4 ms·

You can control what ENTERS your borders, not what happens outside of them. You are free to cut the cables, but not to dictate to those outside your house how t

You can control what ENTERS your borders, not what happens outside of them. You are free to cut the cables, but not to dictate to those outside your house how to live on the other end of those cables. Else we'll all be living under the union of the rules of everyone. You sure you want that? Iran bans a lot of things you might like, as does china, and russia, and usa.

vrganj 4mo ago
As soon as you send that data into my country, it is happening inside my borders. You can buy magic mushrooms semi legally in the Netherlands. Doesn't mean you won't get in trouble if you send them from the Netherlands to another country.
- dmitrygr 4mo ago
  So you DO want iran controlling what your LLC does if it is internet connected in any way (which everything is now).
  - vrganj 4mo ago
    Or they could just not serve Iran? But yeah, if you operate in a country you should probably follow their laws. I don't see how that's controversial
    - dmitrygr 4mo ago
      In the days of the internet "operate in a country" == "exist". Eg: [1] UK has tried to enforce its laws even onto organizations who literally exist in USA only. Their argument: you exist, internet exists, so you are still subject to us. So tell me, how can one exist today and not "operate" in every country where internet exists. And once you see that there is no way, how do you propose your logic for regulation to work, other than by everyone being subject to everyone's rules? [1] https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c624330lg1ko https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c624330lg1ko Further suggested reading: https://storage.courtlistener.com/recap/gov.uscourts.dcd.284218/gov.uscourts.dcd.284218.10.0.pdf https://storage.courtlistener.com/recap/gov.uscourts.dcd.284...
      - vrganj 4mo ago
        I couldn't find anything about VPNs in the link you shared. If that is the case, I disagree with it. But if you serve the UK market, you gotta follow UK law. That doesn't seem unreasonable, does it? I see you removed the VPN reference in your edit and it made your argument quite a bit weaker imo. Just because 4Chan is in the US, doesn't mean they don't send their data to the UK. As soon as they do, they are subject to UK law. Quite simple. If they don't want to be, they can stop sending their data there. See also the magic mushroom parallel from earlier. > So tell me, how can one exist today and not "operate" in every country where internet exists You could IP block by geo for example? Seems pretty straightforward.
        dmitrygr 4mo ago
        So I have to actively work and expend energy to not be subject to some random whim? curious view.
        vrganj 4mo ago
        It's not "some random whim", it is the law. And yes, one has to work and expend energy to follow the law frequently. I did my taxes not too long ago. Also got my drivers license before getting on the road. Or in another, more close parallel: You do in fact have to put a fence around your construction site so you're not liable if somebody walks there and hurts themselves.
        iso1631 4mo ago
        I've never worried about North Korean law because I've never been to North Korea, and I don't do business with North Korea I do work about following Thai law because I've been to Thailand, and hope to go again I do work about following US law because the US has a history of pursuing US law breakers - people who have never even been to the US - beyond its borders
      - hdgvhicv 4mo ago
        America doesn’t just fine businesses doing businesses in American and breaking the law. It tries to extradite people who have never been to America to torture them https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gary_McKinnon https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gary_McKinnon https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kim_Dotcom https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kim_Dotcom https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Khalid_El-Masri https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Khalid_El-Masri
  - iso1631 4mo ago
    Don't do business with Iran, then you don't have a problem If you do do business with Iran, you have to follow Iranian law

vrganj 4mo ago

As soon as you send that data into my country, it is happening inside my borders. You can buy magic mushrooms semi legally in the Netherlands. Doesn't mean you won't get in trouble if you send them from the Netherlands to another country.

dmitrygr 4mo ago
So you DO want iran controlling what your LLC does if it is internet connected in any way (which everything is now).
- vrganj 4mo ago
  Or they could just not serve Iran? But yeah, if you operate in a country you should probably follow their laws. I don't see how that's controversial
  - dmitrygr 4mo ago
    In the days of the internet "operate in a country" == "exist". Eg: [1] UK has tried to enforce its laws even onto organizations who literally exist in USA only. Their argument: you exist, internet exists, so you are still subject to us. So tell me, how can one exist today and not "operate" in every country where internet exists. And once you see that there is no way, how do you propose your logic for regulation to work, other than by everyone being subject to everyone's rules? [1] https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c624330lg1ko https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c624330lg1ko Further suggested reading: https://storage.courtlistener.com/recap/gov.uscourts.dcd.284218/gov.uscourts.dcd.284218.10.0.pdf https://storage.courtlistener.com/recap/gov.uscourts.dcd.284...
    - vrganj 4mo ago
      I couldn't find anything about VPNs in the link you shared. If that is the case, I disagree with it. But if you serve the UK market, you gotta follow UK law. That doesn't seem unreasonable, does it? I see you removed the VPN reference in your edit and it made your argument quite a bit weaker imo. Just because 4Chan is in the US, doesn't mean they don't send their data to the UK. As soon as they do, they are subject to UK law. Quite simple. If they don't want to be, they can stop sending their data there. See also the magic mushroom parallel from earlier. > So tell me, how can one exist today and not "operate" in every country where internet exists You could IP block by geo for example? Seems pretty straightforward.
      - dmitrygr 4mo ago
        So I have to actively work and expend energy to not be subject to some random whim? curious view.
        vrganj 4mo ago
        It's not "some random whim", it is the law. And yes, one has to work and expend energy to follow the law frequently. I did my taxes not too long ago. Also got my drivers license before getting on the road. Or in another, more close parallel: You do in fact have to put a fence around your construction site so you're not liable if somebody walks there and hurts themselves.
        iso1631 4mo ago
        I've never worried about North Korean law because I've never been to North Korea, and I don't do business with North Korea I do work about following Thai law because I've been to Thailand, and hope to go again I do work about following US law because the US has a history of pursuing US law breakers - people who have never even been to the US - beyond its borders
    - hdgvhicv 4mo ago
      America doesn’t just fine businesses doing businesses in American and breaking the law. It tries to extradite people who have never been to America to torture them https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gary_McKinnon https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gary_McKinnon https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kim_Dotcom https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kim_Dotcom https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Khalid_El-Masri https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Khalid_El-Masri
- iso1631 4mo ago
  Don't do business with Iran, then you don't have a problem If you do do business with Iran, you have to follow Iranian law