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Ask HN: Should HN Get 2FA?

3 points by roschdal 3mo ago

rationalist 3mo ago
I prefer to just keep my password secure.
Bender 3mo ago
To manage it, probably that or IP restrictions. I assume team dang has IP/CIDR restrictions set on their authorized_keys in sshd. For the rest of us, probably just simple / basic password complexity and some attempt at detecting brute force if that is not already a thing. My personal preference for any site would be to also have an option for cidr/IP approve-list.
PaulHoule 3mo ago
Never. 2FA is a suicide pact for any online service if it doesn't have high touch customer service like a bank. A certain fraction of users will be locked out without recourse each month and the user base will decay like a radioisotope. Every time a service requires 2FA I rethink if I want to stay with it.
- rekabis 3mo ago
  > Every time a service requires 2FA I rethink if I want to stay with it. I’m sure you feel the same about locks on your car and on your home. I mean, those silly keys, eh? They get so much in the way of going in and out and just using those things. Better if we dispensed with keys entirely, and just left everything unlocked and instantly available.
  - PaulHoule 3mo ago
    Look if I get locked out with real keys and locks I can call the locksmith and get the situation resolved. If I get locked out of Google or Amazon or Facebook I can talk to the hand at best with no recourse at all. A lot of 2FA hardware is garbage, like the Yubikey I had that had the hole attaching it to my keychain worn out in less than two years -- it could have fallen away and been lost.
    - rekabis 3mo ago
      If you do 2FA without recovery keys or a recovery eMail, you’re doing it wrong. Everything I have heard from you so far is draped with ignorance and misinformation.
      - PaulHoule 3mo ago
        recovery keys = "write down your password" which they've been telling us to not do for years recovery email/phone = same threat model as regular passwords, and it's a big crack, all the time somebody bribes somebody at a phone carrier to take over the phone number of a crypto whale Practically low-touch services are going to have to resort to these things, but they render 2FA performative. Now at work 2FA is OK because I can go down the street and show my face and ID to the people at CIT and I don't mind it for my bank because their cost structure lets me do the same.
        rekabis 3mo ago
        Thank you for confirming my second sentence for me. Especially the first sentence of your response - “write down your password”. Wow. This is the worst possible take I can imagine. Like, this isn’t the 1980s anymore, password managers exist - even local-only ones - that can keep both strong passwords and recovery keys totally safe. KeePass in particular can be synced using server-free methods, keeping everything on-device, strongly encrypted, and essentially offline. I suggest you touch some grass and actually educate yourself. TOTP 2FA is a massive leap in security that brings the traditional username+password safely into the modern threat era. Provided that the password is long+strong and the username leverages dot extensions in the eMail (if an eMail) or is a totally unique username (if only a text string), said three-point security can reliably exceed that of passkeys.
catfish-1234 3mo ago
Dont exactly see the appeal of what someone with my login credentials would do on HN.
- rekabis 3mo ago
  Doxxing. Posing as you, to get you fired or otherwise affect your reputation, especially if there is already a traceable connection to your meatworld persona. As a first step in a fraud scheme. To leverage social credibility to affect others. The options are varied, and are really only nerfed by obscurity of both the platform and your handle in terms of its doxxability.
  - gaws 3mo ago
    This. It's baffling people shrug their shoulders or outright ignore the risks.
ahmedrafat87678 3mo ago
[flagged]

3 points by roschdal 3mo ago

I prefer to just keep my password secure.

To manage it, probably that or IP restrictions. I assume team dang has IP/CIDR restrictions set on their authorized_keys in sshd. For the rest of us, probably just simple / basic password complexity and some attempt at detecting brute force if that is not already a thing. My personal preference for any site would be to also have an option for cidr/IP approve-list.

PaulHoule 3mo ago

Never. 2FA is a suicide pact for any online service if it doesn't have high touch customer service like a bank. A certain fraction of users will be locked out without recourse each month and the user base will decay like a radioisotope. Every time a service requires 2FA I rethink if I want to stay with it.

rekabis 3mo ago
> Every time a service requires 2FA I rethink if I want to stay with it. I’m sure you feel the same about locks on your car and on your home. I mean, those silly keys, eh? They get so much in the way of going in and out and just using those things. Better if we dispensed with keys entirely, and just left everything unlocked and instantly available.
- PaulHoule 3mo ago
  Look if I get locked out with real keys and locks I can call the locksmith and get the situation resolved. If I get locked out of Google or Amazon or Facebook I can talk to the hand at best with no recourse at all. A lot of 2FA hardware is garbage, like the Yubikey I had that had the hole attaching it to my keychain worn out in less than two years -- it could have fallen away and been lost.
  - rekabis 3mo ago
    If you do 2FA without recovery keys or a recovery eMail, you’re doing it wrong. Everything I have heard from you so far is draped with ignorance and misinformation.
    - PaulHoule 3mo ago
      recovery keys = "write down your password" which they've been telling us to not do for years recovery email/phone = same threat model as regular passwords, and it's a big crack, all the time somebody bribes somebody at a phone carrier to take over the phone number of a crypto whale Practically low-touch services are going to have to resort to these things, but they render 2FA performative. Now at work 2FA is OK because I can go down the street and show my face and ID to the people at CIT and I don't mind it for my bank because their cost structure lets me do the same.
      - rekabis 3mo ago
        Thank you for confirming my second sentence for me. Especially the first sentence of your response - “write down your password”. Wow. This is the worst possible take I can imagine. Like, this isn’t the 1980s anymore, password managers exist - even local-only ones - that can keep both strong passwords and recovery keys totally safe. KeePass in particular can be synced using server-free methods, keeping everything on-device, strongly encrypted, and essentially offline. I suggest you touch some grass and actually educate yourself. TOTP 2FA is a massive leap in security that brings the traditional username+password safely into the modern threat era. Provided that the password is long+strong and the username leverages dot extensions in the eMail (if an eMail) or is a totally unique username (if only a text string), said three-point security can reliably exceed that of passkeys.

catfish-1234 3mo ago

Dont exactly see the appeal of what someone with my login credentials would do on HN.

rekabis 3mo ago
Doxxing. Posing as you, to get you fired or otherwise affect your reputation, especially if there is already a traceable connection to your meatworld persona. As a first step in a fraud scheme. To leverage social credibility to affect others. The options are varied, and are really only nerfed by obscurity of both the platform and your handle in terms of its doxxability.
- gaws 3mo ago
  This. It's baffling people shrug their shoulders or outright ignore the risks.

ahmedrafat87678 3mo ago

[flagged]