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The article title claims causality. The article body says the researchers didn't claim causality: The review, conducted by researchers from four UK universit

The article title claims causality. The article body says the researchers didn't claim causality: The review, conducted by researchers from four UK universities known as the Action on Digital Device Immersive Conditions Team, did not establish causal links between screen use and specific developmental conditions.

pmarreck 4mo ago
That's a problem because "using a screen as a babysitter" likely correlates with overworked poorer parents and thus a whole host of other developmental problems
- thatfrenchguy 4mo ago
  Even for upper middle class parents, "using a screen as a babysitter" just means you're more stressed and have less hands around. My kiddo has not seen a screen at the age of 2, but that's just because he has two parents at home at 5pm everyday.
  - pmarreck 4mo ago
    I made the error of wasting my time (ahem... it was fun while it lasted, at least) not having a kid until I turned 49... which meant our parents were too elderly (or dead) to help (my mom had me at 35) in any significant capacity, and the rest of my relatives (as it just so happened) already had plans to move away to FL before he was conceived. This has resulted in so much stress (especially in the 3's and 4's, because he still doesn't sleep through the night in his own goddamn bed) that I arguably lost a job from it... 50+ year old bodies are simply not well-capable of handling toddlers for the more-than-fulltime-weekly hours that they require I'm sure there are fringe benefits though but damn
    - dempedempe 4mo ago
      I don't think child rearing is supposed to be as difficult as modern society makes it. As you pointed out, you don't have a lot of help in raising your kid. You're expected to do it mostly with your partner (or god forbid alone). They've done some studies of hunter gather tribes to determine who handled babies the most. Turns out the kids' actual parents only handled the kids for about half the time (I think even a little less)! The term for it is "alloparenting". Evolution did not prime us for this level of child care. Good luck to you!
      - rationalist 4mo ago
        Even without going that far back, I imagine it was easier when parents kicked the kids out of the house and told them not to come back until dinner time.
        graemep 4mo ago
        > Even without going that far back, I imagine it was easier when parents kicked the kids out of the house and told them not to come back until dinner time. Did people ever do that with under-twos? Or under-fives? The big difference in more recent times was community and extended family help, and at least one parent having more time at home.
        amanaplanacanal 4mo ago
        Evidently there was quite a bit of handwringing in the 1950s that the "nuclear family" was bad for children and would lead to more divorce, since there were no longer grandparents and aunts and uncles around to help with childrearing.
        graemep 4mo ago
        Interesting. If so, they were right.
        pmarreck 4mo ago
        They were not wrong. I'm EXTREMELY jealous of my partner's older cousins who are now grandparents and specifically stipulate that their kids drop their grandkids off at their house every other weekend (!!!!) so that they can devote it to themselves. If that's not a good-marriage hack, then I don't know what is! And their parents KNEW it! Because when that's NOT happening, the weekends are almost 100% kid-focused. It is absolutely overwhelming, even with breaks here and there.
        jdsnape 4mo ago
        I don’t have hard evidence, but when I was a kid I enjoyed the children’s book ‘Five children and it’, written ~1900 The children cart their two year old sibling around with them everywhere (sans parents) and it’s totally unremarkable.
    - graemep 4mo ago
      That stage does not last very long and kids require a lot less attention as they get older. if you are still at that stage I imagine its tough, but it will get a lot easier pretty soon and it is definitely worth it.
- andai 4mo ago
  And banning screens for the first several decades of your child's life correlates with being a billionaire.
SilverElfin 4mo ago
This happens a lot in mainstream science and journalism. Another famous example is the often misquoted study (from McKinsey?) about DEI improving company results. The authors didn’t claim causality, since the most likely explanation is just that already large companies were more likely to adopt policies that discriminate based on race or gender, simply to keep up with trends. But virtually all news articles and company policies mistakenly referenced the study as if it had established causality.
sfn42 4mo ago
The ADDICT, nice
Fire-Dragon-DoL 4mo ago
I don't like the screen time generalization either. What about watching a tv show with a parent explaining? What about trying a videogame with a controller on an actual game console, experiencing remote controlling something in a screen (Spoiler alert: amazing results, I have a video with my daughter shocked at age 2). Smartphones used as a babysitter with a f2p game is probably garbage time
- y0eswddl 4mo ago
  the guidance in TFA addresses this
SiempreViernes 4mo ago
> The article title claims causality. Maybe they edited the title since you saw it, but currently there's no claims of causation unless you think "can" and "will" are synonyms.
- lesam 4mo ago
  'can damage' means 'sometimes causal'. If there's no causal link, they should say 'associated with' or 'correlated with'.

pmarreck 4mo ago

That's a problem because "using a screen as a babysitter" likely correlates with overworked poorer parents and thus a whole host of other developmental problems

thatfrenchguy 4mo ago
Even for upper middle class parents, "using a screen as a babysitter" just means you're more stressed and have less hands around. My kiddo has not seen a screen at the age of 2, but that's just because he has two parents at home at 5pm everyday.
- pmarreck 4mo ago
  I made the error of wasting my time (ahem... it was fun while it lasted, at least) not having a kid until I turned 49... which meant our parents were too elderly (or dead) to help (my mom had me at 35) in any significant capacity, and the rest of my relatives (as it just so happened) already had plans to move away to FL before he was conceived. This has resulted in so much stress (especially in the 3's and 4's, because he still doesn't sleep through the night in his own goddamn bed) that I arguably lost a job from it... 50+ year old bodies are simply not well-capable of handling toddlers for the more-than-fulltime-weekly hours that they require I'm sure there are fringe benefits though but damn
  - dempedempe 4mo ago
    I don't think child rearing is supposed to be as difficult as modern society makes it. As you pointed out, you don't have a lot of help in raising your kid. You're expected to do it mostly with your partner (or god forbid alone). They've done some studies of hunter gather tribes to determine who handled babies the most. Turns out the kids' actual parents only handled the kids for about half the time (I think even a little less)! The term for it is "alloparenting". Evolution did not prime us for this level of child care. Good luck to you!
    - rationalist 4mo ago
      Even without going that far back, I imagine it was easier when parents kicked the kids out of the house and told them not to come back until dinner time.
      - graemep 4mo ago
        > Even without going that far back, I imagine it was easier when parents kicked the kids out of the house and told them not to come back until dinner time. Did people ever do that with under-twos? Or under-fives? The big difference in more recent times was community and extended family help, and at least one parent having more time at home.
        amanaplanacanal 4mo ago
        Evidently there was quite a bit of handwringing in the 1950s that the "nuclear family" was bad for children and would lead to more divorce, since there were no longer grandparents and aunts and uncles around to help with childrearing.
        graemep 4mo ago
        Interesting. If so, they were right.
        pmarreck 4mo ago
        They were not wrong. I'm EXTREMELY jealous of my partner's older cousins who are now grandparents and specifically stipulate that their kids drop their grandkids off at their house every other weekend (!!!!) so that they can devote it to themselves. If that's not a good-marriage hack, then I don't know what is! And their parents KNEW it! Because when that's NOT happening, the weekends are almost 100% kid-focused. It is absolutely overwhelming, even with breaks here and there.
        jdsnape 4mo ago
        I don’t have hard evidence, but when I was a kid I enjoyed the children’s book ‘Five children and it’, written ~1900 The children cart their two year old sibling around with them everywhere (sans parents) and it’s totally unremarkable.
  - graemep 4mo ago
    That stage does not last very long and kids require a lot less attention as they get older. if you are still at that stage I imagine its tough, but it will get a lot easier pretty soon and it is definitely worth it.
andai 4mo ago
And banning screens for the first several decades of your child's life correlates with being a billionaire.

SilverElfin 4mo ago

This happens a lot in mainstream science and journalism. Another famous example is the often misquoted study (from McKinsey?) about DEI improving company results. The authors didn’t claim causality, since the most likely explanation is just that already large companies were more likely to adopt policies that discriminate based on race or gender, simply to keep up with trends. But virtually all news articles and company policies mistakenly referenced the study as if it had established causality.

sfn42 4mo ago

The ADDICT, nice

Fire-Dragon-DoL 4mo ago

I don't like the screen time generalization either. What about watching a tv show with a parent explaining? What about trying a videogame with a controller on an actual game console, experiencing remote controlling something in a screen (Spoiler alert: amazing results, I have a video with my daughter shocked at age 2). Smartphones used as a babysitter with a f2p game is probably garbage time

y0eswddl 4mo ago
the guidance in TFA addresses this

SiempreViernes 4mo ago

> The article title claims causality. Maybe they edited the title since you saw it, but currently there's no claims of causation unless you think "can" and "will" are synonyms.

lesam 4mo ago
'can damage' means 'sometimes causal'. If there's no causal link, they should say 'associated with' or 'correlated with'.