - codessta 3mo ago
    [dead]
claw-el 3mo ago
To get onto Hacker News and other social media sites for marketing exposure?

pjmlp 3mo ago

The human teams that were there doing CMS translations, or doing image assets, are no more...

guptadagger 3mo ago

is that more or less than regular headcount growth?

delusional 3mo ago
It's not entirely clear to me, but I believe this is 10% over the control. The 10% is therefore relative to "regular headcount growth".

shevy-java 3mo ago

So, more skynet leads to more real jobs? I am confused. Wasn't the initial claim that AI kills all jobs? I feel the claim right now is not really correct. One needs to do a thorough analysis of the whole job market across different countries, say, over 5 years. Or at the least 3 years but very complete and unbiased either way.

deleted 3mo ago
[deleted]
protocolture 3mo ago
The claim is and always has been that automation increases net jobs. There's never been an automation revolution that worked otherwise. The counter claim that LLMs were special for some reason has never been supported. And a lot of its proponents have other axes to grind, like UBI, Socialism, Communism etc. It would suit their worldview for this time to be different, and so thats the message they push.
- somenameforme 3mo ago
  I'm not entirely sure that's the claim or conclusion. Like they said the companies increasing headcount are also being pumped full of $$$. That's a non-permanent state of affairs because it's heavily fueled by speculation about possible future scenarios which may or may not come to pass. I think the bigger conclusion is that LLMs are, for now, having a minimal effect on the labor market. And I think this makes sense. In spite of individual claims of 10x productivity boost or whatever, their effect on the bottom line of companies seems to remain quite unclear, at best. On the contrary the token-maxing catastrophe seems to have resulted in companies becoming far more price conscious towards LLM usage.
  - Shitty-kitty 3mo ago
    I't has been very good as suppressing wages.
- Retric 3mo ago

whatever1 3mo ago

Because people are wasting time and tokens doing irrelevant to the bottom line things. Cool you spent 2 days and $200 building a react UI for your spreadsheet.

whstl 3mo ago
Bingo. Bullshit work grows to accommodate productivity gains. Is it easier to implement a design now? Then let’s redesign every quarter. Is it easier to refactor the whole codebase? Then let’s rewrite in whatever new hotness. This is not different from web frameworks 10-20 years ago. Is it easier to make a website using Rails? If so, why did I see an explosion in devs-per-project after I started using Rails? Because of the BS.

cma 3mo ago

[dead]

keyle 3mo ago

That's interesting and goes directly against what everyone complains about in the employment sector. I'm sure there is a big caveat in there somewhere.

arcticbull 3mo ago
Companies over-hired in 2021 assuming that their COVID metrics explosion would persist, but they didn't. We saw low attrition for years, and a low-hire/low-fire employment environment. Then the time came to pay the piper. The tech everything's-hypergrowth era is, for now, over. Most of the low-hanging fruit that we've collected for the last 20 years of bull market (putting tech into every business) is gone, and companies hired in advance of having the next business to overlay on their current ones. For many that didn't materialize.

rebuilder 3mo ago

We can’t really say what this means. Maybe heavy AI use caused companies to perform better and grow. Or maybe the type of company that went big into AI was the type of company that was getting investments and growing because of it?

jdw64 3mo ago

>AI adoption and the associated gains are unevenly distributed.

camillomiller 3mo ago

These studies miss a huge point, which is: working with automation outside of programming is tedious, frustrating, and soul crushing. I see it already with some non technical clients. I have notice a terrible trend of people just offloading everything to agents or prompting even the simplest interaction with other humans. Let me tell you, it’s fucking dire.

consp 3mo ago
Inside can be as well. Please manually review these 5000 lines of slop I generated while watching YouTube and verify the unreadable readme due to all the bloat and icons is correct with the code. If that is not soul crushing I would not know what is.
- Terr_ 3mo ago
  > bloat "Look at all the traditional signals of thought, quality, or attention that it inserted, which being totally counterfeit have actually become strictly counterproductive--at least to anybody who has to actually use it!"
- camillomiller 3mo ago
  Yesterday a fellow agency who’s sharing a client with me proceeded to send me a roughly 1000-thousand words LLM-generated message on slack explaining a strange behavior on a newsletter flow that did the following: - explained back to me the original request I had filed with details - assumed the request was about something it was not - didn’t reply to my question - had no actionable element whatsoever - repeated all of the above twice with different words. This is a senior person running a marketing agency. The absurdity here is that I have a high cost per hour that falls back onto our shared client. Who I will now have to brief about how I spent about 2 hours due to this comms back and forth and deciphering LLM-novels on a problem that could have been solved in a 30min slot if the agency only took 5 minutes to read, understand and use their brain. The added time was for me to basically go back to my comms, understand if I had communicated poorly (I asked a non-tech third party: they got it in 3 minutes), and reassess everything twice. Result: two hours to do something that amounted to changing a link behavior.

thesumofall 3mo ago

Skeptical of the study approach, but it is an entirely possible scenario if we don’t hit AGI. Many of the non-tech companies are only now starting to invest into AI. For many of them, AI might unlock new business approaches. Eg a company switches to real time pricing. Great, but suddenly you need people swapping price tags. Or you launch a project to replace paper price tags with electronic tags. Those need to be regularly maintained and charged, etc. Oops, our legacy ERP system can’t deal with that. Let’s upgrade that

awesomeMilou 3mo ago
[flagged]
- butler14 3mo ago
  That’s because Aldi /did/ the upgrade…?

lmc 3mo ago

"Oh yeah, we had to hire a bunch of guys to clean up the slop"

mgc_blackbox 3mo ago

[flagged]

frobisher 3mo ago

Too soon.

nairboon 3mo ago

So they studied change in "headcount" (full-time, part-time?), but what are these heads doing? A more interesting metric to study would be changes in wages for a normalized position (e.g. 40h/week, 4w PTO/y). Then you could disentangle the different effects of actually hiring a highly paid worker or replacing a highly paid worker with two new assistants + an AI subscription for less total compensation. AI is just the latest stage of a long trend in automation. If you check the first chart in the recent article of the NY FED [1] you'll see that the labor share has been on a decline for decades, and the trend hints at an accelerating decline. In light of this larger trend, I wouldn't expect that the wages of the "increased headcount" according to ramp's article is growing or holding ground. [1]: https://libertystreeteconomics.newyorkfed.org/2026/06/the-post-covid-decline-in-the-labor-share/ https://libertystreeteconomics.newyorkfed.org/2026/06/the-po...

deleted 3mo ago
[deleted]

Havoc 3mo ago

Seems like a questionable correlation. The companies with money to burn on AI are those those that are growing and doing well so ofc their growing headcount too

arcticbull 3mo ago
One of the study authors, Ara, tweeted that they control for that by comparing early adopters against firms who haven't yet, and built like-for-like control groups with similar pre-adoption growth trajectories. (This is a rough quote).
- Havoc 3mo ago
  Fair enough

programmer4web 3mo ago

[flagged]