4 ms·

They're just so handy! I do think LLMs tend to use them in a specific way, though. So maybe tweaking your usage (ex. no spaces around them) or using a technica

by jackp96 3mo ago

They're just so handy! I do think LLMs tend to use them in a specific way, though. So maybe tweaking your usage (ex. no spaces around them) or using a technically incorrect en-dash might offer the desired effect while subtly signaling that your message isn't AI-generated. I still use them — mostly for pauses — but I'd like to think my voice sounds distinct enough from an AI that people can tell.

Syntonicles 3mo ago
I for one am striving for clarity and couldn't care less about being confused with AI. However I've only ever used regular dashes. How do you type an em-dash? Is it OS specific? I've taken to using Emacs insert-char with a list of frequently used ones in my scratch buffer. My memory for Unicode is unreliable.
- xp84 3mo ago
  Macs have a native way to do dashes: option- hyphen for en-dash and option shift hyphen for em-dash. On Windows there are some application-specific ways that make sense, e.g. in Office, but outside that you’re on your own and have to use the “hold alt and type the character codes” method! Or charmap.
- topgrain2 3mo ago
  Keyboard layout specific. Macs with their default English layout use “option-shift-dash” which is really easy to remember (and relatively discoverable, as such things go) which is why using proper m-dashes (not just double-dashes) used to be a strong indicator a poster was using a Mac, before LLMs took the character over. On iOS you type it by pressing dash and holding until alternative options come up, same way you type e.g. accented characters.
  - alexfringes 3mo ago
    You can also just type two "-" minuses on iOS. So "--" will auto-convert to "—".
  - redwall_hp 3mo ago
    Macs have two possible ways. If you have key repeat enabled, option+shift+dash. Some newer Mac users may have the mode on where holding a key pops up an iOS-style bubble of alternate options, in which case they will just hold hyphen.
    - TylerE 3mo ago
      That "new" feature has been around since at least 2011.
- feanaro 3mo ago
  > How do you type an em-dash? Is it OS specific? On Linux X11 at least, you can enable the Compose key and then press `<Compose>---` which results in — and `<Compose>--.` which gives you –
  - aendruk 3mo ago
    “⎄---”
- eichin 3mo ago
  In emacs, c-x 8 RET prompts you for unicode character names (or hex) so for rare use you can just spell it out. There's also C-x 8 _ m for em dash and C-x 8 _ n for en dash. (Hit c-x 8 c-h to get a full list of those bindings, like any normal secondary map - they're about as idiosyncratic as the XCompose bindings, but you might find some of them "stick" in your head better (I personally like "C-x 8 1 / 2" better than "Compose 1 2" even if it's a lot more typing...)
  - wafflemaker 3mo ago
    >In emacs, c-x 8 RET prompts you for unicode character names (or hex)[...] Which is super useful for hard space - non line-breaking space - so that one letter words don't appear at the end of lines.
    - Syntonicles 3mo ago
      Huh, I always wondered what that was for...
  - Syntonicles 3mo ago
    Ooh, thanks! I blindly type c-x 8 RET, then finding myself stumbling through 9 different entries for Phi, but I hadn't explored the prefixes. I just realized I could create a custom which-key entry-point with my favorites in a prefix. Also just learned about compose key apparently, and I noticed that I can program this split keyboard I'm using to turn that into a chord, anywhere! Then an LLM told me that I can 3D print my own custom keyboard with 32 programmable layers. Everything is an infinite rabbit hole these days, how wild.
rplnt 3mo ago
I've only ever been using "regular" dash, a minus, for that. How do you even type yours? If I ever needed differently-sized dashes (and I don't know the difference between them) I always used wiki to copy them. (disclaimer: I feel like this obsession with dashes is special to native English speakers, which I'm obviously not)
- Macha 3mo ago
  Depends on your OS. Mac is the easiest, it's just ---, Linux depends on your distro, if it uses KDE, it's <right-win>--- —. Windows is a little awkward, I think you need <right win>+the code point.
  - rplnt 3mo ago
    I have mac, typed this --- again --- and nothing? Layout says U.S. edit: another comment gave a mac shortcut – — - <--- one of these might be it
    - L3viathan 3mo ago
      Option-Shift-Hyphen. Just --- only works when you have the text replacement thing on (the same thing that turns (C) into ©).
- tyre 3mo ago
  silly specific: the minus sign is a separate character. The dash equivalent is the en dash (–), versus the larger em (—) and smaller hyphen (-). The en dash is also used in things like scores (3–2 Turkey), votes (the bill passed 58–42), or connecting words where the second part is longer than one word (the Australia–New Zealand alliance.) You can remember the latter as, "a hyphen isn't big and strong enough to hold on to more than one word. If you're on a mac, pressing Option+- is the en dash and Option+Shift+- is the em dash.
  - BlaDeKke 3mo ago
    My first language is Dutch (Flemish). I didn’t even know there were three different dashes. The em dash is something I didn’t know exist, or were used, until llms came about. The hyphen is something we use when we make a list, that’s just the minus symbol right? So em dashes are for pauses or highlighting things I guess? The en dash you explained in your reaction. Is there any other use for the hyphen except for making lists?

by jackp96 3mo ago

Syntonicles 3mo ago

I for one am striving for clarity and couldn't care less about being confused with AI. However I've only ever used regular dashes. How do you type an em-dash? Is it OS specific? I've taken to using Emacs insert-char with a list of frequently used ones in my scratch buffer. My memory for Unicode is unreliable.

xp84 3mo ago
Macs have a native way to do dashes: option- hyphen for en-dash and option shift hyphen for em-dash. On Windows there are some application-specific ways that make sense, e.g. in Office, but outside that you’re on your own and have to use the “hold alt and type the character codes” method! Or charmap.
topgrain2 3mo ago
Keyboard layout specific. Macs with their default English layout use “option-shift-dash” which is really easy to remember (and relatively discoverable, as such things go) which is why using proper m-dashes (not just double-dashes) used to be a strong indicator a poster was using a Mac, before LLMs took the character over. On iOS you type it by pressing dash and holding until alternative options come up, same way you type e.g. accented characters.
- alexfringes 3mo ago
  You can also just type two "-" minuses on iOS. So "--" will auto-convert to "—".
- redwall_hp 3mo ago
  Macs have two possible ways. If you have key repeat enabled, option+shift+dash. Some newer Mac users may have the mode on where holding a key pops up an iOS-style bubble of alternate options, in which case they will just hold hyphen.
  - TylerE 3mo ago
    That "new" feature has been around since at least 2011.
feanaro 3mo ago
> How do you type an em-dash? Is it OS specific? On Linux X11 at least, you can enable the Compose key and then press `<Compose>---` which results in — and `<Compose>--.` which gives you –
- aendruk 3mo ago
  “⎄---”
eichin 3mo ago
In emacs, c-x 8 RET prompts you for unicode character names (or hex) so for rare use you can just spell it out. There's also C-x 8 _ m for em dash and C-x 8 _ n for en dash. (Hit c-x 8 c-h to get a full list of those bindings, like any normal secondary map - they're about as idiosyncratic as the XCompose bindings, but you might find some of them "stick" in your head better (I personally like "C-x 8 1 / 2" better than "Compose 1 2" even if it's a lot more typing...)
- wafflemaker 3mo ago
  >In emacs, c-x 8 RET prompts you for unicode character names (or hex)[...] Which is super useful for hard space - non line-breaking space - so that one letter words don't appear at the end of lines.
  - Syntonicles 3mo ago
    Huh, I always wondered what that was for...
- Syntonicles 3mo ago
  Ooh, thanks! I blindly type c-x 8 RET, then finding myself stumbling through 9 different entries for Phi, but I hadn't explored the prefixes. I just realized I could create a custom which-key entry-point with my favorites in a prefix. Also just learned about compose key apparently, and I noticed that I can program this split keyboard I'm using to turn that into a chord, anywhere! Then an LLM told me that I can 3D print my own custom keyboard with 32 programmable layers. Everything is an infinite rabbit hole these days, how wild.

rplnt 3mo ago

I've only ever been using "regular" dash, a minus, for that. How do you even type yours? If I ever needed differently-sized dashes (and I don't know the difference between them) I always used wiki to copy them. (disclaimer: I feel like this obsession with dashes is special to native English speakers, which I'm obviously not)

Macha 3mo ago
Depends on your OS. Mac is the easiest, it's just ---, Linux depends on your distro, if it uses KDE, it's <right-win>--- —. Windows is a little awkward, I think you need <right win>+the code point.
- rplnt 3mo ago
  I have mac, typed this --- again --- and nothing? Layout says U.S. edit: another comment gave a mac shortcut – — - <--- one of these might be it
  - L3viathan 3mo ago
    Option-Shift-Hyphen. Just --- only works when you have the text replacement thing on (the same thing that turns (C) into ©).
tyre 3mo ago
silly specific: the minus sign is a separate character. The dash equivalent is the en dash (–), versus the larger em (—) and smaller hyphen (-). The en dash is also used in things like scores (3–2 Turkey), votes (the bill passed 58–42), or connecting words where the second part is longer than one word (the Australia–New Zealand alliance.) You can remember the latter as, "a hyphen isn't big and strong enough to hold on to more than one word. If you're on a mac, pressing Option+- is the en dash and Option+Shift+- is the em dash.
- BlaDeKke 3mo ago
  My first language is Dutch (Flemish). I didn’t even know there were three different dashes. The em dash is something I didn’t know exist, or were used, until llms came about. The hyphen is something we use when we make a list, that’s just the minus symbol right? So em dashes are for pauses or highlighting things I guess? The en dash you explained in your reaction. Is there any other use for the hyphen except for making lists?