4 ms·

> Taiwan, perhaps, but they're playing a long-term tactical game rather than a "invade the country we don't like this week" game. So one of the world's biggest

> Taiwan, perhaps, but they're playing a long-term tactical game rather than a "invade the country we don't like this week" game. So one of the world's biggest and most rapid military build-ups in history that is largely intended to give China the ability to seize a democratic country by force by 2027 over any US/Western efforts to protect it is OK because...it's "a long-term tactical game"? Note that China is not just menacing Taiwan. It's constantly harassing Japan, the Philippines and Vietnam too. Other countries in the region are worried because they understand that if China takes Taiwan successfully, it's not likely to stop there and become a good, peaceful neighbor. The US, under Trump, is a foreign policy disaster. That doesn't mean that China, with a seemingly more emotionally stable dictator at the helm, is any less dangerous. > They might get some info on you, but the data brokers in the west will sell a lot more details about you, pre-categorized and all. With all due respect, you're really naive about how China operates. https://www.wired.com/story/chineses-surveillance-state-is-selling-citizens-data-as-a-side-hustle/ https://www.wired.com/story/chineses-surveillance-state-is-s...

cute_boi 4mo ago
China has a economy which they can't risk. People keep saying same thing for Russia, but they haven't been able to defeat even Ukraine. At this point I am afraid of US government than China...
- ElProlactin 4mo ago
  > China has a economy which they can't risk. People keep saying same thing for Russia, but they haven't been able to defeat even Ukraine. Huh? Russia invaded Ukraine, at significant economic cost, and hundreds of thousands of people have died. > At this point I am afraid of US government than China... Just as people can walk and chew gum at the same time, you can have reason to be concerned about more than one country at a time.
throw827372 4mo ago
China has been "going after" Taiwan for 80 years, so yeah, they are playing the long game. Wake me up when they start drone striking neighboring country's fishermen and accusing them of carrying drugs.
- ElProlactin 4mo ago
  Throwaway account to leave a single comment minimizing the Chinese threat against Taiwan? Nah, nothing suspect about that. https://cset.georgetown.edu/article/a-different-kind-of-army-the-militarization-of-chinas-internet-trolls/ https://cset.georgetown.edu/article/a-different-kind-of-army...
  - johnisgood 4mo ago
    Yeah, because criticizing the US, and/or making China look good can get you on certain lists. Maybe that is the reason? FWIW I do not buy into the "China bad, we good" narrative either. The US has done really fucked up things, bombed countries for freedom, there has been recent events as well. I do not even think they were ever the "good guys" they thought they are. In Hollywood movies, sure, but in reality? Nah.
    - ElProlactin 4mo ago
      > Yeah, because criticizing the US, and/or making China look good can get you on certain lists. What lists? And what happens to people on those lists? > Maybe that is the reason? If you think people are signing up throwaway accounts to post replies to random comments, making no substantive or even controversial statements, I have a bridge to sell you. In the US or China. Take your pick. > FWIW I do not buy into the "China bad, we good" narrative either. I never presented that narrative. > The US has done really fucked up things, bombed countries for freedom, there has been recent events as well. I do not even think they were ever the "good guys" they thought they are. In Hollywood movies, sure, but in reality? Nah. I'd agree. But what does this have to do with an analysis of China?
      - deleted 4mo ago
        [deleted]
      - johnisgood 4mo ago
        My previous comment got flagged about a minute after I posted it to you. It was three paragraphs and it argued a position without any abuse in it. It is probably someone in this thread who hit flag instead of replying because they did not like what I said. Which is suspicious, and it is also the thing I was already talking about. The throwaway shill insinuation earlier was a way to avoid engaging with a disagreement, and a flag does the same job. Welp.
devsda 4mo ago
> The US, under Trump, is a foreign policy disaster. This administration only removed the blinds on what has always been an adversarial policy, allies included. If given a choice you may choose US or Chinese models for whatever reason it's fine, but there's no need to fall into the delusion that it is for moral reasons or obligations.
well_ackshually 4mo ago
> The US, under Trump, is a foreign policy disaster. The US, under every single president has been an imperialistic threat to half the world. From imposing embargoes, to overthrowing governments and supporting dictators and genocides all over the world. Half the world hates you, and the other half has begrudgingly no choice but to half assedly support the greatest threat that the world has ever known, a military in a trenchcoat made to protect their dominance over world trade. So, respectfully, fuck off. The Chinese are not a worse problem than you are, merely a different one. The NSA already has all my data, no reason the MSS shouldn't get a piece of that data too.
- ElProlactin 4mo ago
  I always find it strange to encounter people whose disposition to one violent imperial power is to welcome...more violent imperial powers. Strange form of sadomasochism.
  - well_ackshually 4mo ago
    No, you're just looking forward to being the only violent imperial power and to rule unopposed. the existence of another violent imperial power keeps you on a leash. It's not the best case scenario, but an unfettered and unrestricted united states spells doom for the world. China also happens to be the one that's electrifying the world, producing and improving batteries, solar panels, has a long term plan while the US is going hurr durr VC money printing for smart dog food.
    - ElProlactin 4mo ago
      > No, you're just looking forward to being the only violent imperial power and to rule unopposed. You'd probably be a much more content person if you stopped going around the internet assuming things about random strangers on the basis of their nationalities.
      - wyrdcurt 4mo ago
        Elsewhere in this thread you insinuated that someone is a Chinese propagandist for pointing out that the US is actually aggressive in ways China is not. If you're going to assume other people have ulterior agendas without evidence, you can't be surprised when people make assumptions about you in turn.
basisword 4mo ago
You're judging China based on some future thing that may happen. The US has been bombing Iran for the last year impacting the entire global economy. I think I'll judge based on actions.
- ElProlactin 4mo ago
  Are you able to walk and chew gum at the same time? Are you capable of finding the actions of two nations deplorable at the same time? Like, can you not find the US bombing of Iran and, say, China's genocide against the Uyghurs to be a terrible thing at the same time? Is there something preventing you from being concerned about Trump's threats to take Canada or Greenland and being concerned about China's planning and threats to seize Taiwan by force at the same time?

cute_boi 4mo ago

China has a economy which they can't risk. People keep saying same thing for Russia, but they haven't been able to defeat even Ukraine. At this point I am afraid of US government than China...

ElProlactin 4mo ago
> China has a economy which they can't risk. People keep saying same thing for Russia, but they haven't been able to defeat even Ukraine. Huh? Russia invaded Ukraine, at significant economic cost, and hundreds of thousands of people have died. > At this point I am afraid of US government than China... Just as people can walk and chew gum at the same time, you can have reason to be concerned about more than one country at a time.

throw827372 4mo ago

China has been "going after" Taiwan for 80 years, so yeah, they are playing the long game. Wake me up when they start drone striking neighboring country's fishermen and accusing them of carrying drugs.

ElProlactin 4mo ago
Throwaway account to leave a single comment minimizing the Chinese threat against Taiwan? Nah, nothing suspect about that. https://cset.georgetown.edu/article/a-different-kind-of-army-the-militarization-of-chinas-internet-trolls/ https://cset.georgetown.edu/article/a-different-kind-of-army...
- johnisgood 4mo ago
  Yeah, because criticizing the US, and/or making China look good can get you on certain lists. Maybe that is the reason? FWIW I do not buy into the "China bad, we good" narrative either. The US has done really fucked up things, bombed countries for freedom, there has been recent events as well. I do not even think they were ever the "good guys" they thought they are. In Hollywood movies, sure, but in reality? Nah.
  - ElProlactin 4mo ago
    > Yeah, because criticizing the US, and/or making China look good can get you on certain lists. What lists? And what happens to people on those lists? > Maybe that is the reason? If you think people are signing up throwaway accounts to post replies to random comments, making no substantive or even controversial statements, I have a bridge to sell you. In the US or China. Take your pick. > FWIW I do not buy into the "China bad, we good" narrative either. I never presented that narrative. > The US has done really fucked up things, bombed countries for freedom, there has been recent events as well. I do not even think they were ever the "good guys" they thought they are. In Hollywood movies, sure, but in reality? Nah. I'd agree. But what does this have to do with an analysis of China?
    - deleted 4mo ago
      [deleted]
    - johnisgood 4mo ago
      My previous comment got flagged about a minute after I posted it to you. It was three paragraphs and it argued a position without any abuse in it. It is probably someone in this thread who hit flag instead of replying because they did not like what I said. Which is suspicious, and it is also the thing I was already talking about. The throwaway shill insinuation earlier was a way to avoid engaging with a disagreement, and a flag does the same job. Welp.

devsda 4mo ago

> The US, under Trump, is a foreign policy disaster. This administration only removed the blinds on what has always been an adversarial policy, allies included. If given a choice you may choose US or Chinese models for whatever reason it's fine, but there's no need to fall into the delusion that it is for moral reasons or obligations.

well_ackshually 4mo ago

> The US, under Trump, is a foreign policy disaster. The US, under every single president has been an imperialistic threat to half the world. From imposing embargoes, to overthrowing governments and supporting dictators and genocides all over the world. Half the world hates you, and the other half has begrudgingly no choice but to half assedly support the greatest threat that the world has ever known, a military in a trenchcoat made to protect their dominance over world trade. So, respectfully, fuck off. The Chinese are not a worse problem than you are, merely a different one. The NSA already has all my data, no reason the MSS shouldn't get a piece of that data too.

ElProlactin 4mo ago
I always find it strange to encounter people whose disposition to one violent imperial power is to welcome...more violent imperial powers. Strange form of sadomasochism.
- well_ackshually 4mo ago
  No, you're just looking forward to being the only violent imperial power and to rule unopposed. the existence of another violent imperial power keeps you on a leash. It's not the best case scenario, but an unfettered and unrestricted united states spells doom for the world. China also happens to be the one that's electrifying the world, producing and improving batteries, solar panels, has a long term plan while the US is going hurr durr VC money printing for smart dog food.
  - ElProlactin 4mo ago
    > No, you're just looking forward to being the only violent imperial power and to rule unopposed. You'd probably be a much more content person if you stopped going around the internet assuming things about random strangers on the basis of their nationalities.
    - wyrdcurt 4mo ago
      Elsewhere in this thread you insinuated that someone is a Chinese propagandist for pointing out that the US is actually aggressive in ways China is not. If you're going to assume other people have ulterior agendas without evidence, you can't be surprised when people make assumptions about you in turn.

basisword 4mo ago

You're judging China based on some future thing that may happen. The US has been bombing Iran for the last year impacting the entire global economy. I think I'll judge based on actions.

ElProlactin 4mo ago
Are you able to walk and chew gum at the same time? Are you capable of finding the actions of two nations deplorable at the same time? Like, can you not find the US bombing of Iran and, say, China's genocide against the Uyghurs to be a terrible thing at the same time? Is there something preventing you from being concerned about Trump's threats to take Canada or Greenland and being concerned about China's planning and threats to seize Taiwan by force at the same time?