3 ms·

I think you dislike the personal responsibility angle, which is fine but separate from caloric intake being the source of obesity. The fat is stored energy from

by 9x39 4mo ago

I think you dislike the personal responsibility angle, which is fine but separate from caloric intake being the source of obesity. The fat is stored energy from food, it would violate conservation of energy otherwise. There's metabolism, food density, food availability, psychology, culture, economics, etc in play, but it's important not to lie to ourselves that the proximal cause of obesity isn't from over consumption.

JumpCrisscross 4mo ago
> dislike the personal responsibility angle I dislike the rejection of evidence. These drugs solve a problem. Preaching personal responsibility does not. In that way it almost reminds me of drug prohibition and abstinence-only rhetoric.
- 9x39 4mo ago
  The evidence of where their fat stores came from?
  - JumpCrisscross 4mo ago
    > evidence of where their fat stores came from? Yes. Specifically, how basal metabolism is not a consciously-controlled rate that modifies itself against diet and exercise to the point that in some people with serious metabolic syndrome it may be impossible for them to lose weight through diet and exercise without suffering nutritional shortfalls. Also, the clinical evidence around what works for people losing weight and getting healthier and what doesn’t. Like, I get we have a powerful fast-food and sugary-drinks lobby in America, but wow is it wild seeing people get uppity about third parties’ private healthcare decisions like this.
    - faangguyindia 4mo ago
      >Yes. Specifically, how basal metabolism is not a consciously-controlled rate that modifies itself against diet and exercise to the point that in some people with serious metabolic syndrome it may be impossible for them to lose weight through diet and exercise without suffering nutritional shortfalls. The average person does not understand how weight loss works; many people do not know the concept of maintenance calories, and don't know how calorie surplus or deficit works. Simply putting them on drugs for life isn't a solution. The average person does not have metabolic syndrome, yet the average person is increasingly becoming obese or perhaps already is obese in many countries.
      - crooked-v 4mo ago
        > Simply putting them on drugs for life isn't a solution. Plenty of people are on drugs for life for a variety of things that have less health impact than being overweight.
      - ben_w 4mo ago
        > Simply putting them on drugs for life isn't a solution. It literally is "a" solution. The questions should be: is it the best solution that currently exists? And is it the best that can exist? It may be that widespread availability of weight loss drugs that actually work ends the economic incentives to promote foods which themselves promote over-eating. Or it may be that it triggers an arms race with food manufacturers seeking out things that override the weight loss drugs. Or there may be negative side-effects we have yet to learn about, like there have been for so many other things that previously seemed amazing or miraculous.
    - s1artibartfast 4mo ago
      Third party private healthcare decisions are almost non-existant in the US due to the payment systems. People are on the hook for the decisions of others either through their premium, taxes, or both. Of course, this is non-central and rarely the concern people present. That said, 2026 US GLP-1 healthcare sales projections run between 60 and 100 billion [1]. it will be interesting to see if these miricle drugs can really provide that much benefit/offset that much cost. For comparison, Medicare part D is ~150 billion in its entirety. https://evolvancemarketresearch.com/reports/glp-1-weight-loss-drug-market/ https://evolvancemarketresearch.com/reports/glp-1-weight-los...
      - JumpCrisscross 4mo ago
        > Third party private healthcare decisions are almost non-existant in the US due to the payment systems The payment part is almost entirely pushing against GLP-1 agonists. Nobody has a long-term financial stake in patient costs to care that lifetime costs will likely be lower; insurers are just looking at the next couple years against expected churn. Another cost of tying health insurance to employment.
phil21 4mo ago
Who is lying? I was fat because I ate too much. Why I ate too much is uninteresting to me. I also don’t have some moral hang up over it. Give me that easy button all day long so I can focus on shit in my life that actually matters. If it makes someone feel better about themselves to believe in woo-woo science that violates the laws of physics and ascribe magical properties to GLPs, why do you care?
- faangguyindia 4mo ago
  >If it makes someone feel better about themselves to believe in woo-woo science that violates the laws of physics and ascribe magical properties to GLPs, why do you care? Why we should not care about putting people on drug who do can benefit from making lifestyle changes, being less sedentary and leaning about maintenance calories and how calorie surplus and deficit works? if there is no resistance, simply prescribing GLPs to average person may become a new normal.
  - phil21 4mo ago
    > being less sedentary and leaning about maintenance calories and how calorie surplus and deficit works? Because it's useless advice that doesn't work in practice. As witnessed by decades of failure, with the only thing turning the tide on the obesity epidemic on a population scale being GLP-1 drugs. > if there is no resistance, simply prescribing GLPs to average person may become a new normal. Probably not ideal, but until Western society decides to change from the ground up it's better than the alternative which showed literally nothing but failure. One is something that works, the other is something that will take multiple generations to correct.
    - faangguyindia 4mo ago
      >Because it's useless advice that doesn't work in practice. As witnessed by decades of failure, with the only thing turning the tide on the obesity epidemic on a population scale being GLP-1 drugs. I think you are looking at research on obese people but applying it to average people who are simply overweight.
  - 4mo ago

by 9x39 4mo ago

JumpCrisscross 4mo ago

> dislike the personal responsibility angle I dislike the rejection of evidence. These drugs solve a problem. Preaching personal responsibility does not. In that way it almost reminds me of drug prohibition and abstinence-only rhetoric.

9x39 4mo ago
The evidence of where their fat stores came from?
- JumpCrisscross 4mo ago
  > evidence of where their fat stores came from? Yes. Specifically, how basal metabolism is not a consciously-controlled rate that modifies itself against diet and exercise to the point that in some people with serious metabolic syndrome it may be impossible for them to lose weight through diet and exercise without suffering nutritional shortfalls. Also, the clinical evidence around what works for people losing weight and getting healthier and what doesn’t. Like, I get we have a powerful fast-food and sugary-drinks lobby in America, but wow is it wild seeing people get uppity about third parties’ private healthcare decisions like this.
  - faangguyindia 4mo ago
    >Yes. Specifically, how basal metabolism is not a consciously-controlled rate that modifies itself against diet and exercise to the point that in some people with serious metabolic syndrome it may be impossible for them to lose weight through diet and exercise without suffering nutritional shortfalls. The average person does not understand how weight loss works; many people do not know the concept of maintenance calories, and don't know how calorie surplus or deficit works. Simply putting them on drugs for life isn't a solution. The average person does not have metabolic syndrome, yet the average person is increasingly becoming obese or perhaps already is obese in many countries.
    - crooked-v 4mo ago
      > Simply putting them on drugs for life isn't a solution. Plenty of people are on drugs for life for a variety of things that have less health impact than being overweight.
    - ben_w 4mo ago
      > Simply putting them on drugs for life isn't a solution. It literally is "a" solution. The questions should be: is it the best solution that currently exists? And is it the best that can exist? It may be that widespread availability of weight loss drugs that actually work ends the economic incentives to promote foods which themselves promote over-eating. Or it may be that it triggers an arms race with food manufacturers seeking out things that override the weight loss drugs. Or there may be negative side-effects we have yet to learn about, like there have been for so many other things that previously seemed amazing or miraculous.
  - s1artibartfast 4mo ago
    Third party private healthcare decisions are almost non-existant in the US due to the payment systems. People are on the hook for the decisions of others either through their premium, taxes, or both. Of course, this is non-central and rarely the concern people present. That said, 2026 US GLP-1 healthcare sales projections run between 60 and 100 billion [1]. it will be interesting to see if these miricle drugs can really provide that much benefit/offset that much cost. For comparison, Medicare part D is ~150 billion in its entirety. https://evolvancemarketresearch.com/reports/glp-1-weight-loss-drug-market/ https://evolvancemarketresearch.com/reports/glp-1-weight-los...
    - JumpCrisscross 4mo ago
      > Third party private healthcare decisions are almost non-existant in the US due to the payment systems The payment part is almost entirely pushing against GLP-1 agonists. Nobody has a long-term financial stake in patient costs to care that lifetime costs will likely be lower; insurers are just looking at the next couple years against expected churn. Another cost of tying health insurance to employment.

phil21 4mo ago

Who is lying? I was fat because I ate too much. Why I ate too much is uninteresting to me. I also don’t have some moral hang up over it. Give me that easy button all day long so I can focus on shit in my life that actually matters. If it makes someone feel better about themselves to believe in woo-woo science that violates the laws of physics and ascribe magical properties to GLPs, why do you care?

faangguyindia 4mo ago
>If it makes someone feel better about themselves to believe in woo-woo science that violates the laws of physics and ascribe magical properties to GLPs, why do you care? Why we should not care about putting people on drug who do can benefit from making lifestyle changes, being less sedentary and leaning about maintenance calories and how calorie surplus and deficit works? if there is no resistance, simply prescribing GLPs to average person may become a new normal.
- phil21 4mo ago
  > being less sedentary and leaning about maintenance calories and how calorie surplus and deficit works? Because it's useless advice that doesn't work in practice. As witnessed by decades of failure, with the only thing turning the tide on the obesity epidemic on a population scale being GLP-1 drugs. > if there is no resistance, simply prescribing GLPs to average person may become a new normal. Probably not ideal, but until Western society decides to change from the ground up it's better than the alternative which showed literally nothing but failure. One is something that works, the other is something that will take multiple generations to correct.
  - faangguyindia 4mo ago
    >Because it's useless advice that doesn't work in practice. As witnessed by decades of failure, with the only thing turning the tide on the obesity epidemic on a population scale being GLP-1 drugs. I think you are looking at research on obese people but applying it to average people who are simply overweight.
- 4mo ago